TDI Used Oil Lab Analyses Results & Discussions

[wjdell]

I thought your 2005 2.0 lt TDI engines used a 505.00 - which would have higher levels of Zinc, Mg and calcium. Look at your manual and see if there is a API CI4+ allowed. if so, you may want to give consideration to CJ4 which covers CI4+ oil. Try to find other UOA's of the same engine code and compare

 

[Bob_Fout]

WJ, 2005 2.0L TDIs are PDs. 505.01 only (per the book). Some have run API oils in Passats though.

 

[Dimitri16V]

time to pull the valve cover, you won't like what you find

 

[Sootman]

Latest UOA Still on 505.01 Elf Solaris 5w30

The sodium is coming down and will more as I found better source of biodiesel.

Any thoughts?

 

[wjdell]

Bob u are correct - was it 2004 the last to show API

 

[Bob_Fout]

Bob u are correct - was it 2004 the last to show API

2003 was the last year API oils were kosher (per the book). As soon as PDs hit our shores in 2004, it became 505.01 only, until the CRs came out.

 

[wjdell]

Also Tom are u not supposed to do 5k with 100 bio. IIRC many companys will say that a 50% reduction in oil life is common with 100% bio fuel. Chevron paper, and Amsoil

 

[wjdell]

sootman - 4,3 ppm TWM is good

 

[TomB]

Also Tom are u not supposed to do 5k with 100 bio. IIRC many companys will say that a 50% reduction in oil life is common with 100% bio fuel. Chevron paper, and Amsoil

Never heard of this recommendation in 7 years of using 100% BD.

These references to a 50% reduction may be due to oil dilution by BD associated with the newer post combustion fuel injections for the particle filters which these two vehicles do NOT have.

 

[TomB]

time to pull the valve cover, you won't like what you find

So I should have that extended warranty?

 

[wjdell]

TomB I found both papers and yes they say as much as 50% reduction in oil life using bio fuels. One paper 2 parts is from Chevron lubrication the other is from Amsoil tech paper TSB: MO-2006-05-04. Try a search LubricantsUniversity.com if your interested.

 

[TomB]

TomB I found both papers and yes they say as much as 50% reduction in oil life using bio fuels. One paper 2 parts is from Chevron lubrication the other is from Amsoil tech paper TSB: MO-2006-05-04. Try a search LubricantsUniversity.com if your interested.

Other than AMSOIL being ANTI BD is all their negative assumptions, here is the exact recommendation.

"AMSOIL Motor Oil extended drain interval recommendations
do NOT apply to vehicles using biodiesel
fuels at any mix ratios with petroleum diesel."

Here is the key phrase. 10K is VW recommended oil change interval.

"When using biodiesel fuels at any mix ratio, follow
the OEM recommended oil drain interval"

As well the testing does NOT show any BD dilution of the sample. Blackstone's test for this because I told them about the 100% usage. They have seen NO contamination as claimed by AMSOIL in their assumptions on 100% BD usage.

As well the 2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the post combustion injections and the particle filter does NOT show any dilution of the oil from 100% usage either based on ACTUAL testing of the oil.

 

[TomB]

time to pull the valve cover, you won't like what you find

Please explain what exactly you think I will find. I will take a look but want to know what you are expecting.

 

[TooSlick]

Sootman,

Last three tests are very consistent...the trace of Na and K doesn't seem to be causing any abnormal wear. In fact, Iron levels are on the low side for a PD engine. A check on TBN would be nice, but not absolutely necessary.

 

[Sloppy Snood]

Please explain what exactly you think I will find. I will take a look but want to know what you are expecting.

Camshaft and camshaft bearings.

 

[Sooch]

My oil change history is:
5K Dealer, during tandem pump recall (which they f'd up) so who knows
10K Motul 505.01 5W40
20K Motul 505.01 5W40
30K Motul 505.01 5W40
40K Elf Evolution 506.01 0W30 - Installed DG bypass filter (Now 6qts to full)
50K Elf Evolution 506.01 0W30
60K Elf Solaris LLX 507.00 5W30 - Replaced bypass filter
70K Mobil 1 TDT 5W40 - Replaced bypass filter
80K Mobil 1 TDT 5W40

I took a sample at the 70K change but either the USPS or the Amsoil test lab lost it, so I have no data. But, here is my data from the 80K change. How's this look for a PD?

 

[spiceredwagon]

Done with UOA's

My latest uoa shows similar results to the previous ones, but the magnetic drain plug tells a different story. When I ran Total 507 5w-30 the drain plug was loaded with iron flakes or chips actually looked worse than the magnetic plug on my Briggs and Scrap iron mower. Based on this latest uoa I decided I should break down and pay the $13.00 extra for the Mobil TDT at Walmart.
Well the magnetic drain plug just came out clean as a whistle from the UFA oil. I have never got it out so clean with any of the VAG oils, Total was the worst. I suspect the lab pulls some of these numbers out of their ass. From now on I will use the drain plug as the engines health gauge.
http://pics.tdiclub.com/showphoto.php?photo=58947&cat=516

 

[TornadoRed]

My latest uoa shows similar results to the previous ones, but the magnetic drain plug tells a different story. When I ran Total 507 5w-30 the drain plug was loaded with iron flakes or chips actually looked worse than the magnetic plug on my Briggs and Scrap iron mower. Based on this latest uoa I decided I should break down and pay the $13.00 extra for the Mobil TDT at Walmart.
Well the magnetic drain plug just came out clean as a whistle from the UFA oil. I have never got it out so clean with any of the VAG oils, Total was the worst. I suspect the lab pulls some of these numbers out of their ass. From now on I will use the drain plug as the engines health gauge.
http://pics.tdiclub.com/showphoto.php?photo=58947&cat=516

None of your test results were that bad, but the UFA Polar Plus 0w40 was pretty good. Why not stick with it for another 20k kilometers or so?

 

[hid3]

Where can I find more information about that UFA oil? Data sheet? Is this oil available in Europe?

 

[spiceredwagon]

Jerry UFA is the acronym for United Farmers of Alberta. If think the oil is made by Petro Canada. It will come up on this forum if you search it.
Now that I know how clean the magnet was I will use it again.

 

[Sootman]

Sootman,

Last three tests are very consistent...the trace of Na and K doesn't seem to be causing any abnormal wear. In fact, Iron levels are on the low side for a PD engine. A check on TBN would be nice, but not absolutely necessary.

Brain cramp, what does TBN stand for. I haven't had enough coffee yet!

Thanks for reviewing the sheet. I'm pleased with everything so far and will continue to keep an eye on my analysis's.

 

[Kriesel]

Brain cramp, what does TBN stand for. I haven't had enough coffee yet!

Thanks for reviewing the sheet. I'm pleased with everything so far and will continue to keep an eye on my analysis's.

Total Base Number: measures the amount of active additive left in the oil, basically the "life" of the oil left at the time of your sample.

 

[hid3]

Now that I know how clean the magnet was I will use it again.

I think that your magnet came out clean because you ran the oil in summer only. Could that be the reason? No *cold* starts, less wear and tear on the engine..

 

[leicaman]

WJ, 2005 2.0L TDIs are PDs. 505.01 only (per the book). Some have run API oils in Passats though.

Bob is completely correct. I still find it amazing how VW made this oil thing so dang confusing. If they would have made motors that would use regular synthetic diesel oil, we might not be spending so many electrons in this discourse.

 

[TornadoRed]

Jerry UFA is the acronym for United Farmers of Alberta. If think the oil is made by Petro Canada. It will come up on this forum if you search it.
Now that I know how clean the magnet was I will use it again.

I always thought UFA 0w40 was repackaged Esso XD-3 0w40 -- but at a lower price. If so then it is a true synthetic.

 

[Sootman]

Total Base Number: measures the amount of active additive left in the oil, basically the "life" of the oil left at the time of your sample.

Thanks...something new to learn. I can ask if the lab has a test for this and how much it costs the next time I send in a sample. If I get a result I'll post it.

 

[spiceredwagon]

I think that your magnet came out clean because you ran the oil in summer only. Could that be the reason? No *cold* starts, less wear and tear on the engine..

I plug it in whenever it is below 0°C, then the coolant starts out at 50°C. The cabin warms up quicker that way and its easier on the glow plugs.

 

[TomB]

Thanks...something new to learn. I can ask if the lab has a test for this and how much it costs the next time I send in a sample. If I get a result I'll post it.

Blackstone labs charges $10 extra for the TBN.

 

[TooSlick]

Spiceredwagon,

spectrographic analysis only measures dissolved metallic ions and solid particles < 5 microns. So in that respect it can be misleading....

TS

 

[dhdenney]

Spiceredwagon,

spectrographic analysis only measures dissolved metallic ions and solid particles < 5 microns. So in that respect it can be misleading....

TS

BUT if you have chunks bigger than 5 microns in the oil then can we call that damage and not wear? Then your days are numbered and you might not make it to your next UOA.