Best fuel or additive to prevent DPF from clogging?

[Beej]

Hello,

We bought a 2015 Golf Sportwagen with 5000 miles on it. My wife puts mostly city miles on it. After having the car for about two weeks, the fan was always running after the engine was turned off, and within a few days the DPF warning light came on.

We dumped in a bottle of Lucas Oil Diesel Deep Clean for DPF's and it worked. The warning light went off and the fan stopped running after the engine was turned off.

We researched DPF's and bought EnerBurn additive to help prevent this situation from happening in the future. We went to fuel up, to add EnerBurn for the first time, and stumbled across Propel Diesel HPR.

It looks like Propel does roughly what EnerBurn claims to do. It appears we should fill up with Propel whenever we can, and only use an additive when we fill up with regular petroleum diesel.

Does anyone have experience with lots of city driving and/or what the best practices are for keeping the DPF clean and not needing service for the longest period of time?

Thank you

 

[atc98002]

Your issue is short city miles. That doesn't give the DPF a chance to burn off the residue as it's supposed to. Simply driving at freeway speeds occasionally would accomplish the same, mostly. My DPF light never came on with my Passat, which had 24,000 mile when I sold it back to VW, or in my Jetta, which had 100,000 miles when it went back. That said, I believe that Propel HPR burns cleaner than standard diesel, so that will also help. But short city driving is going to load the DPF faster no matter what fuel you burn.

 

[tikal]

These cars need to be 'exercised' from time to time as stated above. If you have a manual look up how to do the "Italian tune-up" (once the engine is properly warmed up). I presume with an automatic it can be done also.

Then there is this product from LiquiMoly:

https://products.liqui-moly.com/pro-line-diesel-particulate-filter-cleaner-4.html

I do not have any experience with it as my TDI does not have a DPF but it is something you might want to research. It does not go into the tank but rather you have to apply it somehow on the DPF itself. YMMV.

 

[Lightflyer1]

Loading the dpf isn't your problem most likely. Not letting the regens happen/complete is. Usually due to short trips. Read this thread as this has already been discussed.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=485987

You need to take an active role in dpf regeneration if you are short tripping the car. Additives won't help much if at all. Good luck!

 

[Jetta_Pilot]

I've been using a Scangauge II since 2005 on my Jetta. Now on my Passat I've added a few extra custom gauges to the SG II which let me monitor things like the exhaust temp. If I see it at 1200+ degreesF I leave the engine running until the temp has come down to around 300 degF before I shut it off! This may take up to five minutes.

BTW, I use PowerService Silver all year round since I am never in freezing weather. I consider 50°F too cold already.

 

[Beej]

Thank you guys for the input.

The EnerBurn rep also admitted that we'd still have to regularly get on the freeway. Additives only do so much. We'd like to be able to go up to two weeks without getting on the freeway, but we'll have to see how it goes.

I like the look of the LiquiMoly products. I have them noted as possible backups or support.

PowerService is new to me. I've made a note of it. Jetta_Pilot, how much does it play into your 50+ mpg?

I'm realizing that a diagnostic scan tool may be good support. I'm looking into that now.

We love this car and want to find a way to keep it!

 

[MichaelB]

Thank you guys for the input.

The EnerBurn rep also admitted that we'd still have to regularly get on the freeway. Additives only do so much. We'd like to be able to go up to two weeks without getting on the freeway, but we'll have to see how it goes.
Why are you so opposed to taking the car for a 60mph run more often than once every two weeks

PowerService is new to me. Power service has been around for a long time.
No additive, not PS or Liquimoly or any other will do what driving your car and having it go into regen will do..

My 2 cents take it or leave it.

 

[Jetta_Pilot]

PowerService is new to me. I've made a note of it. Jetta_Pilot, how much does it play into your 50+ mpg?
I'm realizing that a diagnostic scan tool may be good support.

My Mpg are using imperial gallons for calculations. Deduct 20% for US gallon equivalent.
There are NO Magic chemicals to improve mileage, but some people will swear they will.
It's personal driving habits that make a big difference.
As has been mentioned by others, you need to get away from constant city driving.
Failing that you'll need to run at the fastest speeds possible but keep the car in a much lower gear for maybe 10 minutes. That would do more than adding any chemical.
As for a scan tool, right now save your money until you are far more and better acquainted with a TDI! The info doesn't just jump out at you, you need to know where and how to look.

 

[Lightflyer1]

Vag DPF is pretty much plug-and-play. You may need to do a little reading in the thread that I linked to before but that's it.

 

[tikal]

I am always curious what they use in Europe as they have so many more customers with DPF than here:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Archoil-AR6400-D-Professional-Cleaner-Concentrate/dp/B00KQ1ALKC

Interesting how this product is so popular in the UK, yet it is from a US company called Archoil:

http://archoil.eu/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/ARCHOIL-AR6400-D-MAX-Tech-Sheet.pdf

When I searched some of the European diesel forums, what is repeated often is that these products such as the Archoil AR6400-D need to be used in conjunction with driving a properly warmed up car at a lower gear (third or fourth) for around 60 Km with the RPM between 3,000 and 4,000 to generate enough heat for the additive to work as efficiently as possible cleaning the DPF, turbo, EGR, etc.

 

[Lightflyer1]

The comments there weren't all that awe inspiring. Most couldn't read the instructions on the bottle it seems according to the questions (How to use). Only 12 of the 214 reviews were for dpf related issues. I also didn't like this note: "Toxic to aquatic life with long lasting effects". Might be why they won't sell into the US.

 

[kjclow]

Thank you guys for the input.

The EnerBurn rep also admitted that we'd still have to regularly get on the freeway. Additives only do so much. We'd like to be able to go up to two weeks without getting on the freeway, but we'll have to see how it goes.

I like the look of the LiquiMoly products. I have them noted as possible backups or support.

PowerService is new to me. I've made a note of it. Jetta_Pilot, how much does it play into your 50+ mpg?

I'm realizing that a diagnostic scan tool may be good support. I'm looking into that now.

We love this car and want to find a way to keep it!

Since you're in Oakland, I can see why you try to avoid the freeways. You might move faster on the surface streets. As mentioned, there are no magic additives. You'll get better mileage and longer life out of the engine if you can get it out and wind it up. You don't have to go far, maybe 30 miles. Keep it in a lower gear for higher rpms and drive it like you're a teenager.

With my wife driving the JSW now, I've seen about a 5 mpg drop. Although she drives about three times the distance I did, she drives in heavier traffic with more lights. Most of my commute, which is about 7 miles, averaged 50 mph with two stop lights.

 

[tikal]

The comments there weren't all that awe inspiring. Most couldn't read the instructions on the bottle it seems according to the questions (How to use). Only 12 of the 214 reviews were for dpf related issues. I also didn't like this note: "Toxic to aquatic life with long lasting effects". Might be why they won't sell into the US.

Thanks for your feedback. Interesting enough a similar product in the US without the 'Max' has only six reviews:

https://www.amazon.com/Archoil-AR6400-D-Professional-Cleaner-Gallons/dp/B072BWR7J3

While the one in the UK has over 200!

 

[Lightflyer1]

Well I am not that impressed with any "fix in a bottle" additives I have seen or tried. I tried a few back a few years ago when lubricity became an "issue" and had no noticeable effect from any of them. I put diesel in the tank and drive it. I monitor regens so that they occur when needed and I don't interrupt them if I can help it. Never had an issue.

 

[kjclow]

Only time I’ve used an additive with my JSW is when heading north in the winter. Since we rarely see temps in the single digits in NC, I want to make sure I can make it back home. This Christmas was brutal in northern Indiana.

 

[Lightflyer1]

That sounds like a legitimate reason to use one. I wouldn't hesitate either if I was driving from Texas to the Great White North in winter conditions.

 

[nicklockard]

I had a 16 mile freeway commute and that was not enough to keep the DPF happy. It's just a very badly engineered bad idea. All you can do is limp it along as long as possible until out of warranty then remedy it properly, IMO.

 

[Lightflyer1]

The only issue I see is there is no way to know its status. If they had provided some kind of display to tell the driver where it currently was in relation to dpf regen status and the ability to start a regen early or delay one for some short time, things would be much better. I track mine using the vagdpf app (no longer supported) and have had no issues so far. Without the app though it is hit or miss unless you pay very close attention. Torque app has made some headway in monitoring the regens as well. We will see. The process works well you just don't have a clue about anything and it is kind of critical you do unless you are 70% highway or more.

 

[nicklockard]

The only issue I see is there is no way to know its status. If they had provided some kind of display to tell the driver where it currently was in relation to dpf regen status and the ability to start a regen early or delay one for some short time, things would be much better. I track mine using the vagdpf app (no longer supported) and have had no issues so far. Without the app though it is hit or miss unless you pay very close attention. Torque app has made some headway in monitoring the regens as well. We will see. The process works well you just don't have a clue about anything and it is kind of critical you do unless you are 70% highway or more.

Yep, basically someone decided that diesels with DPF are "for highway use only" and engineered the DPF's accordingly. So utterly stupid--and such a simple thing, you wonder how they overlooked plain common sense. They should have an interactive that lets you know something like: "I need 15 uninterrupted minutes for regen soon, please authorize when you are ready." Then the driver could defer it, but the "xx" minute time would just grow. It would decrease DPF early deaths more than any other thing, IMO.

 

[tikal]

For those interested in the view from the other side of the Atlantic you might want to look at site (in English) such as this one where there is much bigger and experienced pool of CR owners with DPF and SCR (as compared to North America):

http://www.ukpassats.co.uk/phpbb/index.php

For the OP might want to research also the experience of TDI owners in Europe with DPF/SCR using ashless two stroke oil.

 

[kjclow]

Yep, basically someone decided that diesels with DPF are "for highway use only" and engineered the DPF's accordingly. So utterly stupid--and such a simple thing, you wonder how they overlooked plain common sense. They should have an interactive that lets you know something like: "I need 15 uninterrupted minutes for regen soon, please authorize when you are ready." Then the driver could defer it, but the "xx" minute time would just grow. It would decrease DPF early deaths more than any other thing, IMO.

I picked up my Ram 1500 Ecodiesel yesterday. According to the owners manual, it will tell me when I need a regen and also when the truck is in the process. I put about 20 miles on it for the test drive and then 100 coming home. So I’m sitting at about 135. Too soon for a regen.

 

[TDIMeister]

Search here and in Google using keywords "cerium dpf" and "eolys". These are additives that reduce the activation temperature for the DPF. Note however that VW doesn't sanction the use of any such additives, and there are questions and concerns about heavy rare earth metal - which Ce is - mining and accumulation in the environment.

Edit: When all is said, there's nothing better than proper maintenance and driving schedule that allows the DPF regeneration always to complete. Driving short distances is death for Diesels, even pre-DPF ones. Sorry to say, but choosing a right car for the job is a good principle to follow, and if your usage habits are biased toward short trips, it would be better just to get non-Diesel car.

 

[BleachedBora]

+1 Meister

No additives needed with any type of fuel purchased in California, though Propel is the best stuff you can get!

KJclow - nice truck! You need to add it to your list of Cars/TDI's

 

[tikal]

Search here and in Google using keywords "cerium dpf" and "eolys". These are additives that reduce the activation temperature for the DPF. Note however that VW doesn't sanction the use of any such additives, and there are questions and concerns about heavy rare earth metal - which Ce is - mining and accumulation in the environment.
Edit: When all is said, there's nothing better than proper maintenance and driving schedule that allows the DPF regeneration always to complete. Driving short distances is death for Diesels, even pre-DPF ones. Sorry to say, but choosing a right car for the job is a good principle to follow, and if your usage habits are biased toward short trips, it would be better just to get non-Diesel car.

Thanks for the reminder about Cerium. I realize that I posted on this topic a while back with some more background information and usage in Europe:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=456424

Perhaps the fact that products such as this one are not available in the US is because they contain Cerium and are not allowed by the EPA.

 

[clacker]

You don't need a highway run, just an app with your smart phone and a plug in obd bluetooth dongle telling you when the regens happen and let it finish before shutting down. City driving is fine, it just takes longer as each deceleration lowers the temps, constant driving is better but speed has nothing to do with it, just constant driving at any speed. The event happens every 500ish miles or depending on soot load (there are other factors but the distance and loading ones are the prime factors). I find on rural roads it takes a good 12 miles to run through a regen-a good 15 minutes of driving in those roads. It starts off within a half mile of driving in warmer temps...

 

[1854sailor]

Is Propel HPR acceptable under VW's warranty restrictions regarding biodiesel?

 

[tomo366]

As of today I will be using Hot Shots Secret EDT and Diesel Extreme in my BMW

 

[Blue_Hen_TDI]

Power Service Diesel Fuel Supplement (aka the white bottle) is the O negative of diesel fuel additives. You can find it anywhere and it works fine in any application any time of the year. If you don't want to think or hunt or pay an exotic price, just use PS white.

 

[tomo366]

Power Service Diesel Fuel Supplement (aka the white bottle) is the O negative of diesel fuel additives. You can find it anywhere and it works fine in any application any time of the year. If you don't want to think or hunt or pay an exotic price, just use PS white.

This coming from the gut that keeps jumping back and forth.....cant keep a TDI for more than a year or so.......

 

[Lightflyer1]

Show me proof that these additives (any of them) do substantially any more to reduce regens. Regen management is the real key here not additives. Of the two you mentioned only Diesel Extreme mentions "up to" 50% reduction in regens, and then nothing more mentioned in the literature available on its page. It talks all around about cleaning and detergents, but how dirty can a 2015 with 5k miles be? I doubt there is much help there to be found. Their other claim is improving the fuel, but the OP is in California with supposedly some of the best mandated diesel fuel in the US. Fuel additives can only improve so much especially if the fuel is already top notch. I find little to be gained here either.

I have nothing against additives where and when needed but for this purpose/post they seem useless. Some people use them all the time and many others never use them at all. Both without issues for the most part. I have tried many kinds in the past and saw no benefit from them without scientific testing being done.