Any news on 506.01?

JWaltersTDI

Veteran Member
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Sep 8, 2004
Location
Portland, Oregon
I havent heard anyone say much lately about 506.01. Is anyone using it in place of 505.01? Any news on weather or not VW N/A would try to escape any warranty issues? Also has anyone made any fuel economy tests?
 

MrMopar

Top Post Dawg
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Mar 1, 2003
Location
Bloomington, IL
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none
506.01 is used in Europe where TDI engines have the variable service interval. In this case, the onboard engine computer indicates when to change the oil through an indication in the instrument cluster. It's a high quality oil that allows certain operating engines to approach 28,000 km between oil changes.

I don't think it will catch on in the United States. Customers are too accustomed to fixed intervals, especially 3 months/3000 miles.
 

jettafock

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Mar 2, 2004
Location
Catonsville, MD
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2004 Jetta GLS TDI auto, platinum gray, ESP
I don't think it will catch on in the United States. Customers are too accustomed to fixed intervals, especially 3 months/3000 miles.
Thank you Jiffy Lube
 

GCMarx

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Slumerville, Taxachusetts
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Shoes, the bus, the T
Is there a way for us to enable that variable service interval sensor and warning? (here's hoping there's just a checkbox in the VAG-COM software
)
 

HopefulFred

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Location
Atlanta, GA
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I think you can change the interval (to ESI: extended service interval) via vag-com if you have a new car. I don't know where the cut off would be though for being able to do this (if in fact you can, as I think); 2004 maybe? That's my guess since it is supposed to require 506.01 oil, which includes and supercedes 505.01, which is of course specified for PDs in NA.
See the Flexible Service Interval Retrofit? thread for way too much reading...

SUNRG is running 506.01 in two TDIs for a few thousand miles now. No oil change that I know of yet. Check for his UOA in the PD oil analysis thread. I think he said he would do them every 5k or so on his Motul oil.
PD Oil Analysis Thread
 

MrMopar

Top Post Dawg
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Mar 1, 2003
Location
Bloomington, IL
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Is there a way for us to enable that variable service interval sensor and warning? (here's hoping there's just a checkbox in the VAG-COM software
)
I doubt it. It's an option on European vehicles; doesn't automatically come with every TDI. Knowing that I doubt the hardware would be on American vehicles just waiting to be tweaked into working.
 

SUNRG

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Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Location
Roanoke, VA
TDI
None currently. Previously owned 04 Golf TDI & 05 Passat GLS Wagon TDI
I've had Motul's 506.01 in my TDI since early January.

I think the 506.01 is fantastic. In addition to the best fuel economy numbers I've ever achieved 59.2 mpg and 1012.0 miles on one tank & 47.2 mpg during my local commuting, I think the car is a little faster with the lighter oil.

In less than 300 miles I'll have 5k on the 506.01 and I will draw out a sample and send it to the lab for testing - I'm really looking forward to the results. If the lab results look good I'm going to keep it in for 10k - and possibly more.

Cheers!
 

dieseldorf

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Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
I think the 506.01 is fantastic. In addition to the best fuel economy numbers I've ever achieved 59.2 mpg and 1012.0 miles on one tank & 47.2 mpg during my local commuting, I think the car is a little faster with the lighter oil.
Whoa !! That's nothing short of SUNsational!!

Have you noticed much difference in the sound of the engine? Any oil consumption that you can measure?
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
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ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
A couple of the guys have installed the oil monitor. I think you need to search under Lito's name...he's done most of the homework on it. IIRC, there were going to be some issues with making it fully functional.

There's no reason you can't use the 506.01 oil if you don't have the monitor - - you just won't be able to take full advantage of the 50,000 km/2 year intervals.
 

JWaltersTDI

Veteran Member
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Sep 8, 2004
Location
Portland, Oregon
Those are great numbers SUNRG, I look forward to your results. I am really interested in the best economy and longevity from my PD. I dont really care about extended drain intervals, I wont leave the oil more than 10k miles anyway, which will still save money over 505.01 as I think I would change it every 5K miles. Since its down to around the 11.00 a quart range, its a good deal for what it provides.. Still not sure about the warranty issue though, even though it does supercede 505.01, Just not sure VW NA would see it that way...
 

SUNRG

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Roanoke, VA
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JW - regarding the warranty, just call your local dealer and ask.

DD - there's been no oil consumption, and i'm not sure if the sound changed when i went from Castrol 505.01 to Motul 506.01, but it sounds nice to me
 

SUNRG

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Location
Roanoke, VA
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None currently. Previously owned 04 Golf TDI & 05 Passat GLS Wagon TDI
i just called the service manager at my VW dealership and he said he has no official word from VW regarding warranty and 506.01 oil, but since it is a VW PD oil specification, using 506.01 in our PDs is fine.

he also hinted that since 505.01 spec is a syn blend, he personally thought it was a good idea to go with a full synthetic (aka 506.01).
 

JWaltersTDI

Veteran Member
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Sep 8, 2004
Location
Portland, Oregon
hahaha, I have called my local dealer and asked.......

Its amazing they even know about 505.01..

I am actually surprised they do know about it, he did pull the tech bulletin about the 505.01, but was clueless about what 506.01 was. One of the mechanics that was listening did mention that we have different fuel than Europe, but thats about all they could say.. I wasnt surprised..
In all fairness to the dealer though, they really are not expected to know much about the Euro market. All they care about is NA cars. The real enthusiasts, like who are on this site, are the best info I have ever found
 

Long_Range

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Joined
Nov 1, 2004
Location
Arthur, IL , USA
TDI
Jetta Sedan GL 2004
Can you imagine a NA dealer putting a bottle of 506.01 oil on the shelf with it's price tag? They'd have to hire a bouncer from the local bar to stand next to it and answer the screaming questions.


I personally plan on using this type oil in the near future to complimented by my Amsoil bypass filtration. The thought of saving fuel while doing less work and all the while roughly breaking even on cost is enticing to me.

506 oil retailer links.
http://www.impexfap.com/partlist.cfm?getpart=0&part_id=238776#part238776
http://shop.store.yahoo.com/ltbmotorsport/mooemspoi.html
 

04Wagon

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May 24, 2004
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St Catharines
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2004.5 Jetta Wagon 5spd Tip, Black Leather on Spice Red.
Just received this reply from Motul Canada head office in Quebec upon inquiring about distributors/retail outlets for 506.01 in Toronto. What is the big issue with using this with our fuel?


"Hello sir.

506 01 is not really recommanded for your engine in canada. The 505 01 will be better if you have a tdi 2004. Why ? Because the 506 01 is a lubricants built for very long oil interval in europe with LHTHS viscosity. A Low High temp hign Shear oil is not recommanded with a bad quality diesel. We don't have good diesel in Canada so we only recommanded to use the 505 01. The 505 01 is a HTHS oil and it's more protection for you.
If you want the 506 01, i will give you a phone number in Markham but you can trust me, 505 01 is better for you in our country.

Thanks.
 

Long_Range

Veteran Member
Joined
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Location
Arthur, IL , USA
TDI
Jetta Sedan GL 2004
The man from Motul has a good point. Thankfully we get ultra low sulfur diesel fuel next year. I've enough 5w-40 to last until then. So for now I'm looking to next year. I may hold off on the 506.01 until we see just how good this new fuel turns out though.
“It's always something”
 

JWaltersTDI

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Sep 8, 2004
Location
Portland, Oregon
I am curious of the oil analysis of the 506.01. As long as it would be good for a 10K oil change, I think that would be better all the way around, for both the engine and economy
 

SUNRG

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Joined
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Location
Roanoke, VA
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None currently. Previously owned 04 Golf TDI & 05 Passat GLS Wagon TDI
According to the documentation I've seen, the benefits of 506.01 oils over 505.01 are: <ul type="square">[*] improved fuel economy
[*] full synthetic
[*] superior protection
[*] superior performance in cold climates
[*] extended drain interval capability – up to 30,000 mile oil change intervals on ESI equipped TDIs[/list] If your TDI is not ESI (oil sensor) equipped, extended drain intervals (beyond 10k miles) are not recommended by VW using <u>any</u> oil.

With 10k OCIs, a 506.01 should outperform a 505.01 oil in all categories listed above.

However, I have now heard the Motul 506.01 "company line" that 04Wagon posted from three seperate sources. Since retailers generally want to sell their premium (expensive) oils, I'm confident that there is a valid concern. I'm just not sure if the concern is exclusively in regard to using their 506.01 for extended drain intervals in NA.

This Friday 3/5 I will draw a sample of Motul 506.01 from my TDI that has been in service for 5000+ miles and send it to the lab for analysis. We can then directly compare its UOA lab results to the Castrol 505.01 results from my previous 5000 mile UOA.

While one 506.01 UOA [an n of 1] is nearly meaningless, it could provide an indication of what we may expect to see in future 506.01 UOAs.

Lastly, ELF's 506.01 oil "ELF EVOLUTION CRV 503.00 / 506.00 / 506.01" will be available in North America this month [March 05]. I doubt ELF would be importing their 506.01 to NA at this point in the game if it did not indeed offer some distinct advantages over 505.01 products.

Cheers!
 

SUNRG

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Roanoke, VA
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None currently. Previously owned 04 Golf TDI & 05 Passat GLS Wagon TDI
SUNRG, do you think ELF is any better or worse than Motul? Or just them meeting the spec would make them equal?
The 506.01 spec does not make them equal - it establishes minimum requirements - which in the case of 506.01 are very specific and demanding.

I don't know which is better. I also don't know if Motul's concerns are regarding their 506.01, or the 506.01 specification in general.

There has been some speculation that the 507.xx oils are being introduced in part to address the 506.01 concerns, but 507.xx is a low SAPS "Clean performance Technology" oil designed for use in new VWs with soot particle filters.

While 507.xx may include and exceed the 506.01 specification, my understanding is that 506.01 is still a superior specification to 505.01.

To be clear, the above is my understanding. We should have our first 506.01 UOA next week, and hopefully with ELF 506.01 becoming available, we'll have some ELF 506.01 UOAs for comparison in the not too distant future.

Cheers!
 

emka

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Aug 18, 2004
Location
Britton, Mi. USA
TDI
2005 Passat variant black
sunrg, Where is the Elf 506.01 available at after 3/5? I will have 10,000 mi. in about 2 weeks and would like to use the Elf. Thanks, emka.
 

Long_Range

Veteran Member
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Location
Arthur, IL , USA
TDI
Jetta Sedan GL 2004
I am curious of the oil analysis of the 506.01. As long as it would be good for a 10K oil change, I think that would be better all the way around, for both the engine and economy
I'm sure it's good for more than 10K just as the 505.01 usually is. However in order to recoup your cost to the break even point you need to run longer drain intervals than with the less expensive oils. Although as fuel prices keep going up this recovery period keeps going down.
 

SUNRG

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Oct 19, 2003
Location
Roanoke, VA
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None currently. Previously owned 04 Golf TDI & 05 Passat GLS Wagon TDI
Eight 18 litre cases of ELF Evolution CRV 506.01 are due to arrive in the Linden, NJ warehouse this month, and until US distributers inventory the 506.01 it can be purchased directly from:

Laurent Siret
Market Development Manager
Elf Moto Division
TOTAL Lubricants USA, Inc.
5 North Stiles Street
Linden, NJ 07036
USA
laurent.siret@total-us.com
908.374.5063

Remember that this is an expensive oil, ~$18 per litre before shipping. My understanding is that they will only sell 18 litre cases and the cost, shipped UPS, for a case of ELF Evolution CRV 0w-30 506.01 is $350.

In an interesting turn of events, I visited Impex to see their current Motul 506.01 pricing - and the item listing states "DO NOT SELL". I called and they said Motul 506.01 is currently not available, is not currently recommended by Motul for the US market, but it may become available again and he's keeping a list of persons interested in the Motul 506.01 and will contact them when and if it becomes available again.

so for a while, Motul 506.01 was available but ELF 506.01 was not. Now it seems ELF's 506.01 will be available and Motul's 506.01 will not be


this morning i mailed a sample of Motul 506.01 with 5047 miles on it to the lab for analysis. if the results compare favorably to my previous 505.01 analysis, maybe the UOAs will help Motul justify importing more 506.01...

Regarding warranty:
a Canadian ELF 506.01 user inquired with VW regarding his TDI's warranty and ELF 506.01 and the answer he recieved from VW was "you can of course use ELF EVOLUTION CRV 506.01 but you need to stick with the oil change intervals indicated in the car manual”.

Elf 506.01 usage recommendations for North American PD TDIs:
"So user of 506.01 in the US will not be able to use the extended oil change intervals but will gain on the better protection, full synthetic, fuel economy side and better low viscosity (better for cold starts)."

Lastly, I've asked for details regarding "long term test results for Elf’s Evolution CRV 0w-30" and "an explanation of the engine protection Elf’s Evolution CRV 0w-30 provides compared to the 505.01 specification". Laurent has forwarded my questions to the ELF Technical and Research Center in Solaize, France and we hope to hear back shortly.

Cheers!
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
Regarding warranty:


a Canadian ELF 506.01 user inquired with VW regarding his TDI's warranty and ELF 506.01 and the answer he recieved from VW was "you can of course use ELF EVOLUTION CRV 506.01 but you need to stick with the oil change intervals indicated in the car manual”.

Makes complete sense! thanks again for tracking all of this, SUNRG....it seems like things are in transition.



How long for you to see the results from this latest UOA?
 

03_01_TDI

Banned
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Dec 10, 2003
Location
Denmark
TDI
Na
In an interesting turn of events, I visited Impex to see their current Motul 506.01 pricing - and the item listing states "DO NOT SELL". I called and they said Motul 506.01 is currently not available, is not currently recommended by Motul for the US market, but it may become available again and he's keeping a list of persons interested in the Motul 506.01 and will contact them when and if it becomes available again.
I had orderd the 506.01 from Impex last week. But I was shipped 505.01 I called last night and WAS not told about this. I sure hope that IMPEX still has 11 liters to fix my order
 

SUNRG

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Location
Roanoke, VA
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None currently. Previously owned 04 Golf TDI & 05 Passat GLS Wagon TDI
A little additional news...

There are at least 2 cases [12 litres / case] of Motul 506.01 still available in the US. Contact A.J. at:

http://bobbyarchermotorsports.com
sales@bobbyarchermotorsports.com
817-877-1772 or 817-877-0025

When I last spoke with A.J. (a few months ago) he was selling a case of the Motul 506.01, with 2 free bosch or mann oil filters (your choice) and free shipping for $205.
 

nicklockard

Torque Dorque
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Aug 15, 2004
Location
Arizona
TDI
2010 Touareg Tdi w/factory Tow PCKG
Guess I'll have to wait for this oil to hit our shores from the stratosphere before I can justify it
That guy must have sold both cases. A search of his site came up empty for "506.01"
 
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