New cruise control "feature" with 6spd maual

[doctorkb]

Thanks for less hostile tone.

No worries. If you read the thread, you'd note that it didn't get hostile until people started whining about taking this to the NHTSA and trying to get VW to "recall" this feature.

I disagree. There are plenty of times when it makes sense to coast when you are not going down a grade. Think about riding a bike. One does lots of coasting...not always peddling or slowing down. Driving a car is no different.

Unless you're on a down grade, you are slowing down when you're not adding fuel. You may not be slowing down quickly, but you're slowing down -- the friction is doing that.

That said, the theory goes that LESS fuel would be used to coast like you're suggesting (in gear) than the amount of fuel that goes into the idle.

 

[JKC_NC]

"Unless you're on a down grade, you are slowing down when you're not adding fuel. You may not be slowing down quickly, but you're slowing down -- the friction is doing that.

That said, the theory goes that LESS fuel would be used to coast like you're suggesting (in gear) than the amount of fuel that goes into the idle."

I Disagree. Less fuel is used with in-gear coasting ONLY if speed reduction is the goal. If non-acceleration is the goal, it is more efficient to coast in neutral (unless going down hill). We're splitting hairs here, though. Both are good options. With manual transmission, I use both modes seamlessly.

This detail is way off topic, but I think it good for all to understand.

I agree with OP that CC causing acceleration upon selecting a lower gear is potentially dangerous. My '15 Passat does a CC cancel upon stepping on the clutch...as have my previous cars. And I would be alarmed (as OP was) if car behaved differently. I agree with OP that it could cause liabilities or worse. No impact on me since my car doesn't exhibit this behavior.

I've got no business on the Golf thread, but felt obligated to post.

Kind regards

 

[rotarykid]

2. coasting (having the gearbox disengaged while in motion) is illegal in many areas
.

This has been discussed over and over on our board. It is not illegal to shift into N while in motion in any state. The only caveat to this is traveling down a steep mountain grade. Back in the 1980s many automatics like the one VW/Audi used in their diesel powered models had this function of automatically going into N when you let up on the throttle while in E-mode. And in Europe today they still use this feature in their sold automatic equipped models. My Accord does this at lower speeds, shifts into N when you let up on the throttle.

Hybrid models have a version of this mode today, where they shift into and out of gear while still moving.

There is a thread somewhere on here which goes through every state's rules and laws in relation to this. This is a myth that shows up from time to time, that is all it is!

Here is a thread which talks about the fact that the first 2012 Passat TDI's had this freewheeling function.....

Here is another thread which has a chart made by VW on the freewheeling function they use in Europe on the DSG equipped models......

 

[rotarykid]

 

[khaki08]

There is a thread somewhere on here which goes through every state's rules and laws in relation to this. This is a myth that shows up from time to time, that is all it is!
......

Does this thread also discuss the laws of the Canadian provinces?

The thing that both you and doctorkb are missing is that this forum is not limited to one country and every country has different laws. You are probably both right in your respective country but to come in here and generally say that something is or is not true based on the laws in your area adds nothing to the discussion.

 

[doctorkb]

Does this thread also discuss the laws of the Canadian provinces?

The thing that both you and doctorkb are missing is that this forum is not limited to one country and every country has different laws. You are probably both right in your respective country but to come in here and generally say that something is or is not true based on the laws in your area adds nothing to the discussion.

I quoted the exact section from the BC Motor Vehicle Act. It does not say "steep mountain grade" -- it says "down grade".

If BC is the only jurisdiction with this law, I'd be shocked.

Feel free to dig up the thread and I'd be happy to take this part of the conversation there.

As it stands, we're very far away from the original post, which was discussing this new feature.

As for what should have happened -- it should have been an MFA-configurable option.

 

[thecapn_dennis]

Yet more musings . . .

Thanks DoctorKB for trying to get this discussion back on point.

When I started this thread, my post asked if the new way the cruise control worked with a manual transmission could be disabled.

In my second post, after reading some of the follow on posts, I suggested that if VW updated their firmware so that drivers could select which method they prefer at any given time, everybody would be happy.

It's obvious that many folks prefer the up to now industry standard behavior, i.e. when the driver of a manual car changes gear, the cruise control disengages and you select Resume or Set if you want to re-engage cruise control.

It is also obvious that many folks like VW's new approach, where cruise control suspends during a gear change, then automatically resumes the set speed.

You are spot on. VW should add to the on-screen setup the option to use either method.

I wonder if anyone at VW who has decision making authority bothers to read this and other VW related forums.

BTW, please tell me what the acronym "MFA" stands for?

 

[doctorkb]

MFA: Multifunktionsanzeige

Translation: multi-function display -- it is the one in the instrument cluster

 

[nkgagne]

I for one wish my Mk4 would not kill cruise with the clutch pedal, as I'm forever hitting resume on rural roads every time I shift down for a grade and then back up as I crest it. I agree there should be a way to disable the feature to accommodate those who refuse to adapt to it, but I support it as a convenience upgrade. The Cancel button still works, the brake pedal still works, shifting to N still works, the OFF button still works.... It's not like you have to key in a darn password to shut off the cruise for crying out loud, you have LOTS of options. I've had cruise kick in unexpectedly due to my own laziness of overriding it with the accelerator to blend in with faster passing lane traffic and then shortly after trying to coast up to a traffic jam. Whoa, surprise! But since I am a safe driver and leave space in front of me (I know, right!), it was still very easy to brake in time (your foot should already be covering the brake pedal anyway if traffic ahead is slowing). And then it was lesson learned: any time I have to drive faster than cruise for more than a moment, CANCEL for no surprises, end of.

 

[JSWTDI09]

BTW, please tell me what the acronym "MFA" stands for?

MFA, MFD, & FIS basically all mean the same thing. MFD is in English but the other 2 are acronyms from German. You might find this useful: http://pics.tdiclub.com/data/500/abbreviations-anomyns.pdf

Have Fun!

Don

 

[victropolis]

HOLY COW! I just had the same experience. I received my 2015 VW Golf TDI from Carvana today and I was astonished to find the car ACCELERATING again when I'm trying to downshift to slow down. This cruise control behavior is completely counterintuitive and inconsistent with my 2012 VW Jetta TDI or any other manual transmission car I've ever had. I hate it. I have NEVER had to rely on pressing the cancel button on cruise control ever in my life. it has always been either brake or clutch. Unbelievable.

 

[Cuzoe]

Brake still deactivates. My guess is that keeping cruise active through manual gear changes is the result of (or allows for, depending on your perspective) adaptive cruise control being possible with the 5/6MT on the MK7 platform.

For those of us with 2015's in NA with ACC retrofit, or those that could option it from the factory having the clutch deactivate would make ACC useless. But as it is, we just up/down shift to the appropriate gear for the changing speed.

 

[740GLE]

We had a Skoda Octavia "4x4" in Iceland 2018 with a 2.0TDI, 6MT, it had auto start stop, heated steering wheel and cruise maintained with clutch applications i found it rather easy and made sense.

If coming to a hill, i grabbed a lower gear, cruise still maintained speed, just like that on a DSG, it just required my input to shift gears. I've always used the steering wheel or brake to disable cruise.

 

[whizznbyu]

Is it a thing to slow down by downshifting?
Once upon a time I used to take a gasoline powered sportscar cousin (Ferdie's toy) of the VW to the track. When decelerating from high speed as I entered a corner, I would hit the brakes late, turn in and heel /toe to blip the engine revolutions to match engine speed to axle speed and augment the braking process by releasing the clutch one engaged in low gear, but once the apex has been reached in that split second the brakes come off and it's full throttle again out the apex. That maneuver is all done in a matter of fractions of a second. In daily driving, using the brakes as the first step in slowing down is not the best way to slow a car down. Brakes are the first step. Not telling you to ride your brakes down a steep mountain road either; that is when you can downshift but downshifting is best done by blipping the accelerator to match engine to axle speed.
Lastly, I have found it impossible to heel/toe my Mk 7 TDI.

 

[Cuzoe]

There was a time (years, really) where I always downshifted through the gears to decelerate in normal daily driving. Then one day I realized it was too much work, haha. Neutral and use the brakes these days. If I'm not going to come to a complete stop I can always grab the gear I actually need out of neutral. Driving the canyons/valleys or (never for me) track is a different matter. @whizznbyu there was someone on the GolfMk7 forum that sold a pedals spacer to even out the pedals to help with heel/toe. There are also a couple pedal options that extend the side of the accelerator pedal, but maybe not worth it if you just want to heel/toe occasionally while driving around town. Both require drilling your pedals.

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If I'm coming up to slower traffic and won't be able to safely get over to pass (with ACC active) I will downshift preemptively. That puts me in the proper gear for being behind them and/or to accelerate to my set speed when I can go around. I love that cruise stays active for this. Long low uphill gradients where you're right at the edge of too slow for 6th are another case where cruise staying active through clutch-in is awesome, similar to @740GLE's scenario.

The car does a good job balancing engine/wheel brake modulation to slow down with ACC. But if I've slowed down too much to match the car in front (without down shifting) when that car moves ACC sometimes tries to regain that set speed too quickly in the higher gear. It will lug the engine, disengage cruise and throw up a "check gear selector message" in the dash.