Classic 2005 Passat TDI BSM. Help?

[El Jimador]

Hi,

I have this weird noise in the car that started around September. I have a 2005 Passat TDI Wagon, Auto trans (i wish it was manual), anyways, when i checked it with my friend (he used to work in Germany as a certified VW mechanic) to see what the noise was. First he told me to change the belts as it was the cheapest option. That didn't fix it. After further inspection, we realized (or thought) that it was the alternator belt tensioner with the hydraulic dampener that started to go. As we saw the damper leaked and it was stiff. I went to the local shop and changed it. The noise stopped on cold starts but then comes back when the car warms up. I went back to the shop and he said it's the balance shaft chain tensioner. But instead of replacing the whole thing because it would cost a lot, he asked me to see if i could find just the chain tensioner and chain for the BSM instead of deleting/replacing it. I was just wondering if you guys know where i could get just those parts? Or if you have any thoughts?

Thanks,
Jim

 

[Mozambiquer]

Hi,

I have this weird noise in the car that started around September. I have a 2005 Passat TDI Wagon, Auto trans (i wish it was manual), anyways, when i checked it with my friend (he used to work in Germany as a certified VW mechanic) to see what the noise was. First he told me to change the belts as it was the cheapest option. That didn't fix it. After further inspection, we realized (or thought) that it was the alternator belt tensioner with the hydraulic dampener that started to go. As we saw the damper leaked and it was stiff. I went to the local shop and changed it. The noise stopped on cold starts but then comes back when the car warms up. I went back to the shop and he said it's the balance shaft chain tensioner. But instead of replacing the whole thing because it would cost a lot, he asked me to see if i could find just the chain tensioner and chain for the BSM instead of deleting/replacing it. I was just wondering if you guys know where i could get just those parts? Or if you have any thoughts?

Thanks,
Jim

If you look on idparts they have the whole balance shaft delete kit. You'll want to do it asap, since if that chain breaks, it will take the engine with it. It's a very common problem with the BHW passats. I'm running mine with no bsm and it really works great!
It would be much better to delete it than to try to just replace the chain and tensioner, since it is a very failure prone item.

 

[El Jimador]

If you look on idparts they have the whole balance shaft delete kit. You'll want to do it asap, since if that chain breaks, it will take the engine with it. It's a very common problem with the BHW passats. I'm running mine with no bsm and it really works great!
It would be much better to delete it than to try to just replace the chain and tensioner, since it is a very failure prone item.

The guy at the shop said the balance shaft module helps the engine run super smooth. And he said it's in pretty good shape and i don't need to remove it. It's making noise because it's not properly timed. Idk tho. Some shops here do a BSM delete for this car. I got quoted $2500 for the delete, new timing belt, new engine mounts, and oil change. He said that was pretty cheap. I know kermatdi has a BSM removal kit, but i don't really have the means or the space to do it

 

[Mozambiquer]

The guy at the shop said the balance shaft module helps the engine run super smooth. And he said it's in pretty good shape and i don't need to remove it. It's making noise because it's not properly timed. Idk tho. Some shops here do a BSM delete for this car. I got quoted $2500 for the delete, new timing belt, new engine mounts, and oil change. He said that was pretty cheap. I know kermatdi has a BSM removal kit, but i don't really have the means or the space to do it

Yes, the bsm does smooth it out a little bit, but the downsides aren't worth the risk. Mine is gone, and I don't miss it. The other option would be to upgrade to the geared bsm, though that's very expensive.
The main problem with the chained balance shaft module is that the chain they used is way smaller that it should be, and it wears out and then breaks. Even if you replace the chain, it may make another couple of years, bit. That all being said, I don't know of any place that sells the chain and tensioner, since everyone upgrades or deletes the module.

 

[cb1]

delete it before is too late...

 

[El Jimador]

Alrighty. I hit up the local shop that's done a few BSM delete's on this gen passat. They said they're booked until like mid january so i guess i'll just wait until then.

 

[50harleyrider]

wise move. You won't notice much difference in smoothness. $2500 is pricey for your items though.

 

[Windex]

My BHW has been Deleted for the last 280,000 km. No issues other than the car being a little more "vibratey" around the 2000 rpm area. I have a geared BSM sitting in my basement in case, but the car has been fine and I have no plans to install it.

You also need to think about the inherent additional weakness - the hex key shaft drive for the oil pump. They wear out (in addition to the chain issues) and can starve the engine of oil.

Do the delete

 

[zzdiesel]

I have seen the chain and tensioner for sale on ebay from Britain. I believe an oil pump was also in the kit.

 

[El Jimador]

wise move. You won't notice much difference in smoothness. $2500 is pricey for your items though.

lol stuff here is expensive. If i had my own garage i could probably do it myself. But i don't have the means or place to just buy a kit. However, the $2500 includes the BSM delete, new timing belt, new engine mounts, oil change. Everything, parts and labor including tax is $2500.

 

[Mozambiquer]

lol stuff here is expensive. If i had my own garage i could probably do it myself. But i don't have the means or place to just buy a kit. However, the $2500 includes the BSM delete, new timing belt, new engine mounts, oil change. Everything, parts and labor including tax is $2500.

I think that's fairly reasonable for that. Obviously labor is probably a bit more where you are than here. I'm glad to have my own shop!

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

I haven't looked in a while, but the gear mechanism for the balance shaft hasn't been available for a while. And VW discontinued the chain and tensioner in this market many years ago. Unless you can find parts for either overseas, I think your only option now is the delete.

 

[zzdiesel]

Cascade lists the geared balance shaft.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Be interersting to see if they actually have it. He might.

 

[Zambee500]

$2500 is CAD? That's <$2k in USD. Seems rather reasonable. Definitely do the delete. I was a somewhat early adopter of the geared BSM and hex key corners wore and it failed, so I then went to delete. Some say the hex key issue was solved on later version of geared BSM, but deleting it gets rid of the risk altogether. In my view the difference in vibration was noticeable, but acceptable. Seemed the car was a bit peppier and better MPGs after going delete too.

Auto trans (i wish it was manual),

Make sure to recode transmission sports-mode, which is 1114 or 1134 depending on how you want the Tiptronic to work. Either of those codes will change the automatic side to sports mode though. Better yet, get a tune. (I cannot find the sports-mode thread about all the different options and what they do - it might be in the "How-To" or "FAQ" threads. But there is this one: https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/transmission-recode-to-sport-mode-canadians.107639/.)

 

[Mozambiquer]

$2500 is CAD? That's <$2k in USD. Seems rather reasonable. Definitely do the delete. I was a somewhat early adopter of the geared BSM and hex key corners wore and it failed, so I then went to delete. Some say the hex key issue was solved on later version of geared BSM, but deleting it gets rid of the risk altogether. In my view the difference in vibration was noticeable, but acceptable. Seemed the car was a bit peppier and better MPGs after going delete too.



Make sure to recode transmission sports-mode, which is 1114 or 1134 depending on how you want the Tiptronic to work. Either of those codes will change the automatic side to sports mode though. Better yet, get a tune. (I cannot find the sports-mode thread about all the different options and what they do - it might be in the "How-To" or "FAQ" threads. But there is this one: https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/transmission-recode-to-sport-mode-canadians.107639/.)

I'll have to look at my coding, I did the sport mode coding on my Passat. I think it was the 1134 or something like that.

 

[Zambee500]

I'll have to look at my coding, I did the sport mode coding on my Passat. I think it was the 1134 or something like that.

I couldn't find the how-to thread here on transmission codes because it's not here. But there is a link to the "old strategy" and "new strategy" of the tiptronic behavior in post #8 of this thread:

VAG-COM sport mode, WOW!

With the help of NateBG yesterday, I recoded the car to 1134 yesterday, and it feels like a completely different car. I drives much more like a VW should, and less like a Buick. No moere hunting at ligh throttle, shifts up quicker to 4th and holds it until reaching highway speeds. Shifts seems...

forums.tdiclub.com

 

[El Jimador]

$2500 is CAD? That's <$2k in USD. Seems rather reasonable. Definitely do the delete. I was a somewhat early adopter of the geared BSM and hex key corners wore and it failed, so I then went to delete. Some say the hex key issue was solved on later version of geared BSM, but deleting it gets rid of the risk altogether. In my view the difference in vibration was noticeable, but acceptable. Seemed the car was a bit peppier and better MPGs after going delete too.



Make sure to recode transmission sports-mode, which is 1114 or 1134 depending on how you want the Tiptronic to work. Either of those codes will change the automatic side to sports mode though. Better yet, get a tune. (I cannot find the sports-mode thread about all the different options and what they do - it might be in the "How-To" or "FAQ" threads. But there is this one: https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/transmission-recode-to-sport-mode-canadians.107639/.)

I do have a stage 2 malone tune on it with dynamic EGR. and i don't really use the tiptronic that much, so im assuming 1114 gives sport mode in all driving modes? and 1134 makes only tiptronic in sport mode? That's what im understanding from the thread zambee500 provided. Correct me if im wrong, which i probably am. I'm not making sense of new strategy and old strategy

 

[Zambee500]

I do have a stage 2 malone tune on it with dynamic EGR. and i don't really use the tiptronic that much, so im assuming 1114 gives sport mode in all driving modes? and 1134 makes only tiptronic in sport mode? That's what im understanding from the thread zambee500 provided. Correct me if im wrong, which i probably am. I'm not making sense of new strategy and old strategy

As I understand, "sports mode" refers to the automatic shifting and not tiptronic. Both 1114 and 1134 are sports mode. Makes a huge difference in driveability compared to how it left the factory when driving around in full automatic mode. Sportsmode drives like an Audi (which is what the B5 is), whereas our Passats left the factory with the transmissions programmed to drive more like a Buick.

The difference in 'xx14' and 'xx34' affects the tiptronic shifting strategy. People refer to 1134 as "old strategy" meaning it makes tiptronic shifting logic closer to a manual transmission, where you have more control of shifting, although it will still automatically downshift on you as you slow down and force an upshift as you approach redline. The "new strategy" is how tiptronic logic left the factory, and I guess is more hybrid auto/manual where you think you have control of shifting, but the transmission will still upshift/downshift on you unexpectedly based on RPMs and accelerator pedal inputs.

Others with more knowledge than I have can weigh in, but I think most ECU tunes will recode the transmission to sports mode. Not certain on that though, and also don't know if it is 1114 or 1134.

I don't know that any polling has been done, but seems like the best option (short of converting to manual transmission) is 1134 where automatic is sports-mode and tiptronic behaves more like you might expect it to as manual mode.

 

[oilhammer]

Mine is set to 1134. It behaves better. I also did it the same time I went to RC1, but I have recoded other stock BHWs with similar (positive) results.

 

[El Jimador]

Mine is set to 1134. It behaves better. I also did it the same time I went to RC1, but I have recoded other stock BHWs with similar (positive) results.

What's RC1?

As I understand, "sports mode" refers to the automatic shifting and not tiptronic. Both 1114 and 1134 are sports mode. Makes a huge difference in driveability compared to how it left the factory when driving around in full automatic mode. Sportsmode drives like an Audi (which is what the B5 is), whereas our Passats left the factory with the transmissions programmed to drive more like a Buick.

The difference in 'xx14' and 'xx34' affects the tiptronic shifting strategy. People refer to 1134 as "old strategy" meaning it makes tiptronic shifting logic closer to a manual transmission, where you have more control of shifting, although it will still automatically downshift on you as you slow down and force an upshift as you approach redline. The "new strategy" is how tiptronic logic left the factory, and I guess is more hybrid auto/manual where you think you have control of shifting, but the transmission will still upshift/downshift on you unexpectedly based on RPMs and accelerator pedal inputs.

Others with more knowledge than I have can weigh in, but I think most ECU tunes will recode the transmission to sports mode. Not certain on that though, and also don't know if it is 1114 or 1134.

I don't know that any polling has been done, but seems like the best option (short of converting to manual transmission) is 1134 where automatic is sports-mode and tiptronic behaves more like you might expect it to as manual mode.

Thanks for the explanation

 

[oilhammer]

RocketChip Stage 1.

 

[El Jimador]

RocketChip Stage 1.

Oh ok