More B4 issues...Air & Fuel

[TonyJetta]

Repaired the AC system on Saturday. Yeah, 40F air on an 80F day!

Had a hard code limp mode on Sunday. BOOO, no commuter!

Trailed the car home and scanned with VCDS: MAF singal implausible. Take the car for a 3 mile test drive and no more MAF code.

As soon as I get it warmed up (>65C) and get on the throttle in 2nd gear, it loses power and start missing, like a bad spark plug (just an analogy).

I pull over and see gray smoke out the exhaust. It's pretty windy, so I couldn't see it right away. It idles rough, like it's running on 3 cylinders. After about 5 seconds, it clears up and resumes normal running. So, I continue with the test drive. No issues, plenty of power, no smoke, all appears normal.

I pulled the air filter when I got home...it's nasty - needs to be replaced.

One thing: While I was charging the AC on Saturday, I forgot o plug in the MAF. However, when I finished up, I did turn off the engine to plug the MAF back in. Saturday's test drive went fine: no issues / no codes.

I also scanned the ECU...no codes.

The only thing I did not think to check, at the time, was injector balance.

Having said all that, I am thinking I have an injector issue. I have had a similar miss / stumbling issue in the past. Started about 1 year ago and have had ~3 incidents. But, it always cleared up right away. So, this issue has been persistent across multiple air filters and fuel filters.

Primarily, the gray smoke and rough running indicates an injector issue to me.

Injector history: Unknown miles, this set was purchased used through a TDIClub member 5 years ago. I have put 90k miles on them.

I am leaning towards replacing them with a set of pop-tested and balanced PP injectors from Frank.

I'll see if I can source an air filter locally. It won't be Mann or Hengst, but it's better than nothing.

Tony

 

[TDI Jim]

Tony, check to see if the #3 injector connector is the same color as the other half of the connector tied down in the metal holder (brown to brown I think). If not, the connection may have been mixed up with the sensor directly across from it in the air line going from the turbo to the intercooler.

 

[tdidieselbobny]

Check Napa fo the air filter.If you only want one till you can get a good one from vendor,I believe Wally World sells Fram air filters to fit the TDI's.

 

[TonyJetta]

Tony, check to see if the #3 injector connector is the same color as the other half of the connector tied down in the metal holder (brown to brown I think). If not, the connection may have been mixed up with the sensor directly across from it in the air line going from the turbo to the intercooler.

Jim,
Thanks for pointing that out. I'll double check the connection. However, that was not touched during the AC work on Saturday.

Check Napa fo the air filter.If you only want one till you can get a good one from vendor,I believe Wally World sells Fram air filters to fit the TDI's.

I just picked up a cheap STP air filter from Autozone beofre I read this. Thanks for pointing out the Napa source, though.

Tony

 

[Abacus]

Nothing Fram will ever grace my car, they're trash (or were, I stopped using them years ago when a filter fell apart due to being wet). I have used the NAPA air filters in the past with good results, it looks just like the Hengst and Mann filters but was more money.

I have had the condition you describe happen twice in the past, like the injectors were air bound for a very short time. In each case, before the car was fully warmed up, too much fuel was given too fast and it caused the same condition you describe, and letting it run for a few minutes at idle smoothed it out. I know you said your car was warmed up, but it sounds like the same thing, excess smoke of the wrong color and erratic rough idle.

I think the injectors are a good place to start, but also look to the fuel pump. The two times I had it happen, once was with older Sprint 205's with about 80K on them and once with new PP520's (DBW setup). I think, for me, it was a case of the old pump not responding to my right foot fast enough. It happened once when I was parked and not moving and the second time when I was stuck in the driveway and needed a 'little' more juice really fast. I can normally whack it with no problem any time I want but do notice a slight 'falling off' around 3K under load, which is why I'm swapping to a spare much lower mileage AHU pump I have on the shelf (something with less than 430K on it ).

I notice a similar condition, accompanied by hard starting for 4-5 starts, when my brother runs his B4 out of fuel. He has 320K on his stock BK injectors and they have air in them from being run dry, but it also sounds similar until the air is purged.

 

[G60ING]

I've broken two mafs (long story of me doing something I shouldn't have been, trying to flow more air) well the result was limp mode different each time because of they way i broken the maf sensor. The first time was fairly typical, low boost reduced power with maybe some smoke when I wouldn't expect it. The 2nd time was regular boost but coal train smoke. I kept the heavy smoke Maf for the future Each time there was a Maf code.

Too bad you can try swapping mafs or #3 injectors with somebody.

Do you think the wiring was disturbed when you did the a/c? Could a wire have been broken? Maybe it's a good time to do resistance checks from the Maf plug to ecu plug? Resistance check on the #3 injector?

 

[TonyJetta]

Mark,
thank for the information. That does help confirm I'm looking in the right direction.
Regarding Fram...I absolutely agree. I cut a Fram oil filter apart and was shocked by what I saw: cardboard end caps glued in place, holding the pleated filter element together. After I saw that I never used Fram again.

In the case of my B4, It's a short term troubleshooting step. I have to order trans service kit for the A5 in the next few weeks...I'll order the proper filter then.

I may just pull the trigger and replace the injectors, if only because I can get them quickly. If I have the issue again, I may just have my pump rebuilt, and see what DFIS has to say.

The kicker with B4's...the odometer reads 230K...but the carfax, when I bought the car, originally read that the cluster had been replaced. I have to wonder how many miles the bad cluster was in place. i.e. 100 miles or 50k miles or more? My point being, the car may have more like 400k miles and I wouldn't know it. Oh, well, back to reality.

Thanks again!

Tony

 

[Abacus]

If you don't want your car to be down, I have a spare set of B4 injectors with PP520's sitting on the shelf I won't need for a month or so. They only have 3K on them and were balanced by DBW. I'm not looking to sell them, but your car wouldn't be down while you're having yours changed/upgraded, and you can see if you want the 520's or larger.

They're going in the wagon when I put it on the road later this month, but the injectors can wait a little longer since I have other things that need attention first and the car runs fine on the injectors it has now.

If the cluster was replace legitimately, there should be a record of it posted somewhere in the car. If not, you should be able to get close on the mileage by looking over the carfax (or was it Autocheck) and seeing the mileage when it's registered every year.

 

[TonyJetta]

Mark,
That's incredibly generous. The more I think about it, the more I'm inclined to take you up on it.

Let me know shipping charges. I'll send you a PM.

Thanks!

Tony

 

[Abacus]

I'll send them out tomorrow since they're at the house and I won't be back until after the shipping places close.

You need anything else since there is a package coming your way?

 

[TonyJetta]

You need anything else since there is a package coming your way?

Nope. At least not that I know of!

Thanks!

Tony

 

[ToddA1]

Repaired the AC system on Saturday. Yeah, 40F air on an 80F day!

Off topic, but do you find yourself needing to address the system every year?

I turned my system on and it definitely wasn't as cold as it was, last year.

-Todd

 

[Abacus]

We do it the easy way up here in Maine, we just have 40° days instead of 80°.

 

[TonyJetta]

Off topic, but do you find yourself needing to address the system every year?

I turned my system on and it definitely wasn't as cold as it was, last year.

Unfortunately, yes, nearly every year.

The brief history...
2013 - Leaky hose
2012 - Replace Compressor & kit due to clutch coil coming loose. Also found the expansion valve had partially blown out an o-ring
2010 - Replace compressor & kit due to failed clutch coil
2009 - Replace compressor & kit due to failed clutch coil
2008 - Replace compressor due to normal wear & tear

Tony

 

[TonyJetta]

Had another MAF code pop up today....Here's data at idle:

,Group A:,'003,,,,Group B:, Not Running,,,,Group C:, Not Running
,,Engine speed,MAF (specified),MAF (actual),EGR duty cycle,,,,,,,,,,
,TIME,861-945,240-340,240-340,4-84,TIME,,,,,TIME,,,,
Marker,STAMP, /min, mg/str, mg/str, %,STAMP,,,,,STAMP,,,,
,0.01,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,0.30,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,0.64,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,0.99,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,1.35,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,1.70,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,2.05,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,2.41,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,2.76,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,3.11,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,3.47,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,3.83,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,4.18,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,4.53,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,4.89,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,5.25,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,5.60,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,5.95,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,6.31,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,6.66,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,7.01,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,7.37,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,7.73,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,8.08,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,8.43,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,8.79,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,9.15,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,9.50,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,9.85,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,10.21,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,10.56,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,10.91,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,11.27,903,470.0,412.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,11.63,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,11.98,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,12.33,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,12.69,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,13.05,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,13.40,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,13.75,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,14.11,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,14.46,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,14.80,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,15.13,903,470.0,389.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,15.45,903,470.0,412.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,15.78,903,470.0,389.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,16.10,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,16.41,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,16.72,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,17.03,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,17.34,903,470.0,419.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,17.65,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,17.97,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,18.28,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,18.59,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,18.90,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,19.21,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,19.53,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,19.84,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,20.15,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,20.46,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,20.77,903,470.0,419.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,21.09,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,21.40,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,21.71,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,22.02,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,22.33,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,22.65,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,22.96,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,23.27,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,23.58,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,23.90,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,24.21,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,24.52,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,24.84,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,25.15,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,25.46,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,25.77,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,26.08,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,26.39,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,26.70,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,27.02,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,27.33,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,27.64,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,27.95,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,28.26,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,28.57,903,470.0,415.6,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,28.89,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,29.20,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,29.51,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,29.82,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,30.13,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,30.45,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,30.76,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,31.09,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,31.44,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,31.77,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,32.11,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,32.47,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,32.83,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,33.18,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,33.53,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,33.89,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,34.25,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,34.60,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,34.95,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,35.31,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,35.67,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,36.02,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,36.37,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,36.73,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,37.08,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,37.43,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,37.79,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,38.15,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,38.50,903,470.0,412.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,38.85,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,39.21,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,39.57,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,39.92,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,40.27,903,470.0,389.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,40.63,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,40.97,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,41.29,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,41.60,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,41.91,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,42.23,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,42.54,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,42.85,903,470.0,412.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,43.17,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,43.47,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,43.78,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,44.10,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,44.41,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,44.72,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,45.04,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,45.34,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,45.66,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,45.97,903,470.0,389.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,46.28,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,46.59,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,46.90,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,47.22,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,47.53,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,47.86,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,48.18,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,48.54,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,48.88,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,49.20,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,49.55,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,49.85,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,50.16,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,50.51,903,470.0,412.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,50.83,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,51.17,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,51.52,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,51.87,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,52.22,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,52.58,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,52.93,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,53.28,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,53.64,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,54.00,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,54.35,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,54.70,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,55.06,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,55.42,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,55.77,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,56.12,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,56.48,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,56.83,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,57.18,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,57.54,903,470.0,412.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,57.90,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,58.25,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,58.60,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,58.96,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,59.32,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,59.67,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,60.02,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,60.38,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,60.73,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,61.08,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,61.44,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,61.80,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,62.15,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,62.50,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,62.86,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,63.22,903,470.0,389.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,63.57,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,63.92,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,64.28,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,64.63,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,64.98,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,65.33,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,65.68,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,65.98,903,470.0,392.4,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,66.30,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,66.61,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,66.92,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,67.23,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,67.54,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,67.86,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,68.17,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,68.48,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,68.79,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,69.10,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,69.42,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,69.73,903,470.0,399.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,70.04,903,470.0,385.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,70.35,903,470.0,395.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,70.66,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,71.01,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,71.32,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,71.64,903,470.0,405.7,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,71.95,903,470.0,402.3,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
,72.25,903,470.0,409.0,19.9,,,,,,,,,,
MAF Actual seems quite low....I need to check wiring, because the rodents got to it about 1 year ago.

I forgot to record the code number, but the description was - intermittent/implausible.

Tony

 

[Abacus]

It's not drifting that much, may just be dirty.

How do specified & actual parallel, at speeds?

 

[TonyJetta]

How do specified & actual parallel, at speeds?

I'll have to run the log later; maybe today. We'll see: It's all about time!

Tony

 

[TonyJetta]

I installed Marks' injecotrs with the PP520's. NICE power. It's rather addictive!

However, they do seem to smoke a bit...particularly with a heavy foot.

I had a spare thermocouple, so when I put the motor back together, 5 years ago, I setup the TC, just never setup a gauge. So, yesterday, I borrowed the gauge from my truck and set it up temporarily in the car.

Exhaust Temp with factory injectors:
1400 @3700 in 3rd gear; >3700rpm, peg the gauge at 1600. I immediately let off.
750-800 @ 60 in 5th, cruise on
900 @ 75 in 5th, cruise on

With the PP520's:
1400 @3700 in 3rd gear; >3700rpm, peg the gauge at 1600. I immediately let off.
650-700 @ 60 in 5th, cruise on
750-800 @ 75 in 5th, cruise on

At steady speed, the EGT is about 100F cooler.

I also notice that I can be easier on the throttle to get the same response I used to need full throttle for.

By Monday morning, I need to decide which nozzles!

I like the power, just not the smoke.

On two injectors, there appears to be a clump of carbon built up. I'm wondering if that is indicative of the injecotrs being worn out. Hmmm....

Mark,
Thanks again! I spoke with Aaron last week. If I send him my injecotrs, it sounds like he can have them turned around in 5-7 busines days. So, if you need your injectors back sooner, let me know and I can pull them.

Thanks!

Tony

 

[rdkern]

Did you play with the iq?

 

[TonyJetta]

Yup.

Is started at 3-3.2, I adjusted it to 4-4.4 On mine, IQ would vary a little as it idled.

Tony

 

[Abacus]

I don't need them right away, just hang onto them until you get yours back. They are enjoyable, especially with a tune.

Try adjusting to around 5 and check for smoke then. Also, where is your timing? More fuel likes a slightly advanced graph. How is your air filter? It also likes more air and I'm running a VR6 snorkel. I can get a good haze if I romp on it but if I hit it a little less aggressively I don't get any excess smoke. My turbo is pretty worn though.

 

[TonyJetta]

Thanks!

Not sure why, but with the the Malone tune, VCDS won't run the graph.
IIRC, after the last timing belt, 30k miles ago, it was above the midline.

If I get time later today, I'll put the factory chips in to check the timing.

Since the hammer mod can be done so easily, I'll bump that up later this morning.

The air filter is fresh, but the cheapo fram - I fat fingered my air filter order and ordered A3 filters instead of B4. Don't ask why. A local parts tore has WIX that I'll pick up tomorrow at lunch.

VR6 snorkel...the air inlet to the air filter box? Hmmm.....

Right now, I have to dig into the wife's A5 to see why the O2 sensor died and why it intermittently runs like it's missing one cylinder.

Thanks again, Mark!

Tony

 

[TonyJetta]

So, fixing the wife's car went fast enough! Found the fuel temp sensor has a broken wire near the connector. FIXED!

Well, I adjusted the IQ until it ranged from 4.8-5.2 while idling.

I did a short drive (<2 miles) to warm up the engine before making the adjustment. The stumble (miss fire) came back. This time the cloud of smoke was black - no gray. This alone indicates my old nozzles are in need of replacement / adjustment.

Considerably less smoke after bumping IQ to 5.0 (ranging 4.8-5.2). Now, it's just a light to medium haze at WOT in 1-3rd.

I also noticed some audible ticking while idling with the hood up. I know...lower the hood and the sound goes away. I probed around with a mechanics stethoscope to find that the noise seems to be centered arount the injector lines. I think I see a pump rebuild in my near future.

I stopped to fill up, so I have accurate MPG numbers this week. <1 mile after starting out, I got the MAF code again, "Intermittent - implausible". I'm starting to think the MAF is dying in a high temp, heat-soak environment. I did not have any issues last week, but we were <85F. Today ~92F. I know it's only 7F, but that may be enough to get the MAF to fail.
I'll know more tomorrow morning & afternoon. Morning commute is at 0500 = ~60F; Evening commute ~1700 = ~90F.

I'm still pondering nozzles. I best get that figured out tonight!

Tony

 

[rdkern]

Try cage mod, or plug cleaning. Wiggle that wire.

 

[Abacus]

I did a short drive (<2 miles) to warm up the engine before making the adjustment. The stumble (miss fire) came back. This time the cloud of smoke was black - no gray. This alone indicates my old nozzles are in need of replacement / adjustment.

The new injectors are larger, so you're getting more fuel for the air you have, resulting in black smoke instead of gray. I would look to an issue with your turbo or an air restriction if you're getting black smoke. Those injectors produced none on my wagon when they were installed, and it was completely stock. I ran them with and without the RC3 chips and did not produce black smoke, but it was a lot clearer with the RC3. I could also spin the tires anytime I wanted in 2nd gear so long as I was above 2,000 rpm.

Considerably less smoke after bumping IQ to 5.0 (ranging 4.8-5.2). Now, it's just a light to medium haze at WOT in 1-3rd.

I also noticed some audible ticking while idling with the hood up. I know...lower the hood and the sound goes away. I probed around with a mechanics stethoscope to find that the noise seems to be centered arount the injector lines. I think I see a pump rebuild in my near future.

It's not a cure, but have you run some diesel-purge through it to clean it out? Do you use additives? Try adding some 2-cycle oil as a lubricant and see if you notice a difference. I'd add a little more than 1 oz per gallon and it won't hurt anything. Did you reseal the pump and how did it look inside?

I stopped to fill up, so I have accurate MPG numbers this week. <1 mile after starting out, I got the MAF code again, "Intermittent - implausible". I'm starting to think the MAF is dying in a high temp, heat-soak environment. I did not have any issues last week, but we were <85F. Today ~92F. I know it's only 7F, but that may be enough to get the MAF to fail.
I'll know more tomorrow morning & afternoon. Morning commute is at 0500 = ~60F; Evening commute ~1700 = ~90F.

It was 30°F here this morning and gets into the 50's during the day, can't help you on the heat issue.

I doubt it's a heat issue though. Have you tried another MAF? Check the wiring at the connector and see if you have an internal break somewhere. I used to get an intermittent 00575 code and found the wires broken inside the outer sheath and just inside the plug connector. I chased that one for awhile trying to figure it out, and it would always test good since it was making connection at the time. Pulling on the wires gently one at a time showed stretching, which meant the wire was broken internally. I used a homemade terminal tool to remove it, solder it back together, and it's been working fine since.

Have you logged MAF runs to see how it's tracking? That's odd the Malone tune would turn off the graphing on the Vag-Com, have you called Ross-Tech to inquire about it?

 

[TonyJetta]

I would look to an issue with your turbo or an air restriction if you're getting black smoke. Those injectors produced none on my wagon when they were installed, and it was completely stock.

I'm picking up a WIX filter at lunch today. I also have 2x Mann filters on order. BTW...There is no obstruction on the exhaust side.

I could also spin the tires anytime I wanted in 2nd gear so long as I was above 2,000 rpm.

Haven't experienced that, yet. Maybe it a goal?!

It's not a cure, but have you run some diesel-purge through it to clean it out? Do you use additives? Try adding some 2-cycle oil as a lubricant and see if you notice a difference. I'd add a little more than 1 oz per gallon and it won't hurt anything. Did you reseal the pump and how did it look inside?

I have not used diesel purge on this car. I'll give the 2-stroke oil a try. I happen to have some at home.

I resealed the pump, back in the summer of 2008. I played with some biodiesel: got up to B25, when the pump started leaking. Resealed it and never had another leak. I also never played with bio again.

It was 30°F here this morning and gets into the 50's during the day, can't help you on the heat issue.

Dude, where's the support?

I doubt it's a heat issue though. Have you tried another MAF? Check the wiring at the connector and see if you have an internal break somewhere. I used to get an intermittent 00575 code and found the wires broken inside the outer sheath and just inside the plug connector. I chased that one for awhile trying to figure it out, and it would always test good since it was making connection at the time. Pulling on the wires gently one at a time showed stretching, which meant the wire was broken internally. I used a homemade terminal tool to remove it, solder it back together, and it's been working fine since.

Have you logged MAF runs to see how it's tracking? That's odd the Malone tune would turn off the graphing on the Vag-Com, have you called Ross-Tech to inquire about it?

No, I don't have another MAF to try. I'm thinking about checking continuity between the ECU and MAF connector. I'm also thinking about rewiring the MAF...2 years ago I had some rodents get to the wiring. I patched it with what I had laying around. Not the best wire for the application, but still good enough. I'm looking at using Belden's test lead wire, 8899 (18awg/65x36) or 8890 (24AWG/45x40): rubber jacket, fine strand, highly flexible.

Have you logged MAF runs to see how it's tracking? That's odd the Malone tune would turn off the graphing on the Vag-Com, have you called Ross-Tech to inquire about it?

I'll see about MAF logs on the way home.

I'll also see about calling Ross-Tech. Before I do, I'll double check instructions to make sure I didn't leave anything out.

Any thoughts about the exhaust temps? What would be too hot? Sustained temp or spike?

Thanks!

Tony

 

[Abacus]

I wasn't looking to spin the tires, rubber is expensive and I'm not 18 anymore. It just sort of happens and is unexpected, I tend to drive both our other B4's the same way and was surprised it had that much more power. I think it's the worn original turbo and IP on mine and a coked up intake on the wife's.

I have a spare MAF on the shelf as well, it helps to have one to swap in for testing, but the logs really give a pretty good picture. If it's something you want to try for a swap, let me know.

I can run to 1,550°~1,600° on a long climb if I boot it or am towing, so I keep my foot out of it to keep the EGT's down. My turbo is original and pretty worn, so I know mine is a 'moving-air' issue.

(here is a picture at 393,400 miles, notice the worn leading edge and scalloping)

It still works fine for my driving and I'll replace it sometime soon. I've amassed everything but the motor mount for a GT2052 and will swap to it sometime late summer probably. I have a spare engine in the K-frame I can make my own rear mount, I just need to find the time. I'm also swapping on a ribbed case AHU IP I have on the shelf at the next timing belt change in 6K.

I will have to check to see where mine is running for cruising temps, typically they're in the 700°~800° range, but we don't have a lot of heat or flat & straight roads out here.

 

[TonyJetta]

Well, the MAF and/or wiring gave up the ghost on the way home last night. At least with PP520 nozzles, the car still had adequate power in limp mode.

It will have to wait until Friday for me to troubleshoot it.

It also sounds like I have an exhaust leak. I'm just going to order gaskets for the exhaust manifold and turbo outlet and plan to do that work, too.

When it rains, it pours!

Tony

 

[16vjohn]

A local parts tore has WIX that I'll pick up tomorrow at lunch.

Wix is my favorite cheap brand from the local stores, they hold up just as well as the OEM filters... not sure how the filtering ability compares to the OEM filters though.

 

[ToddA1]

Wix are very good filters. Napa rebrands them as their Napa Gold line.

-Todd