No start troubles

[9755]

We did 10 revolutions and still found no flywheel mark. We did notice the lower timing cover has an indentation that matches the harmonic balancer. I set it to the mark and everything still lines up. Tried and still no start

 

[BobnOH]

There is a couple alternate methods to find TDC. Once you have it, paint the flywheel. Seen this before, some flywheels come with no mark, apparently and surprisingly.
VW TDI Search Engine

 

[9755]

New problem. Idk I missed it, but tried to start the car after checking cam and pump again. I forgot the ip locking pin in and tried to start. It didn’t of course and now the pin is bent in the pump. I’m guessing I have no choice but to pull the ip pulley? This cars seeming to be full of bad luck

 

[9755]

I pulled the pulley. Looks like I’m changing the ip. It broke off the hole where the pin goes.

 

[BobnOH]

With the cost of injection pumps, I might say let that go. Of course if it broke thru to the interior, you'll have to replace. You will have to study some photos, the pin is in the center of a boss, mark the line, it will be tricky.

Programmable Search Engine

cse.google.com

 

[9755]

I already have a spare pump. Got it put on. Just going through timing everything again

 

[oilhammer]

You never timed it the first time. You couldn't find the TDC mark. I think you have bigger issues, I suspect someone M&P'd the belt, and now the engine is tooefed. I've had to R&R transmissions to replace cheap flywheels that had no TDC mark before, too. No idea where they come from (probably China via prothe, but who knows...) but they are out there.

 

[9755]

Then how exactly do I time it when I can’t find a timing mark on the flywheel? I’ve went over it dragging a pick tool and saw nor felt any mark

 

[oilhammer]

Step 1:

buy a new flywheel that you KNOW has a TDC mark.

Step 2:

remove transmission

Step 3:

install newly purchased flywheel (they only go on to the crankshaft one way)

Step 4: reinstall transmission

Step 5:

time engine as normal

Tip:

Whenever I install a new flywheel, I always brake clean the surface where the TDC mark is, and clearcoat it, then mark the slot with a bright colored paint pen (pink, yellow, orange). That way, it will be easier to see in the future for the next guy (which might be ME!).

But one last thing you can try... take a bit of Scotchbrite or similar pad, wind it up and hold in tight on the end of some long needle nose pliers, and stick it in the hole against the smooth part of the flywheel where the TDC mark would/should be. Then have someone crank the engine around a few seconds. This will scour and clean the surface, especially if it is rusted, giving you one last shot at possible exposing a mark. Worth a shot. It has helped me before.

But if the engine RAN after the timing belt was put on, and the belt was still tensioned, then even if it was installed wrong, it shouldn't cause your no start condition.

 

[9755]

That’s what I’m trying to figure out. From the paperwork I have, timing belt was done almost 20k miles ago. I’ll try the scotchbright pads first. I was really hoping to not sink a bunch of money into this car. It was bought manly for parts for my gfs golf. But anyways, do you have a recommendation on a flywheel?

 

[oilhammer]

Lots of options on clutches and flywheels, depends really on what is in there now (if it was converted from DMF or not).

I've installed a few of these with good results:

LUK DMF Clutch & Flywheel Kit (A3)(B4)(A4)(A5 BRM)

This is a complete kit includes a dual mass flywheel, pressure plate, clutch disc, and throwout bearing. Dual mass flywheels are the smoothest clutch design and have very light clutch pedal pr...

www.idparts.com

DMFs are somewhat fragile (hence so many conversion kits available), but they were initially frightfully expensive (well over $1000). They've become much more reasonable now.

 

[9755]

I’m not sure what it has or when the clutch was last changed. I’d probably go with smf. Have the g60/vr6 clutches in both our other cars and have been great, but chattery as you know. I won’t have time to mess with it for a week until I get days off. As always, I appreciate the info and help you guys give

 

[wonneber]

Whenever I install a new flywheel, I always brake clean the surface where the TDC mark is, and clearcoat it, then mark the slot with a bright colored paint pen (pink, yellow, orange). That way, it will be easier to see in the future for the next guy (which might be ME!).

I keep a bottle of white nail polish in my tool box.
Cheap, has it's own brush, and it is still visible for years.
I put a mark on each side of the O mark (iIrc) so as I turn the crank I see the color first.

 

[Tdijarhead]

I keep a bottle of white nail polish in my tool box.
Cheap, has it's own brush, and it is still visible for years.
I put a mark on each side of the O mark (iIrc) so as I turn the crank I see the color first.

I do the same thing, I highlight the mark and then put about 8-10 little white dots on each side of the mark so I know when I’m getting close.

 

[9755]

Been a bit but I finally found the timing mark on the flywheel. I ended up using some thinned down paint and brushing it on the flywheel, then going back over it with 600 grit sandpaper. Finally revealing the timing mark. Got the other ip on and primed the best I can. Get fuel spraying almost to the hood from injectors 2,3,&4. Number 1 squirts out maybe 5-6 inches high. It’s still not starting. It sputtered a few times, but that’s it. Went back over timing and it seems good. Cam lines up, pump lines up, and flywheel mark is less than a half tooth off. New fuel filter and t with o rings. New air filter, vacuum lines, cleaned egr and intake, removed converter in case it was plugged. New 109 relay. Checked all fuses and fuel lines. Do I still not have the ip primed good enough? Generic scanner gives me 5 codes. All say no dtc definition found. And all have different p numbers. P1256. P1549. P1563. P1354. P1163. I haven’t cleared them in case you guys can give me a direction to look.

 

[BobnOH]

When bleeding at the injectors you want to put down some rags, otherwise you'll want to clean up any excess fuel, plays havoc with rubber, even plastics. It sounds like you're right there, get a good charge on the battery, double check for any unplugged wires, vacuum tubes or pipes. Be sure ASV is not stuck.

 

[9755]

Will do. Finally stopped being lazy and got a laptop. Checked codes with Vcds and nothing came up except an abs code for supply voltage terminal 30. I signal output intermittent. But I’ll keep plugging away at it and keep you guys posted

 

[9755]

All injectors have good fuel spray now. Still no start. Checked all fuses again and all test good. I have new vacuum hoses to put on as the ones on it are obviously not in the right positions. I’m not sure if that’s going to stop it from starting. Asv line is unhooked and zip tied open

 

[Nevada_TDI]

Did you get rid of the fuel line big bubble yet? How long are you cranking each time? You say the injectors have lots of fuel, good. Tighten down all 4 fuel lines and crank for a full 20 seconds if you have not already. Wait 1 minute and try again, at this point the engine should sound like she wants to start. Walk away, put on the charger, and find something to do for 30 minutes while the battery tops up.
My Jetta had an unexplained loss of fuel on the freeway 2 weeks back with over 1/2 tank of fuel, I am swapping the fuel sender today, so it hopefully won't happen again.

 

[9755]

There’s a bubble that’s maybe an inch long. I’ve been cranking in 10 second intervals

 

[BobnOH]

Too lazy to go back and read, did you purge the air from the IP before doing the injectors. Could just be some residual air or you might have a small leak. Sort of normal to see some air in the lines until it's run for a bit.

 

[9755]

I did. Been working on getting the air bubble out. Seems like nothing is keeping it from coming back. Can only get fuel from the return line banjo bolt opening on the side of the pump. I mean I get fuel from the return line on top, but it doesn’t move the bubble

 

[BobnOH]

Well that sounds right. Maybe crack all 4 injectors, put down some rags and crank briefly. Do check that ASV is opening.

 

[9755]

Asv is tied open and still no start. Double checked timing again last night and all is good there. No codes and battery and starter are strong. I’ve pulled over 1/4 tank of fuel through the pump and injectors last night. Still no start.

 

[Tdijarhead]

Have you replaced the 109 relay yet?

 

[Tdijarhead]

Relay 109 (A4)(B4)(A3)

Relay 109 is the main power supply relay for A3/B4, and A4 TDIs with the ALH engine. When it fails the engine will crank but not start. Sometimes they fail intermittently. Most TDI owners like to k...

www.idparts.com

This little relay sits in the panel beside your steering column under your dash, on top of the large 377 relay which you can remove to access this better while you’re standing on your head with your feet out through the sunroof.

Since you don’t know the history I would replace this especially if the old one is black in color. The updated replacement is grey. Classic symptom of 109 failure is crank all day but no start.

 

[9755]

It has a grey one in it. I got a replacement from idparts and it was black. Have swapped back and forth from both with no change. Glow plug light comes on with both. Also rpm stays right at 300 while cranking after a couple seconds. So I take it cps is functioning correctly. Wondering if the injectors are extremely clogged and if I should pull and soak them. Is there a spot in vcds to check if injectors are opening?

 

[9755]

For fun I unplugged the coolant temp sensor and tried starting. Still no start. Really hoping to get it going today. As with the cold temps coming, the gf wants her side of the garage back till it warms up

 

[9755]

Update. All glow plugs test bad. Between 2.5 and 2.8. Changed then. Glow plugs have power at each plug socket. Re checked timing and all is good. Re primed everything using the gravity feed mentioned in other posts. All injectors spray tons of fuel. Have 1 bb sized air bubble in the line. Still no start. Said f it and sprayed a small amount of wd40 and starting fluid in after I unplugged the glow plugs. Fired up and died. I noticed that the car will crank without the clutch pedal depressed. Could that somehow be not letting something not get power, not allowing the car to fire in its own? Also the car is outside and it’s currently 10 degrees f. Both our other tdis started no problem and neither had frost heaters plugged in.

 

[ghohouston]

Pull the banjo fitting off of the return of the injection pump. Then pull the 17mm fitting that actually goes into the pump, and then pull a vacuum on that. You can do it by mouth if you have to with a piece of 3/8 hose that the end is cut nice and straight on. It obviously works better with a mity vac or using a parts washer gun with the vacuum of the gun connected there. Put it back together quickly. It gets every bit of air out. You need to be quick about getting the fitting back in though, and keep a finger over the end to minimize it losing it's prime. Those air bubbles can be absolute hell.