TDI extended emissions warranty disputes

[synmag]

Hello, new user here. I have been on the Club Touareg site since I became a TDI owner but created an account here because of a post by Lightflyer1 that came up in a google search.

The specific quote "The document also says it covers anything that sets a check engine light and every disagreement is to be settled in favor of the consumer. " is what I'm interested in.

I have a 2013 Touareg that had an EGR diverter valve replaced recently under the extended emissions warranty due to a coolant leak. During the repair they also identified a coolant/oil leak from the oil cooler which they told me is not covered under the emissions warranty. I have a thread going on this on the Club Touareg site which I don't want to recreate here. I'm just wondering if anyone can provide either anecdotal evidence or reference to anything official that I can go to the dealer/VW with to have this fix done. Someone posted an invoice showing that this was done for them under warranty.

I opened a case with VW Canada and they came back simply saying it's not covered by the emissions warranty without providing anything further. I provided all the "evidence" and reasoning based on the wording of the warranty as to why it should be covered to my dealer but they haven't gotten back to me yet. It's with their warranty administrator.

In the meantime, I'm trying to figure out what my next steps would be. Based on the linked comment about a disagreement is to be settled in favor of the consumer gives me hope that I can still have this fixed under warranty. I'm also thinking of contacting one of the law firms that participated in the settlement for advice.

Any help is appreciated.

P.S. I noted there are some usernames here who also frequent the Club Touareg site.

 

[TurboABA]

Banned users don't frequent any more. LOL Maybe the snowflakes feel better now!

What are the Cole's notes? Why do you think it should be covered?

 

[synmag]

I didn't realize that user was banned if that's what you are implying. The coles notes version:

1. oil cooler is part of the long block which is clearly covered by the warranty. Dealer said it's attached sure, but not covered.
2. The warranty states anything that throws a code or can affect emissions is covered. VW says only emission related items are covered.
3. Someone posted an invoice of the same issue that was covered for them under warranty
4. This comment about any disputed item is covered in favor of the consumer. Need to confirm but apparently, this is stated in the settlement.

BTW are you the same as the TurboABA on club Touareg? If so, you've posted on another thread of mine.
also, it may not be clear but I included two links in my post above to the club Touareg thread.

 

[TurboABA]

Same one. I'm not visiting their site... They wanted me off, I'm off

1 - questionable really.
2 - what code are you getting for an oil cooler leak?
3 - not really a thing.... They got lucky, but I don't recall the documentation listing oil cooler and it's hard to link it to the emissions system.
4 - that's in the US document... I haven't seen it in the Canadian one.

 

[DivineChaos]

Hello, new user here. I have been on the Club Touareg site since I became a TDI owner but created an account here because of a post by Lightflyer1 that came up in a google search.

The specific quote "The document also says it covers anything that sets a check engine light and every disagreement is to be settled in favor of the consumer. " is what I'm interested in.

I have a 2013 Touareg that had an EGR diverter valve replaced recently under the extended emissions warranty due to a coolant leak. During the repair they also identified a coolant/oil leak from the oil cooler which they told me is not covered under the emissions warranty. I have a thread going on this on the Club Touareg site which I don't want to recreate here. I'm just wondering if anyone can provide either anecdotal evidence or reference to anything official that I can go to the dealer/VW with to have this fix done. Someone posted an invoice showing that this was done for them under warranty.

I opened a case with VW Canada and they came back simply saying it's not covered by the emissions warranty without providing anything further. I provided all the "evidence" and reasoning based on the wording of the warranty as to why it should be covered to my dealer but they haven't gotten back to me yet. It's with their warranty administrator.

In the meantime, I'm trying to figure out what my next steps would be. Based on the linked comment about a disagreement is to be settled in favor of the consumer gives me hope that I can still have this fixed under warranty. I'm also thinking of contacting one of the law firms that participated in the settlement for advice.

Any help is appreciated.

P.S. I noted there are some usernames here who also frequent the Club Touareg site.

Call the ve dieselgate laywer there and ask. They would know easily. But I doubt it. Not really an "emission" thing. They fail. Nothing new there. I just replaced the orings on mine.

 

[Lightflyer1]

I didn't realize that user was banned if that's what you are implying. The coles notes version:

1. oil cooler is part of the long block which is clearly covered by the warranty. Dealer said it's attached sure, but not covered.
2. The warranty states anything that throws a code or can affect emissions is covered. VW says only emission related items are covered.
3. Someone posted an invoice of the same issue that was covered for them under warranty
4. This comment about any disputed item is covered in favor of the consumer. Need to confirm but apparently, this is stated in the settlement.

BTW are you the same as the TurboABA on club Touareg? If so, you've posted on another thread of mine.
also, it may not be clear but I included two links in my post above to the club Touareg thread.

If you were speaking of me, I was never banned here. Still here. TurboABA must be talking about "others".

 

[TurboABA]

He's talking about himself.

 

[synmag]

TBH I don't know what TurboABA meant by "Banned users don't frequent any more. LOL Maybe the snowflakes feel better now! " and didn't know who he was referring to by "banned users" hence my comment referencing Lightflyer by my comment " I didn't realize that user was banned if that's what you are implying." as that was my best guess. Since I'm new I don't know if there is a way to tell if a user is banned or not.

Anyway, people at Club Touareg were telling me it should be covered and after reading the booklet released by VW, which is a condensed consumer-friendly version of the legal settlement, I thought the possibility existed that it would be covered so why not try and make them prove otherwise.

After having been told no by VW I thought Lightflyer's comment kept the door open a little longer. Since you are in Texas obviously you're refering to the US settlement. However, after having read both condensed versions, US vs Canadian, they are virtually identical except for the AdBlue fill up in the US between service appointments.

@TurboABA when you say you haven't seen it in the Canadian one have you read the entire document? I.e. are you certain it's isn't in it or is there a possibility that it's there?

@DivineChaos I have contacted one of the law firms to ask for a link to the full settlement as the settlement website has been taken down.

 

[TurboABA]

Did you see it in there?

https://www.vw.ca/idhub/content/dam/onehub_pkw/importers/ca/2020/editorial-pieces/tdi/2013_Touareg_MY2013-2014_3L_Gen_2.1_VW_EN.pdf

 

[synmag]

Yes, I read both versions of these. They don't mention disputes. I think it's in the full legal version. I found the email with the package but it's a link to the settlement website to download. It looks like I have deleted the files as I didn't thinki would need them again.

 

[TurboABA]

I'm not trying to burst your bubble, but you need a reality check.

Just because someone on a forum in a different country managed to get this replaced at no cost to them, isn't a valid argument that it's a warranty covered item. It isn't listed as one of the covered items, and I can't come up with some sort of link between it and emissions... For all we know, the dealership who did it, never got paid by VVoA for the work once they submitted it.

So unless you are able to find a dealership that you can charm into believing this is a warranty item based on your ability to present your case, evidence you've collected, lawyer threats, etc., you'll have to have this fixed on your own dime.

Any dealership that's on the ball will most likely check with corporate first to make sure they will get paid if there was confusion about it possibly being covered.

You may want to get a quote at an independent garage with a good reputation as it shouldn't be as much of a hit on your wallet as what the dealer is quoting you.

 

[synmag]

I don't have a bubble to burst and certainly don't need a reality check. I'm fully aware it's a bit of a stretch, however, based on the wording of the warranty plus the actual settlement (the warranty booklet on the VW site is a consumer-oriented booklet version of the actual settlement) is open to interpretation with statements like " (2) any component which can reasonably be impacted by effects of the emissions repair.". Both the EGR and oil cooler use coolant which is part of the same system. All the EGR components are listed parts as covered items. It's not too much of a stretch that repairs to EGR components could affect the oil cooler given they are connected and both use the same coolant. It shouldn't take a lawyer to make this case. It would be nice if the Canadian version also had this dispute clause in it as that should be enough to convince them to cover it.

Regarding your statement about the example being in a different country, that's exactly what my SM said. Once I explained to her that VW is one company operating in both countries, heck they even have the same toll-free number for both countries in both booklets, with virtually identical warranties it's perfectly logical to use a case in the US as evidence that it should be covered. Especially in our precedence-based common law legal system. The only real difference between the US and Canada is that the US is way more litigious which means companies are more likely to act in your favor in order to avoid getting lawyers involved. Clearly, I'm not going to involve lawyers in this I was simply asking one who participated in the class action to provide me the full legal settlement so I can check if we also had this dispute clause. Because that should seal the case in my favor. Still no guarantees though, but worth a try. I would be much poorer if every time I received a no for an answer I walked away.

People on these forums have been great in providing anecdotal information, and I'm happy to help others with my experiences. I'm simply asking for info and more data points to help my case, which in turn can prove to be helpful for others.

Regarding your point that the dealer who did the service under warranty is countered by yourself when stating that any decent dealer will check prior to doing the work.

 

[DivineChaos]

Maybe if the coolant passage in the cooler was plugged. But, this was normal before the "fix". If I didn't delete I was gonna add a coolant filter.

 

[TurboABA]

@synmag
I know you don't like my input, but I'm telling you the same thing others are (mostly).
It's near impossible to make the "link" based on your statements about one company, one number, etc.
You can attempt to keep fighting and spin details as you see fit, but in my experience, it's all futile.

I've had warranty battles and I've had things covered under warranty. But I've also had to fix things myself, just enough to turn off a CEL to get to the point of where I could invoke the coverage.

Good luck with your attempt, but I can't see any scenario under which an oil cooler will be covered. Hopefully I'm wrong.

 

[Kenw86]

I live in Texas, I have the 2014 Audi Q7 part of diesel gate with emission modification done at 125k, then at 152k noticed loss of coolant and oily leak running down front of engine.
Did research then called Audi corporate for verification. Went to dealership, who tried initially to claim that not certain things not under emissions warranty, but recanted. Any components related or associated with emissions and cooling within the emissions system is related and covered.

Dealership did everything that SYNMAG is referring to. But fail to replace all glow plugs, but did replace 2 of them which I found odd. I have the complete work order, I can upload. Vehicle ran ok but differently after repair. Then a 162k HPFP crashed and now not under warranty.

 

[TurboABA]

Ouch... If you don't have a good independent shop to fix that for you, you might have a hard time justifying the repair cost. Good luck.

 

[Kenw86]

I know I am on my own. Probably will get rid off it. 8 good years. Thoroughly enjoy it.

 

[synmag]

I've been going back and forth with my SM and now that they ghosted me, I'm just about to have it done by my mech. Yes, please upload or DM me a copy, it would be greatly appreciated. Even if I pay for it I'm going to check how much the filing cost is for a small claims court as it just might be worth my time to at least present my case and have a judge rule on it. Now with two cases where the same was covered together with the wording in case of doubt, it should be decided in the customer's favor, the chances are definitely better than 0%.

Sorry to hear about the HPFP, that sucks. I was aware of this but I didn't think it was prohibitive to replace/fix. I only have a few thousand kms left on my warranty and have a new EGR code so I'm going to look into doing the AdBlue delete. I assume it also deletes the HPFP.

I'm actually going to check my filter status to make sure the dealer is not running the regen just to get it over the line and then stick me with the cost.

 

[TurboABA]

AdBlue and HPFP are not related.

 

[synmag]

@synmag
I know you don't like my input, but I'm telling you the same thing others are (mostly).
It's near impossible to make the "link" based on your statements about one company, one number, etc.
You can attempt to keep fighting and spin details as you see fit, but in my experience, it's all futile.

I've had warranty battles and I've had things covered under warranty. But I've also had to fix things myself, just enough to turn off a CEL to get to the point of where I could invoke the coverage.

Good luck with your attempt, but I can't see any scenario under which an oil cooler will be covered. Hopefully I'm wrong.

I appreciate everyone's input and it's not about like/dislike. The way I handle these situations is I collect all the data and anecdotal evidence and decide for myself what the best course of action is based on all input, including comments. While my dealer seems to have left the door open to consider it, they haven't responded officially. I believe they are simply deferring to VW Canada denying it. It was too easy for them to deny it by simply saying no. I'd like to at least challenge them once on it as I'm sure they count on most people simply accepting no for an answer.

 

[synmag]

AdBlue and HPFP are not related.

My bad, I mixed it up with the particulate filter. Strictly speaking, that may also not be adblue related I look at it all as emission related.

 

[Kenw86]

https://www.vwdiesellookup.com/pdf/VWCourtSettlement_Emissions_Disclosure_3L_SubGen1_Final.pdf

 

[synmag]

https://www.vwdiesellookup.com/pdf/VWCourtSettlement_Emissions_Disclosure_3L_SubGen1_Final.pdf

Not sure if it was intentional but this is a link to the warranty booklet, not the work order. Feel free to email it to "my username" @ gmail.com
TIA

 

[Kenw86]

Sorry for the delay, sent repair order from dealer to your email

 

[DivineChaos]

I didn't realize that user was banned if that's what you are implying. The coles notes version:

1. oil cooler is part of the long block which is clearly covered by the warranty. Dealer said it's attached sure, but not covered.
2. The warranty states anything that throws a code or can affect emissions is covered. VW says only emission related items are covered.
3. Someone posted an invoice of the same issue that was covered for them under warranty
4. This comment about any disputed item is covered in favor of the consumer. Need to confirm but apparently, this is stated in the settlement.

BTW are you the same as the TurboABA on club Touareg? If so, you've posted on another thread of mine.
also, it may not be clear but I included two links in my post above to the club Touareg thread.

He's not banned.

 

[synmag]

Sorry for the delay, sent repair order from dealer to your email

Got it, thank you!

 

[Aubrey80]

https://www.vwdiesellookup.com/pdf/VWCourtSettlement_Emissions_Disclosure_3L_SubGen1_Final.pdf

Hey man I have been going through hell trying to get this oil cooler which is a sub assembly of the engine covered Def need that info!!

 

[der]

anyone have a link to whom you contact if VW refuses coverage in order to try to get some help with an particular issue?

 

[der]

Ouch... If you don't have a good independent shop to fix that for you, you might have a hard time justifying the repair cost. Good luck.

what if you had a check engine light on then take it to an idep shop and it gets reset but your malfunction is a blown hose off of the dgr and cooant system failure. Will none of it be covered if you dont have a check engine light on anymore?

 

[TurboABA]

I don't know what a DGR or COOANT system failure is. Assuming they are EGR and COOLANT, it's hard to imagine a scenario under which you have such failures and the OBD doesn't throw a MIL