Wet Floors - Leak at cabin filter and door (I think)

I have the crappy annoying thing happening with my 2002 Jetta wagon where the driver side front and rear floor boards are getting soaked (1-2 cups of water coming in on a good rain). I can see water coming in on the rear driver side floor from the air duct below the driver seat. And on a good rain, i can see water dripping in from the door (at the location of the little rubber gutter on the underside of the door, near the front speaker) at a good pace when it's really raining. I've read a bunch of threads but still have a few questions on how to solve this correctly:

1. Water in from pollen filter housing. I found this thread that summarized the same thing for a 04 Passat:

***** ****Begin Quote**********
I had some minor leaking around the base of the cabin filter tray. In case anyone missed it, I'll repeat...you must remove the entire cabin air filter housing to properly repair this (it wasn't hard if you ask me). In order to do it, you must remove the windsheild wipers and the cowl (the plastic trim at the base of the windsheild). There are nuts under caps that hold the wiper arms on splined shafts driven by the wiper motor. Use tape to mark the position of the wipers on the windsheild, pry the caps off with a small screwdriver, and unbolt the wiper arms. It may take a good tug to free the wiper arm from the splined shaft. With the wiper arms removed, remove two clips and one philips-head screw and the cowl can be lifted straight up in relation to the ground. It seals with a metal lip under it sort of like a zip-lock baggie would only with a little more strength. My advice is start at one edge and/or the other and work toward the center. Remove the cabin filter cover and the cabin filter. There are three small nuts that hold the bottom tray of the cabin filter housing (VW calls it a frame). The two of these closest to the fender/hood hinge may be difficult to get to unless you have some tight access 1/4" drive tools. Once unfastened, lift out the frame and you will see a bunch of debris and two seals underneath. The innermost seal is not at issue...its an airflow seal for the proper function of the air handling system. The outermost seal is some sort of closed cell foam and mine was actually torn from the factory and was also installed crooked. I chose to replace it with some strip Dum Dum (weatherstripping from a body shop). Any proper weatherstip of the appropriate size that can be made into a continuous loop should do the trick. Getting the right size and not having a gap are the keys. This "Dum Dum" that I used was similar to modeling clay, so it won't harden and it can be formed and connected, yet it doesn't sag or shrink.

Best of luck...and keep the cowl clean. Your vigilence will be rewarded by a lack of costly leaks.
++++++++++++++++++++++End of Quote+++++++++++++

Is the idea here to follow the above description and reseal the area where the bottom of the filter housing attaches to duct that leads to below the driver seat? Or to seal the housing against the frame of the car? I couldn't find any good pictures of this.

2. Leak in Door coming from where? Is there a shield on the door that prevents water (that is coming through seal of glass and window seal) from coming into the door? Can I just remove the rubber thing? Seems it's trapping water that is running down the perimeter of the door from the roof gutter. What's the likely culprit and way to fix this one?

Any thoughts are appreciated.

Thanks!
makoola



2.

Do you have a sunroof?? If so, do some searching on the roof drains. (There was a recall notice) They become clogged and even disconnected and pour water in onto the floor. Mine on the '03 came down thru the fuse panel on the drivers side.

It rains in CA?

If you have a sunroof, look at the drains, common problem, easy fix. The water goes everywhere, front and rear, side to side, leading you to pull your hair out seeking the source. The drains are little rubber tubes, pinched at the end that are located just under the upper hinge of the front doors.

So....sunroof?

No sunroof on car. I'm positive the water in the footwell of the rear driver side is coming out of the air duct that is under there. So I'm looking for detailed instructions on how to properly seal the cabin filter housing. Guess I'll have to take the whole thing apart and search for answers...Still confused about the driver door bringing in water. What purpose do those little rubber pieces do on the bottom side of the door?

I just had this happening in my 2001 Jetta, I took off the leaf guard, wipers, pulled the cabin air filter and box, and found a ton of pine needles and debris behind it essentially wicking water into the vents. I shop-vaced and cleaned all that stuff out, cleaned the gasket on the cabin air box, an put it back together. It rained hard the past week, and no water on the floor! Hurrah! Took forever to figure this one out though, I was convinced it was the sun roof, but surprisingly it was not.

Good luck!

RB

Makoola: any solutions to rubber door dam?

Makoola:

I have the same problem with water leaking in on driver-side door-jam/"toekick" at the exact (as close as I can tell) place where the rubber dams on the underside of the door contact the car body and door-jar/toe-kick.

This happens mostly when the car is parked on cant (driver side higher than passenger side due to road cant)
That side of the car was also in accident and door was replaced (issue started after repair and the shop claims thay are as stumped as I am on a fix). So maybe it has something to do with incomplete sealing within the door panel?

But the question still remains as to what would be the negatives to removing those rubber dams (which seemingly pool the water up high enough to overtop the rubber door seal and allow water to get into the crease where the toekick seals with the rubber seal)?

On my 03 I took it in for the sunroof recall and they cleaned them and still had the same problem. I took it back and they found where the windshield guy had put the cabin air filter cover in wrong and broke it. The water would run on top of the cover and find the crack. Good luck!

ahhhh found it

got motivated yesterday and removed all door trim and the door panel and took the hose to the car.

Just to recap the absolute knowns of my issue:
The water is definitely coming in over the door threshold gasket and plastic toekick trim along the driver seat. (not the fire wall, and I don't have a sunroof). The water coming in is visible. The issue was whether it was coming in and over that gasket because the rubber dams on the underside of the door's rubber gasket was damming the water and allowing a pool of water high enough to overtop the gasket (as opposed to diverting the water to the outside) OR the water was coming from the door itself (water getting into the door and draining down onto the door's plastic threshold rather than draining out the designed drain holes (which send the water onto the lower lip of the door's threshold rather than the top of the door's toekick trim). yeah, a picture probably would be worth a 1000 words..

In the end, it was neither.
Car parked on a double-cant- car facing slightly uphill such that hinge end of door frame is higher than lock end (water would drain towards the back corner of the door threshold). Car leaning side to side (passenger-curb side of the car is lower than driver side such that the door's threshold would tend to cup water a bit before it would flow outward)
Applying water to the roof above the door. And notably along the doors frame along the windshield such that some water would flow along the door frame near the hinges and onto the doors, threshold.
Removing the lower door gasket (i.e. removing the dams) still allowed leakage at the same spot on the gasket/toekick where the dam used to be. So, its not the dam.

What was happening was that water flowing down the door near the door's hinges (or down the door frame near the frame hinges) would somehow slip between the door and the rubber gasket that is part of the gasket/plastic toekick. The water slips in high enough on the rubber on the hinge end of the door opening (say within the first few inches of the gasket as the gasket makes the turn to go vertical at the front end of the door opening) such that the very small valley on the inside of the car created between the closed door and the top of the rubber gasket fills with water and then over tops at the lowest spot - which just happens to be, because of the double cant of the parked car, near the rear corner of the doors gasket. The fact that this is very close to where the door gasket rubber dam would be is apparently a coincidence of the way the car is parked. If the car is parked with the reverse cant, the water would over top near the front corner of the gasket since this would be the lowest spot.

This phenomena was only able to be seen when I removed the door panel.


------------
So this whole ordeal - wet floor and associated odor for the past 15 months comes down to an incomplete door seal between the door (metal) and the rubber gasket on that inside door seal. The seal is good enough all along the threshold such that water can pool up and overtop (rather than drain out) . But it is bad in one spot such that water can sneak in.

Not sure if the gasket is just old (2004), or this is a subtle effect from the door replacement (accident repair). Now that I sleuthed it, we'll see if the bodyshop will fix it (rather than admitting complete dumbfoundedness as they have in the past).

If they balk, I'll prob try some of the various fixes used for the wind noise problems I’ve come across here.

----------------
If anyone has any suggestion on creating a tighter seal with the existing gasket.....

correction to last

dug a little deeper in search of the exact spot where the water slips past the seal.

Was wrong. Turns out it is the most obvious of leaks.
Water is seeping in along the lower seal of the inside door panel (vapor seal I guess). This the the metalic panel (grey on my car) to which the the wiring harnesses and speaker are attached. I have a leak coming from the bottom of the speaker housing and more prominant leaks from under the seal (seal is somee sort of caulk or paste compound) of the door panel. Water that makes it past that seal is essentially "inside" the car's cabin and it flows on top of the rubber gasket on the threshold, fills the valley created by the door-to-gasket seal, over-tops at the lowest spot.

So water applied to the drivers window only (or area where mirror mounts to door), is all it takes to cause the leak. Upper door seal, winshield, cowling etc are not at issue.

Reading other posts there was sometimes mention of leaks occuring after a window replacement. Well, this could be the issue. 13 months of dealing with leaks and it seems to be the most obvious causes. Occam's razor.

awesome help.
Clarificaion. Did you remove the old seal/gasket material (it looks like foam) on the inner door panel, and then apply bead of sealant?
Or did you elave the old material in plave and just embed everything in a new bead of sealant/

Also, what type of sealant did you use? gen purpose silicone caulk from hardware store? Or a "specialty" product from auto shop (e.g. Permatex Black silicone)?

I suppose that either will still allow the panel to be pulled in case of future window-related repairs (my body shop wanted to polyu the panel in place since that wa what they had around the shop. An $8k repair and they are reluctant to take responsibility for this minor issue claiming they never saw such a problem and there's not much to do. So much for a little innovation from professionals).

I'm thinking of adding an flap of polysheet on the interior side of the metal door cover that would hang down past the level of the seal (flashing all on the inside of the door cavity)).

makoola said:

I have the crappy annoying thing happening with my 2002 Jetta wagon where the driver side front and rear floor boards are getting soaked (1-2 cups of water coming in on a good rain). I can see water coming in on the rear driver side floor from the air duct below the driver seat. And on a good rain, i can see water dripping in from the door (at the location of the little rubber gutter on the underside of the door, near the front speaker) at a good pace when it's really raining. I've read a bunch of threads but still have a few questions on how to solve this correctly:
1. Water in from pollen filter housing. I found this thread that summarized the same thing for a 04 Passat:
***** ****Begin Quote**********
I had some minor leaking around the base of the cabin filter tray. In case anyone missed it, I'll repeat...you must remove the entire cabin air filter housing to properly repair this (it wasn't hard if you ask me). In order to do it, you must remove the windsheild wipers and the cowl (the plastic trim at the base of the windsheild). There are nuts under caps that hold the wiper arms on splined shafts driven by the wiper motor. Use tape to mark the position of the wipers on the windsheild, pry the caps off with a small screwdriver, and unbolt the wiper arms. It may take a good tug to free the wiper arm from the splined shaft. With the wiper arms removed, remove two clips and one philips-head screw and the cowl can be lifted straight up in relation to the ground. It seals with a metal lip under it sort of like a zip-lock baggie would only with a little more strength. My advice is start at one edge and/or the other and work toward the center. Remove the cabin filter cover and the cabin filter. There are three small nuts that hold the bottom tray of the cabin filter housing (VW calls it a frame). The two of these closest to the fender/hood hinge may be difficult to get to unless you have some tight access 1/4" drive tools. Once unfastened, lift out the frame and you will see a bunch of debris and two seals underneath. The innermost seal is not at issue...its an airflow seal for the proper function of the air handling system. The outermost seal is some sort of closed cell foam and mine was actually torn from the factory and was also installed crooked. I chose to replace it with some strip Dum Dum (weatherstripping from a body shop). Any proper weatherstip of the appropriate size that can be made into a continuous loop should do the trick. Getting the right size and not having a gap are the keys. This "Dum Dum" that I used was similar to modeling clay, so it won't harden and it can be formed and connected, yet it doesn't sag or shrink.
Best of luck...and keep the cowl clean. Your vigilence will be rewarded by a lack of costly leaks.
++++++++++++++++++++++End of Quote+++++++++++++
Is the idea here to follow the above description and reseal the area where the bottom of the filter housing attaches to duct that leads to below the driver seat? Or to seal the housing against the frame of the car? I couldn't find any good pictures of this.
2. Leak in Door coming from where? Is there a shield on the door that prevents water (that is coming through seal of glass and window seal) from coming into the door? Can I just remove the rubber thing? Seems it's trapping water that is running down the perimeter of the door from the roof gutter. What's the likely culprit and way to fix this one?
Any thoughts are appreciated.
Thanks!
makoola
2.

Click to expand...

I have a similar problem with my 03 Jetta, Iw as out of town for a week and there was heavy(ier than usual) rain in seattle while I was gone. When I came home, there was about two inches of water on the floor of the driver's side rear passenger and a smaller amount of water on the driver's side front floor. Everything else is bone dry, there is no water on the ceiling, or seats and the carpet by the doors seems to be dry. The trunk is dry as well. There is no sunroof. The car hasn't been in any major accidents that I am aware of though I am not the first owner. I replaced the front window and driver's window after someone broke into the car but this was years ago and I have lived in seattle for 7 months without problems with water.

From what I have read, it seems like this pollen filter issue is the most likely cause. It would make sense that water was somehow tracking up through the vent on the floor in the rear driver's side and soaking the carpet.

I'd like to have the parts needed in hand before I go ahead and pull the wipers and cowl off. Does anyone know the part number for replacement pollen filter seal etc? What is this dum dum mentioned above? any other experience replacing the pollen filter and seal/gasket?

do yourself a favor and remove the fender liners and clean all the gunk there
The cowl drains are clogged and the water seeps in the cabin

Dimitri16V said:

do yourself a favor and remove the fender liners and clean all the gunk there
The cowl drains are clogged and the water seeps in the cabin

Click to expand...

Can you show me some pics of what you are referring to? do you mean where are the cowl drains?

It involves pulling away the rear of the front wheel liners. Access is easy, you just remove a few screws and pull it back/away from the body. Water that collects in the rain tray under the ECU runs down there and that area fills with debris pretty regularly.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=372377

316MusicMan said:

Do you have trouble locking or unlocking your doors with the key fob? As weird as this sounds, simply replacing the CR2032 in my fob fixed this problem. I had this issue with the rear passenger door of my 2010 Jetta. I noticed that the rear door lock seemed to "chatter" or squeak noticeably when I unlocked the door. The water issue was so bad that a 1/2 cup of water would pour out whenever I opened the door. So, I swapped the battery and tested the door after a few storms. Ta Da - NO MORE WATER. It was dry as a friggin' bone. The only thing I can think, is that the door lock wasn't fully engaging/disengaging using the old battery - and it was JUST enough to not seal the doors perfectly.

Click to expand...

The door "locks" do not pull the latches tighter when they activate.