Finding top dead center

[gutts]

Hello All
Before I started I checked the timing with vag com . The timing was advanced and the cloud was perfect.
I am doing my timing belt . It has been a long time since I’ve worked On this car . I find I am relearning things . I have locked the cam . I have the pin in the IP . I have locked the crank . I cannot see a TDC mark on the flywheel. I can’t remember if , when I replaced the flywheel if it had a mark .
When I locked the crank the bolt holes on the crank were slightly twisted in the slots .
What would be the best way to absolutely verify that the piston is absolutely at top dead center , short if pulling the head ?
2002 5 speed

 

[Mongler98]

A couple things.
Have someone rotate the crank slowly. Hold a flat head screwdriver onto the flywheel where the timing mark should be. You will feel it if you cant see it.
It's not unheard of to have the crank sprocket walk around on the crankshaft due to the bolt backing off a bit.
Best course of action is to get it close like you do. Mark the locations on the belt and all sprockets with a paint pen. Take the belt off and get it all perfectly aligned up with Mark's and see how far off the belt Mark's are. Maybe your a tooth off? Either way. As long as the engine rotates by hand fully then it's not a big deal.

 

[eddieleephd]

Definitely difficult to see the mark when there is one.
My guess is the distance off the books in the crank hold are is the distance off the timing mark is.
To make it easier you can pull either the glow plug, or the injector, for #1 to relieve the compression and make it easier to find.

^^as stated by Mongler above have someone else turn it while you use a screw driver.

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk

 

[gforce1108]

If I'm in doubt - I pull cylinder 1 glow plug and put a thin rod down there and feel where the piston is at the top of stroke. That gets the mark in the window (if there is one). One nice thing about the PD up motors - crank lock takes the guessing out.

 

[jmodge]

The mark is easier to see if you pull the air box and look from the top of the fender. Once I found mine I inked it green. I then put a 4" green line running along the circumference of the flywheel one way and orange the other. Then I put an orange and green dot on each side of the sight hole as reference to what color is where. No more guessing which way to turn the motor to bring the mark up

 

[eddieleephd]

The mark is easier to see if you pull the air box and look from the top of the fender. Once I found mine I inked it green. I then put a 4" green line running along the circumference of the flywheel one way and orange the other. Then I put an orange and green dot on each side of the sight hole as reference to what color is where. No more guessing which way to turn the motor to bring the mark up

Good idea, I generally use my soap Stone and it finds the mark easy

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk

 

[gutts]

Thank you all
The crank lock has slotted holes in it . That is why I am questioner it.
The last belt I did in another car last winter come out perfect ! When is was ready to "bump it" over to make sure the belt was true the damn thing immediately started ! The timing was perfect also .
I may just take that glow plug out just to make sure.

Now that the cam and IP are locked , I may as well remove the belt. I would then be able to move it a few degrees . RIGHT ???

 

[flee]

A very few degrees, though. If you have a dial indicator or can get one (they are cheap),
that is the best way to establish TDC and I would do it before removing the belt.
It's possible that your replacement flywheel doesn't have TDC marked. Some don't.

 

[BobnOH]

The crank lock for your car is just to keep it from moving, not an alignment tool.
Don't even fool with the belt until you have the crank, cam and pump set. I would guess your crank mark is just outside the window. On the off chance there is no mark, you'll need to physically locate TDC at the piston. Then you can install the belt, tensioner and with the IP and cam pulleys loose tension the thing.

 

[eddieleephd]

In all reality if you find TDC mark then you can rotate the crank until it touches a lifter and back.
I would mark the crank gear and where it is now on the front cover with chalk so you know where you started. Then rotate it to the center of the holes in the lock
Generally, like you experienced last time, it should be centered in the oblong holes. If you move it so that it is, the engine should be at TDC and the mark evident once chalk or soap Stone is wiped over it.
Belts stretch out and that's likely why it's off. If it was running well if almost guarantee it.

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk

 

[gutts]

thanks for the input .
if I leave the belt intact , I can take the cam and injector locks out . find TDC on the crank . But then I will still have to release the tension on the belt to get the cam lock in . The pump may be close if I loosen the three bolts .
I am overthinking this . I am in no hurry. It just has to get done perfectly .
I will look at the fly wheel again . I am certain the first flywheel I put on years ago had no mark . I made one . The engine was on a stand at that point , so it was easy . The next flywheel I put in , I cannot remember if it had a mark or not .
Cheers !

 

[BobnOH]

Yea, belt just gets in the way at this point. With it on, no tension, 2 pulleys loose cause when you hunt for TDC the belt will have to move.
timing belt job.qxd

 

[eddieleephd]

Yes, if you mark where it is now you can always go back. It will only turn so far before you contact a valve and the crank won't turn any farther.

Right now you're within a degree. The way the tool is designed it should, like I said earlier, be right in the middle of the oblong holes.

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk

 

[gutts]

Thanks
I Know it is close . Maybe a tiny bit off . I would not be cranking the crank around much at all . The tiniest bit .

I took the air box out . I took my phone and snapped a few pictures . I can see the mark . I can even see the black arrow that I must of put on it when i put the fly wheel on . Why I cant remember marking it is something .
It looks like it needs to move counter clock wise at most a 16th of an inch .
Counter clockwise would make sense if the belt has stretched over the last 90 plus thousand miles
Thank you all

 

[BobnOH]

1/16th? you're there.

 

[flee]

Good to hear, gutts!