2006 Jetta BRM Camshaft Problems 58K and 100K - Need Some Advise

Hi All,

I am new to the forum and could use some suggestions regarding my 2006 Jetta TDI. I had an issue with the camshaft at ~58K and it was replaced at the dealer since it was still under warranty. I am now at ~107K and have been having similar symptoms for a while (hoped it was a fuel filter or the glow plugs instead) so my husband and I took off the valve cover and discovered it looks like it is time for a new camshaft again.

Seeing as my tires shouldn't last longer than my camshaft I have reach a point where I think the OEM design or the metal used could be the problem and I am starting to look at alternatives so that I can keep the car and get it running properly again.

Any thoughts on what the best alternative camshaft is?

Debating trying this but not sure it is is worth it
http://www.kermatdi.com/servlet/Detail?category=Colt+Cams&no=8220¶m_referer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kermatdi.com%2Fservlet%2FCategories%3Fcategory%3DColt%2BCams&searchpath=19013569

How many others have had a similar problems?

I mainly ask because I spoke to the dealer and VW directly and they claimed it was only me but I think they are full of it.

I have pictures showing the damage that I can share if need be.

Thank you all in advance for your help and feedback.

The first question is, what kind of oil are you using?

The BRM camshaft has had some problems but with the right oil it should last a lot longer than 50K miles. The wrong oil, which unfortunately does likely include the 5W30 that most dealers use, could result in serious wear in that few miles.

Let's say that you have evidence that the dealer has changed your oil every 10K miles, just like the owner's manual says. You could try to convince VW that the oil they use is killing cams, but what are the chances that they'd be even the slightest bit interested?

That's probably a good cam kit from kerma. Also, Frank Irving has a great kit with his own cam design and modified cam bearings that increase oil to the bearings and lifter tops, which should decrease wear. He is user Franko6 on the forum, and this thread has info on his cam kit: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=326858

I think you're better off getting one of these aftermarket replacements, and then make sure to run a good 5w40 505.01 oil -- should be good for many more miles that way.

I installed Frank's kit in March and have 14k miles on it. Haven't peeked under valve cover lately, but I'm thinking it's doing fine. Frank is also very helpful if you do the install on your own.

Thank you for the recommendation and the business dieselpony..

We have hundreds of our cam design sold and installed and plenty of happy customers.

As for the dealership, WHAT A CROCK! They KNOW about the problem. As a matter of fact, they probably get bad cams in their shop weekly, if not DAILY. The dealership generally try to swap the entire cylinder head, which is completely unnecessary. If they do replace only the cam and lifters, the problem remains the same. The engineering of the cam is the cause of the problem

I would recommend getting the cam, lifters and seal changed out before the damage goes to the oil pump. Also, if the engine starts making a ticking noise, STOP! Once the lifter is worn through, the next thing that happens is the plunger from the lifter ruins the valve stem. That will mandate the removal of the cylinder head and add over $1000 to the bill. It's better to catch it early.

Our design to alleviate the problem is comprehensive. We sell a kit that covers all of the cam wear issues and comes with a 3 year, unlimited mileage warranty. We pulled out the stops and made a chrome-plated cam journal that is smoother, harder, and has better heat transfer than the stock cam journal and still priced competitively. We also have a choice of cam profiles that are designed for the BEW, BHW or the BRM.

DP is also correct about technical support. There are procedures that we have developed to make the job simpler and get the best results. We have a good 'how to' that we send with each kit. If you need timing tools or if you would like recommendations from our list of vendors that have installed our kits, we will be happy to direct you to a competent installer.

Let us know how we can help.

Sorry to hear of your troubles. Yes, as others have posted oil is a BIG deal with these engines. the recommended oil is a 5w30 with a specification of 505.01. Clearly the original camshafts were not made correctly in my opinion. I''m wondering if when at 58K your cam was replaced it was done using one of the older (original ) camshafts, therefore it failed again. VW did upgrade the stock cams at some point so now if you buy one from one of the vendors here on the Club you'll likely get the proper pieces. I know that unless the lifters are black in color they're not the updated ones. My replacement parts came from here:

http://www.idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=29_125&products_id=1318

Hopefully you'll get it fixed and it won't be a problem again.
Good Luck

Sootman said:

Sorry to hear of your troubles. Yes, as others have posted oil is a BIG deal with these engines. the recommended oil is a 5w30 with a specification of 505.01.

Click to expand...

Correction. The recommended oil is a 5w40 with a 505.01 spec. Right in the manual. Dealers sadly often use the "alternate" weight, of 5w30, which experience has shown us is not ideal for these engines.

I have BRM cars with over 300k miles and the valve covers have never been off. The correct oil works in most cases.

oilhammer said:

Correction. The recommended oil is a 5w40 with a 505.01 spec. Right in the manual. Dealers sadly often use the "alternate" weight, of 5w30, which experience has shown us is not ideal for these engines.

I have BRM cars with over 300k miles and the valve covers have never been off. The correct oil works in most cases.

Click to expand...

My manual says you can use 5W-30 when 5W-40 is not available as long as it meets 505.01 specs.

I agree though, 5W-40 oil really puts a stop on PD cam wear. All the worn ones have confirmed 5W-30 history.

turbocharged798 said:

My manual says you can use 5W-30 when 5W-40 is not available as long as it meets 505.01 specs.

.

Click to expand...

Correct, it also says the car left the factory with 5w40. That says to me they clearly PREFER and RECOMMEND a 40 instead of a 30. And since a 40 is available (and you can even get it from Volkswagen, they even have a part number: G-052-167-M2) there really is no reason for anyone, even a dealer, to be using a 5w30 motor oil in a PD or any of the gassers that also call for a 5w40 with a 502.00 spec for that matter.

turbocharged798 said:

My manual says you can use 5W-30 when 5W-40 is not available as long as it meets 505.01 specs.
I agree though, 5W-40 oil really puts a stop on PD cam wear. All the worn ones have confirmed 5W-30 history.

Click to expand...

Not all. The dealer replaced my head at 45K miles, now I'm at 110 and at least one of the chamfers on my cam is gone. I'll have to change it at the next TB change, due in 40K miles, if not sooner. This was a reman head from VW that they replaced due to a glowplug disaster and subsequent threats of lawsuit. I don't know what kind of lifters, and I'm assuming that a reman head comes with a new camshaft/lifter set.

My car has had a steady diet of 5W40 pentosin II, except for the first 3K miles (45-48K) that I ran the dealer's 5W30 castrol 505.01.

I'm now a believer in CJ-4 oils, using TDT.

The best I can glean from the variety of PD cam stories is that it's somewhat unpredictable. There doesn't seem to be any guarantee regardless of what you do, but there does seem to be more success with CJ-4 oils and the black lifters.

halocline said:

...
My car has had a steady diet of 5W40 pentosin II, except for the first 3K miles (45-48K) that I ran the dealer's 5W30 castrol 505.01.

.

Click to expand...

That always seems to be the case. And since I have seen such an example start to have dramatic cam wear in as little as 500 miles, I will still go with the 5w30 detroying cams, and likely what has caused your problems as well.

All too common "I only ever run this oil EXCEPT THIS ONE TIME...."

Yep, get a Franko6 cam kit and be done with it.

Firstly, thank you all for your prompt feedback this is great.

I have always used the 505.01 specification. I know that depending on where I have been living the 5W-40 was much more difficult to get my hands on. The dealer suggested the first camshaft failure was a result of using the wrong oil; they also normally are the ones pushing the 5W-30. I had a spare bottle in my car which confirmed that the oil met their specification so they could not blame that and did not have an alternative reason for the wear.

One thing I will say is that I am not unhappy with the dealer I went to for this. They have been very good considering the vehicle was not purchased there. Obviously, I am very disappointed that it is broken again but I think that is more of the VW problem than the dealers.

I will have to confirm when I get home tonight if the oil I currently have is all 5W-40 or if some of it is the 5W-30. I know that I have used the Castrol and Valvoline 505.01 oils and change my oil about ~5K(probably overkill but I really do love my car). Also my understanding was this oil's additives package was necessary to protect the injectors more so then to mitigate this problem. Is that correct? Although, it would make sense that the higher viscosity would protect the cam as well.

oilhammer said:

That always seems to be the case. And since I have seen such an example start to have dramatic cam wear in as little as 500 miles, I will still go with the 5w30 detroying cams, and likely what has caused your problems as well.

All too common "I only ever run this oil EXCEPT THIS ONE TIME...."

Click to expand...

It has occurred to me that possibly the cam wasn't broken in correctly, maybe something happened very quickly, I won't ever know because the first time I checked the cam lobes was at 100K miles. But, I'm still going with TDT.

I could see dramatic cam wear in 500 miles with really bad oil, but this was oil that met VW's spec. I suppose it's also possible that something was not done correctly in the initial break-in or pre-lube when the car was first started after the head/piston/rings replacement.

VW spec doesn't mean squat for cam protection, as clearly been shown over and over. IMO, the 505.01 spec is a complete farce and the biggest problem is the weight of the oil.

halocline said:

It has occurred to me that possibly the cam wasn't broken in correctly, maybe something happened very quickly, I won't ever know because the first time I checked the cam lobes was at 100K miles. But, I'm still going with TDT.

I could see dramatic cam wear in 500 miles with really bad oil, but this was oil that met VW's spec. I suppose it's also possible that something was not done correctly in the initial break-in or pre-lube when the car was first started after the head/piston/rings replacement.

Click to expand...

What is the proper break in and pre-lube procedure that should be used?

turbocharged798 said:

My manual says you can use 5W-30 when 5W-40 is not available as long as it meets 505.01 specs.

I agree though, 5W-40 oil really puts a stop on PD cam wear. All the worn ones have confirmed 5W-30 history.

Click to expand...

The problem is they never explain in owners manual where can be use 5w30 and 5w40.
5w30 can be use as well and there will not be wear,
BUT,
5w30 can be use in climate under 85F.
Since north America in not under that spec we HAVE TO use 5w40.

TDI-Em said:

What is the proper break in and pre-lube procedure that should be used?

Click to expand...

There seem to be varying opinions on that, but one thing that seems to be often repeated is that initially the engine should be run at 2000 RPMS or a bit higher for several minutes rather than allowed to idle. I assume there's some assembly lube used to protect the cam before the oil can get pumped there during initial start up.

But, one of the mechanics will probably chime in with a better answer.

Cam Photos

Pictures of the camshaft.

http://s1278.photobucket.com/albums/y510/TDI-Em/

Ufff, is it just me or there's lots of metal debris in that head?

Hope you get your car fixed without much suffering!

I can't see much in the photos. It looks like one of the chamfers is gone and I see some scratches in another lobe, but it looks like you were taking photos of the roller bearing for the PD units. The valve lobes are the skinny lobes tucked in between. It's not that easy to get clear photos of those, I bet you need to get really close and manually focus on the lobe edges themselves.

Where we see the greatest indication of cam wear, strangely enough, is the base circle will be galled. That is the odd thing with this cam, as that is where the cam should have the lowest pressures and virtually not be touching the cam with the lifters.

But if you see that damage, you have the beginning of the end. Also, as it has been pointed out, there is a chamfer the goes completely around both sides of each cam lobe. If the chamfer disappears or is reduced toward the top of the lobe, you have damage. When the chamfer is gone, you have about .006"-.010" of wear. That is substantial.

Usually, if the chamfer is gone, the life expectancy of the cam is less than 25,000 miles before it pops a hole through a cam follower. When that happens, STOP DRIVING! The next thing that will happen is you ruin a valve stem and the head will have to come off. Your oil pump is ruined by that point and it needs replaced.

We perform a lot of this cam service, and developed much of the design and repairs for the elimination of the issue.

Let's see some of those pics of the exhaust lobes, top and base circle...

Btw:

We do not recommend any 5-30 weight 505.01 oils. Lower ambient temp or not, it's too risky.

My Local car dealer recommends 505.01 Pentosin 5W40HP2 Full Synthetic Oil.