06 jetta cranks no start

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Hey all. I have usually been able to work through the bugs with this thing over the last 10 years by reading here or chasing down the problem but this one im having issues with and losing my mind.

2006 jetta BRM 5spd with 198k on the ticker. Specs are Malone stage 4,, stage2 smf clutch, PD 140 turbo. Billet cam and lifters.

I parked the car about a year and a half ago do to a miss. Thought to be injector when looking at the vcds and didnt have the money to fix. fast forward to now.

New battery and fired right up with a miss still so i checked compression and it was #1-205 #2-306 #3-287 #4-267 (pretty sure i cooked it with high egt and now have a gauge in it)
It ran but not well as you can assume and i drove about 10 miles to wash engine bay. I pulled the engine and rebuilt, new everything but pistons (all parts from ID parts). head and block went to machine shop light hone on block and head was reworked. Cam looked great still 15k on it but put in new lifters.
New rear seal with crank install tool so i didnt goof that up.
This is like the 3rd timing belt ive done on it so i have the tools and all timing is in check

Sent injectors to DBW 1043 injector overhaul
Fired up and ran better but something still not right so i warmed it up to set timing and it was still running pretty rough and got very hard to get started over the next week or so while i was trying to chase down the issue. So i pulled lift pump and had algae in tank, replaced pump and cleaned tank out and blew the lines, cleaned filter housing, new filter. just cranks and no start. ran an auto scan and no codes. It shows crank signal (cant remember which blocks that was in). Ordered a new tandem pump (kerma) installed and cranked about 10 seconds and started but had very slow throttle response. Was going to run to warm up to check torsion value but it ran less than 5 min and was like you turned the key off. If i unhook the battery and walk away for a few hrs i can crank on it for a while and it will do the same thing.

I swapped the relays on the outside box with another running car and that made no difference. cranks and cranks even after the 45 seconds crank. unplugged cam sensor and still nothing. All fuses are good. I have not messed with any of the relays behind interior panel yet.
Lift pump is working and i get the shot of fuel at start up (under 10psi because my gauge will move but not reach the 10psi starting point). I dont have the right fitting to check at the side of the tandem pump for my gauge but i will work on that.

Wish it would just throw a code to point me in the right direction. VCDS and Snappy apollo D8 shows nothing either. Any input or ideas would be greatly appreciated

Thanks, Scott
 

DivineChaos

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Correct. I am looking at wiring and testing but havent found anything as of yet.
Well I've heard of modules taking down the can network. Even just watched a vid of the pass foot well having enough water under the carpet to flood the computer there taking the network down
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Well I've heard of modules taking down the can network. Even just watched a vid of the pass foot well having enough water under the carpet to flood the computer there taking the network down
I swapped the engine harness that was in way better shape than mine and under hood fuse panel for grins from a parts car i have. I dont have the communication error anymore. Still showing the tuner not activated in the digital radio and aux heater defective. wouldnt think that those would cause it not to start but at this point im not sure.

It started after several attempts and ran for a few min then like key shut off again and back to just cranking.

Digital radio 02635
Steering assist 00778
Aux heater 00361
 

DivineChaos

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
I swapped the engine harness that was in way better shape than mine and under hood fuse panel for grins from a parts car i have. I dont have the communication error anymore. Still showing the tuner not activated in the digital radio and aux heater defective. wouldnt think that those would cause it not to start but at this point im not sure.

It started after several attempts and ran for a few min then like key shut off again and back to just cranking.

Digital radio 02635
Steering assist 00778
Aux heater 00361
Alright, so you it can communicate with every module now.
All your dash lights work? Do you see some rpm while cranking?
 

DivineChaos

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Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Alright. So you have fuel. I presume airpath is clear. Does it have compression? Timing belt good? Working on it in a heated shop? If so give it a shot of either.
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Alright. So you have fuel. I presume airpath is clear. Does it have compression? Timing belt good? Working on it in a heated shop? If so give it a shot of either.
Just checked compression since rebuild.
#1 251
#2 258
#3 259
#4 266

I thought it would be much higher than that...

65 degrees here

It will run on either

Wondering if fuel cooler is plugged or something
 

DivineChaos

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Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Things I found. Tandem pump bad? Tank pickup bad..
Both new. Lift from Id parts, tandem from Kerma (we all know how that goes though)

Just bypassed the whole car with a fuel pump from a chevy pickupo (15 psi) out of a bucket and it still will not run.
 

DivineChaos

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Both new. Lift from Id parts, tandem from Kerma (we all know how that goes though)

Just bypassed the whole car with a fuel pump from a chevy pickupo (15 psi) out of a bucket and it still will not run.
These have electric injectors? If so for some reason they ain't firing.
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
These have electric injectors? If so for some reason they ain't firing.
Yes electric. Thats what im finding out now but why.... These things are so secretive online its crazy.

Glow plugs are white like no fuel to fire on them and they were brand new.

ECM im thinking but i would think it would throw a code or something and not just no start. I'll check the injetctors to see if they are shooting power to them. I dont have a noid light so ill try the things said in what you sent.
 

DivineChaos

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Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
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mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Yes electric. Thats what im finding out now but why.... These things are so secretive online its crazy.

Glow plugs are white like no fuel to fire on them and they were brand new.

ECM im thinking but i would think it would throw a code or something and not just no start. I'll check the injetctors to see if they are shooting power to them. I dont have a noid light so ill try the things said in what you sent.
these have security? Is the dash reading the key? You could monitor injector pulses with vag com.
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
these have security? Is the dash reading the key? You could monitor injector pulses with vag com.
Yes but immobilizer is working. I can monitor injectors but nothing is happening while cranking. I have cleaned all the grounds and even the one under the cowl and still nothing. I just dont know how to use the vcds to work with me i guess. I have been going through all the measuring blocks and checking things and seeing what specs are and moving through. A friend sent me the wiring diagram from pro demand so im checking things now. still no codes and its aggravating to say the least lol. Its pretty safe to say injectors are not firing....
 

DivineChaos

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Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
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mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Yes but immobilizer is working. I can monitor injectors but nothing is happening while cranking. I have cleaned all the grounds and even the one under the cowl and still nothing. I just dont know how to use the vcds to work with me i guess. I have been going through all the measuring blocks and checking things and seeing what specs are and moving through. A friend sent me the wiring diagram from pro demand so im checking things now. still no codes and its aggravating to say the least lol. Its pretty safe to say injectors are not firing....
Only thing I can think is the tandem pump isn't producing enough pressure.. I'm kinda out of my depth here. The other member could probably help more. @oilhammer or @Mongler98 if you could help this guy out.
 
Last edited:

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006

I did find this... if this is true then my compression is way too low. I'm going to try another gauge just to see. I haven't used this particular one very much at all. It's a mityvac brand.

It just doesn't seem possible though because I just rebuilt it. Everything is new but the looked over 15k cam and pistons. Only reason I rebuilt it was because of compression numbers with said gauge in question.... I will try another tomorrow and see. Dang head scratcher for sure.
 

DivineChaos

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi

I did find this... if this is true then my compression is way too low. I'm going to try another gauge just to see. I haven't used this particular one very much at all. It's a mityvac brand.

It just doesn't seem possible though because I just rebuilt it. Everything is new but the looked over 15k cam and pistons. Only reason I rebuilt it was because of compression numbers with said gauge in question.... I will try another tomorrow and see. Dang head scratcher for sure.
Yeah, your numbers are low. But it should still run with those numbers. And you have no smoke out the tail pipe when cranking.... Could disconnect glowplugs and give a spritz of either and once it pops off use wd40 so cylinders have lube. Maybe it'll catch and keep running?
I'm new to these smaller diesels. Most of my experience is in older ones. Once had one that would only start on either due to low compression. But once she caught, it was fine.
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Yeah, your numbers are low. But it should still run with those numbers. And you have no smoke out the tail pipe when cranking.... Could disconnect glowplugs and give a spritz of either and once it pops off use wd40 so cylinders have lube. Maybe it'll catch and keep running?
I'm new to these smaller diesels. Most of my experience is in older ones. Once had one that would only start on either due to low compression. But once she caught, it was fine.
Yeah it will bust off and run long enough to burn it out and peter out. I'm used to 3406 Cat/ 60 series detroit etc. big stuff. This is my car i use to drive all over thet state in to machine those but anyways the only thing i can think of is when the head was redone that the valve styems were not ground enough to match the seat grind and its holding it open a tad in turn probably hurting cam and lifters at least eventually.. crazy thinking but possible.. but then again why would the compression be low fron the start and only gain 30 psi ish after rebuild. grandted i used old pistons but still.. baffling as heck.

It doesnt even like ether so im trying to be careful, it made some noises that even i said ouch. I have given somethings a snort that would make its creator cringe :LOL:

Going to test ecm power/ground and pulse to injectors and go from there. Other that that ill send the spare ecu off and have the immobilizer disabled and try that. I have a small fortune in this thing to turn back and the show must go on. I wont leave a dead end thread because that is what im running across with the last months worth of searches even if im the only one to reply. I do appreciate the ideas a lot. Its probably something simple and make me look like an arse but thats ok too..
 

DivineChaos

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Yeah it will bust off and run long enough to burn it out and peter out. I'm used to 3406 Cat/ 60 series detroit etc. big stuff. This is my car i use to drive all over thet state in to machine those but anyways the only thing i can think of is when the head was redone that the valve styems were not ground enough to match the seat grind and its holding it open a tad in turn probably hurting cam and lifters at least eventually.. crazy thinking but possible.. but then again why would the compression be low fron the start and only gain 30 psi ish after rebuild. grandted i used old pistons but still.. baffling as heck.

It doesnt even like ether so im trying to be careful, it made some noises that even i said ouch. I have given somethings a snort that would make its creator cringe :LOL:

Going to test ecm power/ground and pulse to injectors and go from there. Other that that ill send the spare ecu off and have the immobilizer disabled and try that. I have a small fortune in this thing to turn back and the show must go on. I wont leave a dead end thread because that is what im running across with the last months worth of searches even if im the only one to reply. I do appreciate the ideas a lot. Its probably something simple and make me look like an arse but thats ok too..
Oh I know about spending wayy too much. I've got lots into my car for add-ons. If you had everything resurfaced and have a proper headgasket. You shouldn't have valves hang open.
You could remove the valve cover and check.. with a broke in rebuild, you should have 500psi.. but your not getting fuel. Possible injectors are plugged... it's a head scratcher.. if it was immobilizer it should fire and die. And being you get fuel after the tandem pump...
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Oh I know about spending wayy too much. I've got lots into my car for add-ons. If you had everything resurfaced and have a proper headgasket. You shouldn't have valves hang open.
You could remove the valve cover and check.. with a broke in rebuild, you should have 500psi.. but your not getting fuel. Possible injectors are plugged... it's a head scratcher.. if it was immobilizer it should fire and die. And being you get fuel after the tandem pump...
Had a faulty compression gauge. They are at 380 across the board. Checked the Injection start BTDC while cranking and it is at 5.6... highlight box shows it needs to be 4.0 - 2.0 and also the torsion value while cranking jumps from 62.2 back to 0.0. Anyone know if this is normal?

Every video i have found shows all of what everything should be at idle and nothing if it will not start or what to check. I have a hard time believing it is timimg when i can pin the crank and cam but i am missing something.
 

DivineChaos

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Location
Minnesota
TDI
mk6 jetta sportwagen tdi
Had a faulty compression gauge. They are at 380 across the board. Checked the Injection start BTDC while cranking and it is at 5.6... highlight box shows it needs to be 4.0 - 2.0 and also the torsion value while cranking jumps from 62.2 back to 0.0. Anyone know if this is normal?

Every video i have found shows all of what everything should be at idle and nothing if it will not start or what to check. I have a hard time believing it is timimg when i can pin the crank and cam but i am missing something.
Could be a bad cam or crank sensor then. I've heard it doesn't throw a code most times.
 

Jbwoo

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Oct 28, 2018
Location
Kingston WA
TDI
15 GSW 06 Jetta BRM
Make 100% sure all of the fuel lines that you touched aren’t plugged. I have had the inner plastic lining fold back over inside, and limit how much fuel gets by. It was at the end of a line that had been recently cut. When I was pushing the line back on, the plastic folded over, creating a 1way valve. Spent many days and such and finally got it figured out.
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Make 100% sure all of the fuel lines that you touched aren’t plugged. I have had the inner plastic lining fold back over inside, and limit how much fuel gets by. It was at the end of a line that had been recently cut. When I was pushing the line back on, the plastic folded over, creating a 1way valve. Spent many days and such and finally got it figured out.
I will check that out, thank you!

Just pulled the fuel cooler down and blew compressed air through it. Figured it wouldnt hurt since it did have nasty fuel in it. Swapping crank sensors now and ohm wires to ecu just to be sure.
 

scottsTDI

Active member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Location
Tuttle, Ok
TDI
2006
Blew through all lines from front to tank. Already bypassed car before. swapped crank sensor with the parts car and still reading just over 200 rpm just like before. put original cam sensor back in and still nothing.

ohm wirng to crank and cam sensors, ohmed sensors with old sensors and both matched.

Almost something to do with the immobilizer or ecu. not getting fuel to spray at all. Cranks and cranks. Even with glow plugs out you would think it would puff diesel if it was spraying and i am not sure what else to check with vcds.
Anyone have any info on cranking other that it needs to idle? Fuel pressure comes up to nearly 10psi from lift pump and flows through tandem and back...
Send other ecu off to have immobilizer turned off and try that? Im lost, ready to put the pos out back where it was and write off the 3k invested at thist point :LOL::unsure: just baffleing that with this much technology and there are things that will not throw a code. Guess im the only one with this issue.
I'm definintely ready for it to be something simple that i have looked over 1k times and make me feel stupider than i already feel.
 
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