TDI Used Oil Lab Analyses Results & Discussions

[TooSlick]

Ski,
The TBN drops very slowly with 15 ppm, ULSD fuel, but it will still bottom out at some point. The TBN values from Blackstone Labs are generally a bit lower than from other oil analysis companies, but I'd still use a lower limit of 2.0. If you're testing through Oil Analyzers or AVLube, a lower cutoff of 3-4 is probably better in terms of best practices.
TS

 

[hid3]

But TDIers also need some viagra and cialis, why not to advertise? There are much ads where to buy oil, get TB done or rent a tool but there isn't an ad about how to have a nice sex!

 

[GoldJag]

Thanks

Thanks for your input guys. $32 was cheap insurance for my 1st 10K OCI. I came from 3k iffy lube standard. I needed some assurance. I will probably do a UOA at 20K.

 

[bobgolf2004]

Car: 2006 Jetta
Trans: DSG
Miles at sample: 40,000
Miles on sample 10,000
Duration: 7.5 months
Oil: Castrol SLX OE 5W-30
Make-up oil: 12 oz.
Main filter change at 30,000 mi

Car has been driven on Castrol SLX OE 5W-30 since new, with recommended oil change intervals. Car is stock except for engine heater. The results have been corrected based on Oil Analyzers re-analyzing the sample - results provided 9/18/2009.

Iron: 28
Chromium: 1
Nickel: 0
Aluminum: 5
Copper: 3
Lead: 2
Tin: 0
Cadmium: 0
Silver: 0
Vanadium: 0
Silicon: 3
Sodium: 0
Potassium: 5
Titanium: 0
Molybdenum: 2
Antimony: 1
Manganese: 0
Lithium: 0
Boron: 1
Magnesium: 5
Calcium: 1700
Barium: 0
Phosphorus: 675
Zinc: 762
Fuel: 0.7%
Soot: .2%
Water: <.1%
Viscosity 100 C: 11.6
TBN:4.55
I-R Oxida: 12
I-R Nitra: 18


Comments: Data indicates no abnormal findings. Resample at normal interval.

 

[TornadoRed]

Car: 2006 Jetta
Trans: DSG
Miles at sample: 40,000
Miles on sample 10,000
Duration: 7.5 months
Oil: Castrol SLX OE 5W-30

Excellent test results, Bob.

I tell the guys who are testing their used oil after 5k miles or 10k miles, that they ought to wait until 30k miles for the first test, to establish a baseline. If this is your baseline test, it's a good one.

 

[bobgolf2004]

Excellent test results, Bob.

I tell the guys who are testing their used oil after 5k miles or 10k miles, that they ought to wait until 30k miles for the first test, to establish a baseline. If this is your baseline test, it's a good one.

Yes, this is the first oil analysis for this car. Heck, it is only the second oil analysis I have ever had done in my life! (The other being one I did for my 2004 Golf).

Oil Analyzers has told me today that they will retest my oil sample for calcium and magnesium levels.

 

[dhdenney]

Not bad for nearly 15K miles.

 

[joetdi]

A few years ago I sent 2 different labs a sample of the same oil. This sample was well shaken up before being divided. I sent it to the labs and it came back with very different results. To the point that one said you are ok and the other said you have abnormal wear occuring.

Who determines the wear rate as to what it normal for a certain engine? I am sure not all engines wear at the same rate and I would say that is normal. And I am also sure that the accuracy of this is not like they are testing DNA, the price is way to low. Does anyone know the standard the try to impose?

 

[QuickWrite]

Feedback appreciated on the following results from Blackstone. This is the first oil analysis I've had done on the car since buying it four months ago. Have not changed the oil yet myself, but PO used VW recommended 505.01 spec oil at 5k mile intervals.

Miles on oil: 3,600
Miles on car: 46,664
Oil type: Castrol SLX Professional 5w/30 (test indicated 15w/40)

Aluminum: 3
Chromium: 1
Iron: 40
Copper: 4
Lead: 2
Tin: 1
Molybdenum: 2
Nickel: 1
Manganese: 1
Silver: 0
Titanium: 0
Potassium: 2
Boron: 2
Silicon: 3
Sodium: 3
Calcium: 2887
Magnesium: 7
Phosphorus: 824
Zinc: 1041
Barium: 0
Fuel: <0.5%
Water: 0%
TBN: 6.2
Viscoscity @ 100 deg. C: 13.86
Insolubles (same as soot?): 0.3

Blackstone calls the slightly high iron reading "somewhat cautionary." Given this and the TBN reading, they suggest changing oil in 3,500 miles and resampling.

Comments?

 

[Sootman]

Not bad for nearly 15K miles.

Am I missing something here? Fe at 123...seems a tad high compared to what other BRM's are exhibiting. Is this within normal parameters?

 

[dhdenney]

Am I missing something here? Fe at 123...seems a tad high compared to what other BRM's are exhibiting. Is this within normal parameters?

Yeah you are missing something, lol. Look at the dates. My latest sample was 62 at almost 15k miles. That 123 was with LL3 507.00 for 10K miles a year ago. You can see how I cut my wear rates. So to summarize what you see:
Sample #6 LL3
#7 Mobil 1 ESP 507.00
#8-10 is one OCI of Mobil 1 TDT.
and finally #11 is my last OCI of TDT.

 

[TornadoRed]

Feedback appreciated on the following results from Blackstone. This is the first oil analysis I've had done on the car since buying it four months ago. Have not changed the oil yet myself, but PO used VW recommended 505.01 spec oil at 5k mile intervals.

Miles on oil: 3,600
Miles on car: 46,664
Oil type: Castrol SLX Professional 5w/30 (test indicated 15w/40)

Aluminum: 3
Chromium: 1
Iron: 40
(snip)
Phosphorus: 824
Zinc: 1041
Barium: 0
Fuel: <0.5%
Water: 0%
TBN: 6.2
Viscoscity @ 100 deg. C: 13.86
Insolubles (same as soot?): 0.3

I would change the oil now, then test again in 10k miles. The big unknown is what was inherited from before. The phosphorus and zinc both seem low, the TBN is still up there, the viscosity is high for a 30-weight. Someone is not telling the truth about 5k-mile oil change intervals.

Do your research, decide for yourself whether to stick with a VW505.01 or VW507.00 oil or switch to an API CI-4 or CJ-4 oil. Your power train warranty will run out soon, so you should select an oil based on what is best for your engine, not what is required for your warranty.

 

[Sootman]

Yeah you are missing something, lol. Look at the dates. My latest sample was 62 at almost 15k miles. That 123 was with LL3 507.00 for 10K miles a year ago. You can see how I cut my wear rates. So to summarize what you see:
Sample #6 LL3
#7 Mobil 1 ESP 507.00
#8-10 is one OCI of Mobil 1 TDT.
and finally #11 is my last OCI of TDT.

Thanks, I sure did miss it! That's a pretty nice reduction in wear metals. I'm still on the fence about putting something other than 505.01 in my '06 but you and others seems to demonstrate how well Mobil works.

 

[dhdenney]

Thanks, I sure did miss it! That's a pretty nice reduction in wear metals. I'm still on the fence about putting something other than 505.01 in my '06 but you and others seems to demonstrate how well Mobil works.

I should have made the plunge a long time ago! As you can tell from that three sample experiment on one OCI, I had some inheritance that first time. Why it was so high I am not sure but I suspect my 62 Fe had residual as well. Either way, that end number was pleasing to me!

 

[QuickWrite]

I would change the oil now, then test again in 10k miles. The big unknown is what was inherited from before. The phosphorus and zinc both seem low, the TBN is still up there, the viscosity is high for a 30-weight. Someone is not telling the truth about 5k-mile oil change intervals.

Do your research, decide for yourself whether to stick with a VW505.01 or VW507.00 oil or switch to an API CI-4 or CJ-4 oil. Your power train warranty will run out soon, so you should select an oil based on what is best for your engine, not what is required for your warranty.

Thanks for the feedback. I also now have to wonder just what oil I've got in there. I would like to give the Mobil TDT a try after reading everyone's experiences with it, but I'm a little reluctant as the powertrain is still under warranty for 3,000 miles. That said, I won't have time to change it before a long roadtrip next week, which will probably be about 1,000 miles, so maybe I'll go ahead after that.

Anyone with second opinions based on my numbers?

 

[dhdenney]

Thanks for the feedback. I also now have to wonder just what oil I've got in there. I would like to give the Mobil TDT a try after reading everyone's experiences with it, but I'm a little reluctant as the powertrain is still under warranty for 3,000 miles. That said, I won't have time to change it before a long roadtrip next week, which will probably be about 1,000 miles, so maybe I'll go ahead after that.

Anyone with second opinions based on my numbers?

Drop the TDT in it. You won't look back.

 

[TooSlick]

Quickwrite,

Your iron level is high for only 3600 miles, as is the viscosity for an SAE 5w-40. If you're going to stick with the VW 505.01 spec oil, I've seen generally better results with the 5w-40's.

Once you are out of warranty, this would be a good candidate for a thicker, API/CJ-4 spec oil....

TS

 

[Bob_Fout]

Old DEO, 5700 miles / 108 hours.

 

[SUNRG]

your last UOA was outstanding - why did you shorten the OCI?

 

[Bob_Fout]

I didn't, I just sampled. I'll sample and changeout at 10K miles like normal though.
(they must have missed the checkmark on "no" when asked if the oil was changed)

 

[wjdell]

QuickWrite - I do not believe you can trust this UOA - I would not be so sure that is actually SLX 5W30. It is more like a GEN I 505.01 5W40. Relax put a spec oil in and u should start to get a picture next UOA

 

[SUNRG]

I didn't, I just sampled. I'll sample and changeout at 10K miles like normal though.
(they must have missed the checkmark on "no" when asked if the oil was changed)

i bet this oil condition and performance would still be oustanding in your engine at 12k. wear rates may even drop in comparison to your first (mile 0 to mile 5700) OSI. cheers! rob

 

[TooSlick]

Bob,

The silicon level in all these is the key to very low upper engine wear. The baseline viscosity of this oil is ~ 15.3 Cst, so I don't understand the Blackstone comment.

I can't imagine the re-formulated DEO generating lower wear rates, but the long drain capability should be even better. With all your highway driving, I'm thinking 15k-20k miles should be doable....

TS

 

[Thunderstruck]

Hi, wanted to see what you guys think about my first analysis on my 2009 Jetta at 9950 miles, first oil change-are there any causes for concern? Sample was taken by dealer when OC was done.

 

[TornadoRed]

Hi, wanted to see what you guys think about my first analysis on my 2009 Jetta at 9950 miles, first oil change-are there any causes for concern?

It is what it is. If this was not the first oil change on a new engine, if this was the used-oil test results after 50k or 100k miles, then it would be absolutely horrible and would raise questions about how long the engine might last.

But the first 10k miles on a TDI engine is a period when the rough edges are worn down on the engine internals. There should be a lot of metal wear, that is what is supposed to happen. The results from your engine are not terribly different from the other UOA after 10k miles on 2009 TDIs.

Think of this as a baseline test. Now, test again at 30k miles, when most of the initial wearing-in is completed.

 

[QuickWrite]

QuickWrite - I do not believe you can trust this UOA - I would not be so sure that is actually SLX 5W30. It is more like a GEN I 505.01 5W40. Relax put a spec oil in and u should start to get a picture next UOA

Thx for the additional feedback -- and from TooSlick also. I misread the Blackstone report; they also recommend changing the oil now and sampling again in 3,500 miles. So I'll be doing that as soon as I can decide which oil to use. Only about 1,500 miles on the powertrain warranty now after my weeklong roadtrip. The car ran flawlessly in hot and cold weather over many mountain passes! Love my TDI!

 

[TooSlick]

Thunderstruck,

Looks pretty typical for a new TDI engine. I'd resample when you have 30k total on the car, that will give you a more representative wear pattern and gauge on oil degradation. (there is more oil contamination here, since the rings were still sealing.)

TS

 

[Thunderstruck]

OK, I'll keep an eye on it and do another test next OC. The other results I've seen here are all over the place, so I wasn't sure how to interpret mine. By the time I hit 30K I'll be close to the warranty expiring, so I need some lead time in case I decide to sell the car.
Yayyy!, weather sounds good for most of the week so I can ride the bike and put no miles on the car.

 

[TornadoRed]

OK, I'll keep an eye on it and do another test next OC. The other results I've seen here are all over the place, so I wasn't sure how to interpret mine. By the time I hit 30K I'll be close to the warranty expiring, so I need some lead time in case I decide to sell the car.

AFAIK your power train warranty is still 60k miles.

 

[TomB]

2005 Passat 2.0TDI results. What's up with Copper?

Just got back these results on the two 2005 Passats. What is up with these numbers? If I remember correctly Copper equal worn bearings. Thanks for the analysis!

I did switch this time to Pentosin Pento High Performance II 5W40 oil on this change. The earlier oil on the Gray one was 506.01 and that seemed too thin. Even the Elf Solaris LSX at 5W30 seems weak.