myride4now
New member
I purchased a TDI w/ 36k about two years ago. Its running fine at 70k. I plan on keeping the car well into 2-300k. Anyone having good experiences with theirs?
How are TDI's doing long term after the buyback?
- Thread starter myride4now
- Start date
oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Don't own one, service a bunch of them.
Lots of DPFs (even more than before)
Lots of intake manifolds
Turbochargers here and there still
Various other sensors and stuff, much of which is relatively expensive and often difficult (time consuming) to access
Unfortunately, and ironically, the one surefire way to lessen the issues is with a full delete, and I find this awful myself.
I don't "dislike" these cars, but I certainly don't like them as much as the older ones (which, despite their age and ever climbing numbers in the odometer, seem to just keep on going and going and going....)
Lots of DPFs (even more than before)
Lots of intake manifolds
Turbochargers here and there still
Various other sensors and stuff, much of which is relatively expensive and often difficult (time consuming) to access
Unfortunately, and ironically, the one surefire way to lessen the issues is with a full delete, and I find this awful myself.
I don't "dislike" these cars, but I certainly don't like them as much as the older ones (which, despite their age and ever climbing numbers in the odometer, seem to just keep on going and going and going....)
JETaah
Vendor , w/Business number
Yeah, the Achilles heel here is the emission system.
Otherwise it is a nice car with nice power right out of the box for a lot of people.
Like Oilhammer said the older ones are what I see most of all. (not sure that he said that but...
) They have the simplest of emission systems grandfathered into them. Still very simple to work on. I am surprised that there is not more in the way of rust repair panels for them out there.
Otherwise it is a nice car with nice power right out of the box for a lot of people.
Like Oilhammer said the older ones are what I see most of all. (not sure that he said that but...
) They have the simplest of emission systems grandfathered into them. Still very simple to work on. I am surprised that there is not more in the way of rust repair panels for them out there.
pedroYUL
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 8, 2011
- Location
- MI, USA
- TDI
- 2015 Passat CVCA; 2015 GSW CRUA; 2012 wagon CJAA; 2004 wagon BEW
I dumped a 2006 with rust that I couldn't solve, nice car otherwise. Bit the bullet and got a 2015 Passat and 2015 GSW for my wife, both with higher millage, as I prefer a car that has been driven regularly versus one that sat for long time.
Both 2015 have been perfect, no issues for a couple of years already. The key is leveraging the dieselgate fix, time your 2nd phase wisely, as VW will replace with a spanking brand new DPF. I just checked both my cars and have 0.1g ash in DPF...nothing!
GSW is close to 130k miles. Passat just crossed 100k. These are very nice cars, but nothing beats the efficiency of my 2004 BEW wagon which almost all the time returns 45mpg.
My son now drives my old wagon, still solid at 420k km and counting, original cam and turbo.
Both 2015 have been perfect, no issues for a couple of years already. The key is leveraging the dieselgate fix, time your 2nd phase wisely, as VW will replace with a spanking brand new DPF. I just checked both my cars and have 0.1g ash in DPF...nothing!
GSW is close to 130k miles. Passat just crossed 100k. These are very nice cars, but nothing beats the efficiency of my 2004 BEW wagon which almost all the time returns 45mpg.
My son now drives my old wagon, still solid at 420k km and counting, original cam and turbo.
Lightflyer1
Top Post Dawg
Mine was a stop sale car, so new when I bought it in 2017. 2015 Beetle. 45k so far and no issues to report. Covid has pretty much stopped my leaving the house as I work from home all the time now. Only go out for longer drives on the weekends to look for a small piece of rural land. I do have some rock pits and stars and some already fixed, in the windshield. At some point I would like to get that replaced. I am almost always alone and drive with the rear seats down, no headrests. Lots of room back there.
jaberoo
Veteran Member
My 2015 Passat SEL has also just passed 100K (I bought it at 37K) and has been pretty well perfect (touch wood). Not one CEL so far. When I consider how many I used to see with my two Jetta TDI wagons, I'm rather amazed. I really like this car. Replaced the tie rod and bushings but still wish the ride was better, and quieter.
DivineChaos
Top Post Dawg
What's the intake manifolds going bad from?
DivineChaos
Top Post Dawg
Oh, that's another runaway prevention thing within the runners? I bet the oily soot does them in. Another win for fixed emissions.
oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
There is an updated intake manifold... they changed the actuator assembly. Also, in addition to the bracket that can sometimes limit the travel, and thus stop the DTC from happening, the aftermarket also has replacement actuators available. Although those may be suspect (Chinese) quality.
Just one more thing that makes these so fragile.
ALH intake = one simple aluminum casting with zero moving parts
CJAA intake = a casting, a molded plastic housing, a shaft and bushings, flap valves, torque limiters, a lever, a spring, ball sockets, an actuator consisting of a stepper motor, two parallel feedback sensors, inside of its own aluminum and plastic housing, the whole mess held together with ~20 screws.... collectively about 100 individual parts.
Let's see, one part, or 100 parts. Which do you think will break first? And that is JUST the intake manifold.
Just one more thing that makes these so fragile.
ALH intake = one simple aluminum casting with zero moving parts
CJAA intake = a casting, a molded plastic housing, a shaft and bushings, flap valves, torque limiters, a lever, a spring, ball sockets, an actuator consisting of a stepper motor, two parallel feedback sensors, inside of its own aluminum and plastic housing, the whole mess held together with ~20 screws.... collectively about 100 individual parts.
Let's see, one part, or 100 parts. Which do you think will break first? And that is JUST the intake manifold.
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tristan81491
Well-known member
I bought my 15 Passat SEL DSG at 73K from a dealer in September 2019, third owner. Previous owner bought it post emissions-fix and had it for a year or so before selling it with meticulous records; only issue was a warped rotor. The very next day after buying it a leak popped up from the oil pan gasket which the dealer took care of and said it was probably due to the car sitting on the lot for two months. The car had no issues until recently the oil level kept dipping into low level light territory in which the local dealer found the oil sensor was causing a leak ($585 to fix). The car just rolled over 111K with all regular maintenance done. The RNS510 radio started to have a freezing up issue but a firmware update that I found on eBay for $8 fixed that.
oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
So.... you have had a car for two years and put 40k miles on it... that's cute.
I hope (and I sincerely do, as Volkswagen's biggest fan) you can still be here a decade from now with 1/4 million miles on that same car and still be going strong.
I hope (and I sincerely do, as Volkswagen's biggest fan) you can still be here a decade from now with 1/4 million miles on that same car and still be going strong.
TurboABA
Top Post Dawg
As an actual owner of both a 2L & 3L "fixed" specimens, I think there's a ton of negative Nancys out there......
If the users aren't negligent when something goes wrong (read, you don't drive them when there's all sorts of CELs or warning signs; audible, visible, physical, etc.), and you keep up with maintenance, and you properly investigate and fix stuff when it fails, even fixed TDIs are solid & reliable.
Couple this with a good comprehension of the dieselgate warranty, as well as an ability to have fruitful exchanges with your dealer (who you are trying to get to fix stuff at no cost to you), and you'll have a decent ownership experience.
These are obviously more complex in many ways than your average tractor, or BEW, or whatever engine of the past you're comparing it to (talk about apples to oranges) so clearly there's more components and systems to fail, thus the overall perception will be that they "break down" a lot more.
If you're being realistic and considering "the whole story", I don't believe these vehicles are unreliable. I would personally jump into either once of mine, at the drop of a hat, and drive them across the country, without even batting an eyelash.
Full disclosure: Both are still under the dieselgate fix, and as a result, I've only had a couple of "out of pocket" fixes to do. Both are fairly young in terms of milage (2L~293k, 3L~141k). I've owned the 2L since new.
Once you factor in the driver\user negligence or lack of maintenance, or poor use habits, things worsen exponentially, and it is my belief that most of the "negative reviews" are a direct result of just that.
@oilhammer
As an "insider", how many of the unreliable specimens that you see are properly used and maintained\serviced when\if a CEL pops up? Or do owners roll into service once things progress to the stage of limp mode and they can no longer ignore all the xmas lights on their dash? (which most VAG users that I've met seem to somehow accept as "normal" because of the stupid society that we live in)
If the users aren't negligent when something goes wrong (read, you don't drive them when there's all sorts of CELs or warning signs; audible, visible, physical, etc.), and you keep up with maintenance, and you properly investigate and fix stuff when it fails, even fixed TDIs are solid & reliable.
Couple this with a good comprehension of the dieselgate warranty, as well as an ability to have fruitful exchanges with your dealer (who you are trying to get to fix stuff at no cost to you), and you'll have a decent ownership experience.
These are obviously more complex in many ways than your average tractor, or BEW, or whatever engine of the past you're comparing it to (talk about apples to oranges) so clearly there's more components and systems to fail, thus the overall perception will be that they "break down" a lot more.
If you're being realistic and considering "the whole story", I don't believe these vehicles are unreliable. I would personally jump into either once of mine, at the drop of a hat, and drive them across the country, without even batting an eyelash.
Full disclosure: Both are still under the dieselgate fix, and as a result, I've only had a couple of "out of pocket" fixes to do. Both are fairly young in terms of milage (2L~293k, 3L~141k). I've owned the 2L since new.
Once you factor in the driver\user negligence or lack of maintenance, or poor use habits, things worsen exponentially, and it is my belief that most of the "negative reviews" are a direct result of just that.
@oilhammer
As an "insider", how many of the unreliable specimens that you see are properly used and maintained\serviced when\if a CEL pops up? Or do owners roll into service once things progress to the stage of limp mode and they can no longer ignore all the xmas lights on their dash? (which most VAG users that I've met seem to somehow accept as "normal" because of the stupid society that we live in)
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oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
I have two TDIs here now: one is a CKRA that needs the entire front of the car torn apart to track down a coolant leak (the thermostat alone on these is a 4.7hr book time job, and the part itself costs over $100, and that doesn't include all the other gaskets and things that also get replaced while the car is apart). This car didn't even make it 100k miles, it just crossed 90k.
The other is a 2011 CJAA JSW that made it to 142k... and is getting an engine replacement due to intercooler icing and a bent rod.
Neither of these cars was "neglected" or "abused". They were just used like a normal car.
A warranty extension, no matter how well or how poorly it is executed, doesn't make a vehicle any "better". As far as I am concerned, it actually is quite the opposite: an admission by the manufacturer that it is, without a doubt, worse.
I have been wrenching on cars since before there were TDIs. I feel I have a very good handle on the track record of all of them (as well as all the other spark-plug equipped VAG products), so I stand by my statement that the newer CR ones are not, nor will the ever be, able to hold a candle to the VE and PDs. Not even close. And I routinely take care of a LOT of these cars, exclusively, meaning literally nobody but me ever lays a wrench on them since they left the dealer lot.
There is a stark contrast between the folks that bought a new AHU, ALH, BEW, BHW, or BRM car and NEVER had the car back at the dealer for anything, ever, and those that own the CBEA, CJAA, CKRA, and (to a lesser extent) the CRUA and CVCA cars that know the entire service staff at the local dealer on a first name basis because they've spend so much freaking time there.
Dieselgate made it worse, but it wasn't as good as it once was even before.
I like the refinement of the newer engines, and I like the way they run and drive. But they are woefully fragile, and frightfully expensive to keep on the road long term.
And lets be honest, for what it is going to cost to put a thermostat in a CKRA, you could tune up an ALH and make just as much power....
The other is a 2011 CJAA JSW that made it to 142k... and is getting an engine replacement due to intercooler icing and a bent rod.
Neither of these cars was "neglected" or "abused". They were just used like a normal car.
A warranty extension, no matter how well or how poorly it is executed, doesn't make a vehicle any "better". As far as I am concerned, it actually is quite the opposite: an admission by the manufacturer that it is, without a doubt, worse.
I have been wrenching on cars since before there were TDIs. I feel I have a very good handle on the track record of all of them (as well as all the other spark-plug equipped VAG products), so I stand by my statement that the newer CR ones are not, nor will the ever be, able to hold a candle to the VE and PDs. Not even close. And I routinely take care of a LOT of these cars, exclusively, meaning literally nobody but me ever lays a wrench on them since they left the dealer lot.
There is a stark contrast between the folks that bought a new AHU, ALH, BEW, BHW, or BRM car and NEVER had the car back at the dealer for anything, ever, and those that own the CBEA, CJAA, CKRA, and (to a lesser extent) the CRUA and CVCA cars that know the entire service staff at the local dealer on a first name basis because they've spend so much freaking time there.
Dieselgate made it worse, but it wasn't as good as it once was even before.
I like the refinement of the newer engines, and I like the way they run and drive. But they are woefully fragile, and frightfully expensive to keep on the road long term.
And lets be honest, for what it is going to cost to put a thermostat in a CKRA, you could tune up an ALH and make just as much power....
TurboABA
Top Post Dawg
While I can see and appreciate your perspective, I also stand by my statement about careless owners\drivers playing a massive role in the typical scenario...... I am not even "in the industry" and I see many, many examples of people ignoring CELs (and other signs of problems) and driving with pending failures for months at a time until it results in more issues.
Bottom line is, you can't have everything!
You can't have best of power\reliability\emissions\cost\technology all at the same time..... pick your poison.
Bottom line is, you can't have everything!
You can't have best of power\reliability\emissions\cost\technology all at the same time..... pick your poison.
oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
We see plenty of neglect, too...
I just had a 2017 Silverado HD in here, only complaint was "transmission overheating" (because a warning flashes in the cluster) and it goes into limp mode.
OK, so I asked how long has the MIL been on, and has the ATF ever been changed? The answer was "I can't remember" and "never". So, at just 97k miles, this [not even paid for yet] truck is getting its 6L90 slushbox replaced, because they drove it with a bad torque converter until it cooked itself to death.
And I am convinced that when anyone buys a Nissan Altima, a Chevy Cruze, or anything that Mitsubishi made, you are contractually obligated to drive the car and ignore everything you can for as long as possible.
However, here in Missouri, we have both safety and OBD testing, so much of the neglect cannot go on any longer than two years. This doesn't stop people from just driving on expired plates. And we are right next to Illinois, the land of NO safety inspections, so we get to see plenty of those death traps, too.
But it would be a farce to blame everything going wrong on the owner/operator of the car. That is simply not the case. More of our regular customers actually take very good care of their cars, and I see every day the fruits of this: we have a 2004 J-wagon here today with 430k miles on the clock, still kickin'. It needs a ball joint. Big deal.
I just had a 2017 Silverado HD in here, only complaint was "transmission overheating" (because a warning flashes in the cluster) and it goes into limp mode.
OK, so I asked how long has the MIL been on, and has the ATF ever been changed? The answer was "I can't remember" and "never". So, at just 97k miles, this [not even paid for yet] truck is getting its 6L90 slushbox replaced, because they drove it with a bad torque converter until it cooked itself to death.
And I am convinced that when anyone buys a Nissan Altima, a Chevy Cruze, or anything that Mitsubishi made, you are contractually obligated to drive the car and ignore everything you can for as long as possible.
However, here in Missouri, we have both safety and OBD testing, so much of the neglect cannot go on any longer than two years. This doesn't stop people from just driving on expired plates. And we are right next to Illinois, the land of NO safety inspections, so we get to see plenty of those death traps, too.
But it would be a farce to blame everything going wrong on the owner/operator of the car. That is simply not the case. More of our regular customers actually take very good care of their cars, and I see every day the fruits of this: we have a 2004 J-wagon here today with 430k miles on the clock, still kickin'. It needs a ball joint. Big deal.
oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
The 01M was (is?) at least a known and mostly understood component, or collection of components. And to be honest, doesn't seem so bad in comparison to a CKRA Passat in perpetual limbo waiting for a replacement turbocharger after nine months.
crazyrunner33
Veteran Member
That's disappointing to hear. I was hoping the SCR equipped ones would fare well, I was especially hopeful after seeing the increase in reliability on the Cummins after switching to SCR. My original plan was to see how the 2015 TDIs were looking after a few years and potentially upgrading, but I guess I'll be riding out my final TDI days in the BRM.
pedroYUL
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 8, 2011
- Location
- MI, USA
- TDI
- 2015 Passat CVCA; 2015 GSW CRUA; 2012 wagon CJAA; 2004 wagon BEW
The problem with the CKRA Passat turbo have nothing to do with SCR system. I have a CVCA fitted Passat (2015, also SCR) and I have no issues with my turbo...knock on wood.
pedroYUL
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 8, 2011
- Location
- MI, USA
- TDI
- 2015 Passat CVCA; 2015 GSW CRUA; 2012 wagon CJAA; 2004 wagon BEW
Every car generation has it's kinks: older TDI Passats and their BSM.
Problem with the newer generations is the cost of repair, but back when the older were new, a 01M replacement or 5spd conversion was much more expensive than nowadays.
Problem with the newer generations is the cost of repair, but back when the older were new, a 01M replacement or 5spd conversion was much more expensive than nowadays.
tristan81491
Well-known member
Hah yeah, I would've had more miles on it if it weren't for COVID and work from home. I hope to hit those miles much sooner! I am hoping the Passat will be my 'forever' car or at least until electric cars have decent range/price/cost of new batteries go down, etc.So.... you have had a car for two years and put 40k miles on it... that's cute.
I hope (and I sincerely do, as Volkswagen's biggest fan) you can still be here a decade from now with 1/4 million miles on that same car and still be going strong.
Growing up my parents had an Audi 5000 diesel, then we had a Mercedes 350SDL, 190D, 99 Suburban diesel, 03 Wagon ALH and my first car was a 2005 PD Jetta. My sister got an 06 Jetta diesel, parents traded the ALH (At 100K that O1M was barely hanging on) for an 09 Jetta and my 05 PD was totalled by a truck driver while it was parked and I moved onto a 2010 Golf two door. The Golf and my parents 09 Jetta went back to VW with dieselgate and both my parents and I got matching SEL 15 Passats. Suffice to say, I am a huge diesel fan and VW as well. I got a chance to visit their Autostadt theme park and factory in Germany and I've driven a few of their Euro offerings on the Autobahn. I have been doing a bit of lurking on mobile.de to look for a MK4 Golf Wagon 4-motion diesel to import into Canada in the near future.
Here's a shot a year before dieselgate of my Golf. Pretty much stock as I was in law school at the time and did not have the time to play with it. GTI rear valance and exhaust, Polar FIS, tuned, frost heater (really did not need this in NYC and having a garage but found someone selling a never installed one cheap and had a NJ TDI Guru throw it in for me). The PD Jetta had a whole litany of mods because I had nothing else better to do at the time. I do miss the simplicity of the MK4s and the overall build quality seemed superior.
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oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
I don't miss the old ones at all.... I drive one every day.
My only real concern is being able to get certain parts for them going forward, as lots of things have been obsoleted by Volkswagen, and aftermarket replacements either suck or don't exist.
I'm hedging my bets that my current fleet will last as long as I do. And I always have customers' cars on offer I buy (that's where most of my squadron of dubs has come from). One of mine, a 2004 1.8t Passat, has outlived its original owner's replacement for it, and that replacement, and now she's on to IT'S replacement... LMAO. "No takesies-backsies!"
My only real concern is being able to get certain parts for them going forward, as lots of things have been obsoleted by Volkswagen, and aftermarket replacements either suck or don't exist.
I'm hedging my bets that my current fleet will last as long as I do. And I always have customers' cars on offer I buy (that's where most of my squadron of dubs has come from). One of mine, a 2004 1.8t Passat, has outlived its original owner's replacement for it, and that replacement, and now she's on to IT'S replacement... LMAO. "No takesies-backsies!"
rsrguy3
Member
WOW! Entirely too much info in this thread for me to digest! I'm getting ready to pull the trigger on a new vehicle. I've been driving a subaru outback, love it but the fuel economy sucks. I'd like a newer leaf (winter capable because of the battery heater) but too pricy still.
The upshot is I desperately need a 40+mpg vh for my mission requirement.
I remembered the tdi's so here I am a newb rookie in a giant vat of info.
I'd thought I'd look for a diesel gate car but now I'm not so sure, I'm an aircraft restoration guy, own an old porsche and do most of my work. I have a $7k budget and need a wagon.
What the heck should I be looking for?
The upshot is I desperately need a 40+mpg vh for my mission requirement.
I remembered the tdi's so here I am a newb rookie in a giant vat of info.
I'd thought I'd look for a diesel gate car but now I'm not so sure, I'm an aircraft restoration guy, own an old porsche and do most of my work. I have a $7k budget and need a wagon.
What the heck should I be looking for?
oilhammer
Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
$7k would get you a decent ALH or BEW wagon. Even now. 2002-2005.
A couple years ago I sold a customer's 2005 wagon for $3500, and it was in good order with some wear and tear.
A couple years ago I sold a customer's 2005 wagon for $3500, and it was in good order with some wear and tear.
rsrguy3
Member
Alh, bew?
rsrguy3
Member
Looked it up... What years do I look for to get a bew?
rsrguy3
Member
Sounds like a good the pre 05 cars are more desirable...
tristan81491
Well-known member
Jetta BEW went to 2005 and the Golf BEW went to 2006
greengeeker
Vendor
Perfect example of the issue....complexity. Everywhere you look, every system is more complex and I would wager less robust. The EA888's micro coolant circuit would be one of the many examples of where simplicity was thrown out the window in the pursuit of _____ (fill in the blank).
I'm still eyeballing one of these complex beasts for my ALH replacement. Not because I need to but more because I won't be able to find a low mileage example in a few years.
rsrguy3
Member
I guess I was under the impression these mostly had decent standard transmissions.