GTB2060VKLR Building a boost map.

[bhodgkiss]

Thanks Dan
Yes I’d also heard 2.7bar was safe, with the right tune, but with my standard AFN bottom end I wouldn’t be looking to push any higher than 2.2bar
Mine was previously fitted (seemingly without issue) to a 180bhp Audi A4 build, so i can check if there is a restrictor in the kit I have?

 

[adamss24]

You have pretty large injector nozzles, i had 0.260 bosio race in a b5 audi a4 FWD and that was insane ! Your van with the gtb turbo and nozzles as large would be a belter ! I will say you wont feel any difference in lag going from 2060 to a 2260vklr or even a hybrid 2262, the increase is not noticeable and the larger turbine has less EGT than the smaller gtb20 turbine ! The biggest advantage will be that it lets you mesh everything together waiting for a sec longer to come on boost and it will have stronger midrange and top end ! The only thing i fear with small turbines is surge, i find they surge is much more noticeable and you have to back off the throtle when the surge hits the wheels !
I have a seat exeo CR tdi with a hybrid bv43a, compressor is from Land rover biturbo- aprox 56mm, it surges heavily on boost that boost control becames eratic.
I agree that 2.7 bar is a bit too much, i would stress making the engine breathe better is your main priority- going for higher boost is not the right aproach to tuning ! Do you have a EGT gauge as yet ?

 

[powermandan]

So I previously had some 0.260 gibontas. Set at 210bar pop. They were decent but I could run them at 5V with a hybrid 52mm BV43 with little smoke. The 0.320 have only recently been fitted. There was a fair jump in fuelling but nothing outrageous. I had the pop pressure set at 260bar on these. I think increasing the pop pressure probably reduces the fueling.

I guess there is also possibility that the pump I have is worn. It was serviced when I bought it but I doubt that includes a new piston.

I have an EGT guage and a wideband. Typically I have fuelled for around 18:1. The max I really ever see is 800degrees. I also run methanol and when that starts up it drops about a 100 degrees. So it's difficult to really compare. So far EGT has just been a non issue for me. Everything else being equal I would expect that my overall EGT should drop moving to the new turbo as I should be shifting more air.

I am trying to roll out a data logger for a few other variables. Waiting for the turbo refurbed should give me time to wire it all up.

I cleaned up the compressor housing last night and it came up nice without having to remove to much material. A lot of the smeared aluminum from the compressor chipped off when it was introduced to a Dremel. The rest came off with a mini polishing mop

I'm going to drill it for the speed sensor tonight. Which is terrifying. But will be useful data in the long run.

Thank you for your input regarding sizing

 

[adamss24]

Any updates? I wonder what you went for in The end, 2260vklr chra or 2265?

 

[powermandan]

Any updates? I wonder what you went for in The end, 2260vklr chra or 2265?

So I'm converting it too a 2260 I hope...

Because my 2060 is a bit of an odd ball model. You can't get the CHRA for it.

But it would appear that It can be converted to a 2260 794877 spec unit which you can get a CHRA for. Pioneering performance charge a substantial amount of money for this. So I've opted to try and achieve it my self for about 1/3 of the cost.


I trawled AliExpress for the nozzle ring and VNT ring for the Mercedes 794877 GTB2260. No one seemed to list the parts. So I messaged one of the big turbo part suppliers and they said they had what I wanted and told me to just buy X listing and they would send the correct parts.

Sure enough the parts turned up yesterday. They do fit in the turbo and have the correct slots and pins. My concern is that size wize the nozzle ring diameter is only fractionally larger, I had imagined that the turbine on a GTB22 would be substantially bigger than a GTB20. And the VNT ring to the naked eye is the same. So I'm not 100% I have correct parts.

I've ordered a CHRA from a UK supplier. Which will be hear in a couple of days and I can offer it all up.

I've finished the compressor housing though

 

[smelly621]

According to the chart on darkside the turbine exducer is only 2mm bigger, and the inducer is the same. So might be fine?

 

[TDIMeister]

The general approach is to run the minimum amount of boost for a given amount of fueling whilst targeting the EGT and clearing the smoke.

More boost than necessary doesn't add any appreciable power and gives rise to many more downsides.

 

[powermandan]

So the new CHRA turned it a bit of a disaster. Neither side fit. Which was disappointing. So Ive got no idea how pioneering performance intented to refurb it and allow me to retain my modified exhaust manifold while upgrading it to a 22

Anyway. I bought another second hand turbo. Which was in good condition. Swapped it all across.

Running with no oil restrictor, seems to be fine haven't noticed any more smoke. Oil pressure still ok. So that's a win.

Turned the boost down to 2.4bar

Must have got the actuator set up better than before as it is running very well with the boost map my 52mm hybrid BV43 was running. With just a few cells tweaked to 2.4 bar.

First time round when It blew up I did not get much boost below 2000rpm. And it would kind of jump from 0 - 0.5bar. now it is nice and smooth. So I must have got the actuator set a bit better.

Taken it for a short drive. Seems happy enough. Held 2.4 bar from around 2700 - 4500rom Going to sort out the telemetry this week hopefully so I can do some decent logging.

All in all I'm feeling pretty positive about it. Happy I have retained the 20 size turbine as the 22 does seem substantial bigger

 

[adamss24]

Fits well and looks good !! well done ! To be honest I found the 2060vklr a bit too harsh coming on boost, I am surprised that yours is smooth while building pressure ! With that large nozzles it should be savage and hard to control it not to boost creep ! Your exhaust must flow pretty well…

 

[skalda]

Hi. I am currently in a similar situation (GTB2060vk on PD130 ASZ) and I tried to use this approach.
Garrett lists GTB2060VKLR on several different Mercedes-Benz 2011 models (S350/ML350/GL350 - see https://www.turbomaster.info/eng/applications/passenger_cars/mercedes+benz/). So I found original ECU software from those cars and went to find their boost maps. EDC17s has several of them based on gears but I took the one with biggest boost values (as I am trying to find the maximum values).

S350 Boost map , ML350 Boost map, GL350 Boost map

Then I used Borgwarner Matchbot and plotted those values onto GT2260s, GT2056 and C226 compressor maps (I left default Matchbot values for fields that were unknown to me as someone would eventually ask). It seems that C226 is indeed a very good match for GTB2060 as ML350 map fits very neatly into it. I already tried to plot my desired boost map so I just left it there.

 

[powermandan]

That's good info. Thanks for posting the boost maps. Will save some people trouble I. Future

My project is on hold. Something happened to the motor and I'm sick to the back teeth of rebuilding it.

My suspicion is the pump has let go now. It was going well up until that point lol. But getting harder and harder to start. So I originally assumed I had slightly bent the rods but a compression test has ruled that out

I think I had the turbo running 2.5bar of boost. But don't quote me on that. Still need to go ish my logging software

 

[skalda]

I think I had the turbo running 2.5bar of boost. But don't quote me on that

If true then 2.5bar would be a first for me. When I searched/asked others before I saw 2060 maps that run a variety of boost from plain 2bar (2500-4500 rpm) to 2.45bar (2750-4250 rpm). But I am unable to tell if these tunes lasted long enough or what was their purpose. I am currently running 2.35bar max (2750-4250rpm) until I can find or determine proper compressor map.

Hope your project resumes soon and with good results.