Volkswagen's Clean Air Act violations on 2009+ TDIs spark huge recall, investigations

[ccbsecu]

...do Audi 2.0 TDi's run the same engines as VW 2.0 TDi's...?

 

[Mark SF]

Is there a precedence for this draconian measure?

Yes there is.

 

[dst5]

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xc558j_cheap-trick-audi-a3-tdi-green-car-s_fun
#truthinenginerring
Seems like the Clean Police have struck again!

Stupid lol

 

[Victor-Whiskey]

THREE DAY OLD Thread with 131 pages. Can someone summarize this for me?

VW is fooked. Stand by for many months for your status if you own a 09-15 TDI.

A bunch wild guesses with some semi-educated opinions. No facts yet except VW got creative with EPA emissions testing.

 

[diesel55]

Most government agencies have been doing more with less for years and been losing purchasing power for equipment/ research/ staff due to inflation.

I think testing should be funded by the company, I don't care you actually does it as long as it is truthful.

Needs to be arms length. Manufacturer testing their own product is not sufficient.

At the very least EPA could pull out vehicles randomly and do the test themselves if money is truly an issue. Random testing done properly is very effective.

 

[Aquaticmind]

CR TDIs bad

PD and earlier TDIs good

VW crooked

EPA crooked

don't forget EPA, VW collusion and massive VW buyback program

 

[Mark SF]

THREE DAY OLD Thread with 131 pages. Can someone summarize this for me?

Yes.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!

 

[TDIpilot4u]

THREE DAY OLD Thread with 131 pages. Can someone summarize this for me?

This is what I thought of ever since the hysteria began.

https://youtu.be/9gSQg1i_q2g

 

[snowboardintahoe]

Clean Police

Seems that the Clean Police have struck again!
#truthinenginerring


https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xc558j_cheap-trick-audi-a3-tdi-green-car-s_fun

 

[Aquaticmind]

No, the test could be presented in general terms. If the EPA were serious it should not even be the same test. The cars should be tested randomly with random tests and statistics can be used to derive if a car model passes or not.

Of course this is if the EPA were serious in mandating compliance.

I think it's likely a cost and complexity thing. EPA says you can't have a different program when being tested, so once EPA came up with a set of driving conditions that they thought was representative of driving conditions that become the test. Just guessing here.

 

[n1acguy]

He's talking about the onboard ICE. When the battery's depleted or is put on hold, the ICE turns on, which turns the generator that puts juice back into the battery while your driving.

The ICE just provides electric power for the motor in extended range operation. It isn't intended to charge the battery. Mountain mode is the only time the ICE will put anything into the battery, and that is limited. Most of the generator's power is used to propel the car.
The Volt isn't one of the cars that benefit from supercharging

 

[JohnBlutarsky]

After lurking for quite some time, I registered just now to thank everyone for their contributions over the last few days. This has been an invaluable thread, especially to us TDI newbs!

 

[WrEkkED]

This will have to be a buy back, because now it's false advertising. You can't post a mpg number and be way off, and same with power. You can't advertise and sell a 150hp car when it now only makes 140. And I'm pretty sure it's safe to assume that when the issues are "fixed" the numbers on both mpg and hp/tq will take a dive.

Guess time will tell, but my money is on this is going to be like the gm buyback.

 

[romad]

don't forget EPA, VW collusion and massive VW buyback program

I figure that was covered under "crooked".

 

[diesel55]

I think it's likely a cost and complexity thing. EPA says you can't have a different program when being tested, so once EPA came up with a set of driving conditions that they thought was representative of driving conditions that become the test. Just guessing here.

Maybe, but it's like a student grading his own exam.

And driving is such a diverse activity I don't see the point of a single test, other than keeping it stupidly simple.

 

[czeetah]

Just got off the phone with my local VW dealer and they already said there was an ECU update for my 15 golf TDi to resolve the emissions problem. Seems to have happened faster than people expected. I'm too afraid to go get the update for fear of a reduction in power. Hopefully someone else can be the guinea pig.

He's probably misinformed and looking at the 23o6 update which was VW's first failed attempt ... Though that doesn't make sense at I thought 15 was an EA288 and 23o6 didn't apply.

I made appointment Wednesday to get 23n5 for my Passat hopefully before it's superseded by a new update to satiate the EPA

 

[imurrx]

OMG, I can't believe this, first my car is part of DieselGate and now through reading this I find out my coffee maker is part of KeurigGate....
What else will I learn in here, a recall on the wife?

If there was a recall on my wife I would be psyched,

 

[pparks1]

This will have to be a buy back, because now it's false advertising. You can't post a mpg number and be way off, and same with power. You can't advertise and sell a 150hp car when it now only makes 140. And I'm pretty sure it's safe to assume that when the issues are "fixed" the numbers on both mpg and hp/tq will take a dive.

Guess time will tell, but my money is on this is going to be like the gm buyback.

Well, we don't know how much the numbers will change. And most of use are easily getting 6-8 more MPG than the currently stated numbers. So, even if they do go down, we would still likely be hitting the advertised numbers anyway.

Gonna have to wait this one out, rather than just panic.

 

[deuxdiesel]

Is it possible VW could buy back all the affected vehicles? It seems like it would save them a whole lot more money. They will pay $74K in fines for my two Tdis, but the book value is under $30K for both of them. Not that I want this to happen, I am just sick of the selective enforcement the Fed practices.

 

[Aquaticmind]

Maybe, but it's like a student grading his own exam.

And driving is such a diverse activity I don't see the point of a single test, other than keeping it stupidly simple.

From what I understand the test is a simulation of throttle positions for different duration of time and with variation in speed and probably engine temperatures.

 

[vwUMO]

OMG, I can't believe this, first my car is part of DieselGate and now through reading this I find out my coffee maker is part of KeurigGate....
What else will I learn in here, a recall on the wife?

Thank you Brother from the north... a good laugh indeed!

 

[diesel55]

From what I understand the test is a simulation of throttle positions for different duration of time and with variation in speed and probably engine temperatures.

Sounds like a straightforward test. Any idea how much time the testing takes?

 

[Aquaticmind]

Sounds like a straightforward test. Any idea how much time the testing takes?

Not a clue, and I'm guess others here know way more about the test than I do.

 

[Lightflyer1]

I want my money back on my car or a brand new one without these issues. Forget class action bullsh** lawsuits. The only people that make any money on them is the freakin lawyers that start them. In the Toyota lawsuit, the people only got a refund of $21 per person while the 85 lawyers got around $227 million. Make sure that if you want to sue Volkswagen directly, you opt out of the class action crap when they offer you a check for $10. Where are the lawyers to help get us a new car? We need lawyers that will help us sue for our money back like lemon law lawyers do.

Lawyers aren't free. There are plenty out there. Opt out of the CA and hire your own and have at it. No one is going to help you for nothing.

 

[Grievous Angel]

Haven't been around much. Too busy driving more, worrying less.

83k problem free miles, averaging 46mpg at least.

And now this. Might as well sit on it to see out it shakes out. But I will be looking for a way out as soon as possible. VW: Never Again.

Guess it's time to find a good mechanic. I'm not going back to the dealer. I'm happy with the performance/economy of what I have.

 

[bhtooefr]

http://jalopnik.com/volkswagen-u-s-ceo-we-screwed-up-and-will-pay-what-we-1732165830

Or, if you'd like video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1_OlUI2PPs

 

[jdeg]

From my blog: http://gearheadgrrrl.com/2015/09/21/tuning-to-the-test-epa-wants-to-make-an-example-of-vw/

I hate to say it, but your article spews more NO2 than my Sportwagen on the highway.

 

[tdibigd]

Is it possible VW could buy back all the affected vehicles? It seems like it would save them a whole lot more money. They will pay $74K in fines for my two Tdis, but the book value is under $30K for both of them. Not that I want this to happen, I am just sick of the selective enforcement the Fed practices.

I suspect that potential EPA fines and customer restitution are unrelated.

 

[scotthershall]

On my way to/from work I pass by the local VW dealer in North Haven, CT. They have a grass lot they use for overflow about a half mile from their facility. Usually filled with new model year stuff over the winter - probably to make room on their lot for snow removal/storage. Looks like the grass is freshly cut, and the lot has 20 or so of cars which appear to be all of their new TDI stock.

This whole situation is awful. I was just becoming nearly completely comfortable with the new emissions controls after seeing that people mostly aren't having as many problems as predicted 4 or 5 years ago when the CRs were new. Being fairly risk adverse when it comes to large purchases I was waiting and waiting. I'm going to need a car come December/January, but it will take another year or two of lurking around while we see the effect of the software updates on the 2015+ to make me comfortable again. Unfortunately, I think this means I'm going to have to skip the TDI again. I'll probably end up with a CPO Volvo S60 or a Mazda 6. I really wanted another TDI... too bad...

 

[Stealth TDI]

Here's what they're going to do for the recall: Install spark plugs where the glow plugs used to go; Lower the fuel injection pressure; Reprogram the ECU to control the spark ignition system; Attach a TSI badge to the rear of the car; Remove the mis-fuelling device from the fuel filling hole; Provide a supplement to the owner's manual with new fuelling instructions specifying the minimum octane requirements.

HAHA! Good one!

I stopped reading at the first inaccuracy: "The EPA is a giant federal government bureaucracy that has set standards for vehicle exhaust emissions among other things since the 1960s." The EPA didn't exist until 1970.

I hate to say it, but your article spews more NO2 than my Sportwagen on the highway.

Thanks for posting your reviews. I'm glad I didn't waste my time reading that blog.

Scott