Who’s going to Tesla after their current TDI?

[IndigoBlueWagon]

VW has been teasing that microbus in gas and electric form since the early 2000s. I'm betting it never happens.

 

[kjclow]

Or, It will happen but we won't get it here.

 

[disastrogirl]

I have my eye on the ID-Buzz (stupid name) myself. My plan is to hold onto the JSW as long as I can and see how the ID's are. I'm cautiously optimistic. Hopefully they switch out that steering wheel they have in the concept vehicle. It looks super annoying. That modular interior tho, it's cool.

 

[gulfcoastguy]

There are several videos on ewetube from about 6 days ago for those who want more info.

 

[tikal]

Or, It will happen but we won't get it here.

Will it be allowed to be imported (the ID Buzz) since you would expect that EVs will be more homogenized across the world (no emission stuff)? Probably not because of the collision/safety issue I would guess.

 

[gulfcoastguy]

Scheduled to be manufactured in the US sometime after 2022. In Chatanooga along with the ID4.

 

[turbobrick240]

I bet we get the Buzz before we get this sweet PHEV Westy: https://www.motor1.com/news/446380/songsan-motors-summer-vw-t1-bus/

Not sure how sweet it really is, but they should have stayed a bit truer to the original "breadloaf" design, imo.

 

[disastrogirl]

I wasn't thrilled about the exterior redesign either. It felt like when they redid the beetle and called it an "upscale lifestyle vehicle". "They seem to have forgotten the whole "people's car" thing. Things change though, what can you do. That chinese one is cute, but it looks tiny. Have you seen this German one? https://www.motortrend.com/news/ebussy-modular-electric-van/

It's got a modern look, but very cute... and tiny.

 

[nicklockard]

@bwilson4web

Your request for a new subforum was elevated to Fred when it was made.

 

[Daemon64]

I put an order in for a 2021 Q5 55e PHEV to replace my 2015 Q5 TDI. The PHEV from the factory is 0-60 in 4.82 w/o launch control as tested by many journalists. Averages on fuelly show around 65 MPG from the gas which is more than double my TDI which averages 27mpg. ( I plan on very much utilizing the electric most of the time, but I am nowhere near ready to go full electric yet ) Keep in mind my electricity is basically going to be free...( just ordered a 16 kWh solar array and 4 powerwalls for my house ) <--- 6 year or less break even. Lower center of gravity from the batteries ( had the sunroof deleted ) --- weight reduction & lower center of gravity. Got the sport package w/ the air ride so lower center of gravity again. Best my TDI can do to 60 from a full hard launch is 5.5s. It is currently in production, I estimate I'll have it mid-summer sometime with shipping and all that good fun stuff.

 

[turbobrick240]

Nice. Four powerwalls is a pretty serious setup. You must have a kickin' stereo . Solar installations are sprouting up in this area like weeds. Good weeds.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

If you're purchasing that solar array and 4 Powerwalls I wouldn't exactly call the electricity "free." At least not yet.

 

[tikal]

I put an order in for a 2021 Q5 55e PHEV to replace my 2015 Q5 TDI. The PHEV from the factory is 0-60 in 4.82 w/o launch control as tested by many journalists. Averages on fuelly show around 65 MPG from the gas which is more than double my TDI which averages 27mpg. ( I plan on very much utilizing the electric most of the time, but I am nowhere near ready to go full electric yet ) Keep in mind my electricity is basically going to be free...( just ordered a 16 kWh solar array and 4 powerwalls for my house ) <--- 6 year or less break even. Lower center of gravity from the batteries ( had the sunroof deleted ) --- weight reduction & lower center of gravity. Got the sport package w/ the air ride so lower center of gravity again. Best my TDI can do to 60 from a full hard launch is 5.5s. It is currently in production, I estimate I'll have it mid-summer sometime with shipping and all that good fun stuff.

Something is very "off" here:

Perhaps some people enter their 'electrical only' data leading to the 57.8 MPG and others enter their 'gas only' data leading to the 27.1 MPG. The real accurate mileage in my view it would be many miles of mixed driving (50/50). With this you might end up somewhere in the mid to upper 30s MPG I predict.

 

[turbobrick240]

It will vary tremendously due to different driving patterns and owners willingness to plug in each night.

 

[Daemon64]

Tikal what turbo said. It's simple math.... I'd you drive the q5 phev from full to empty in one go with no charging in between... you wont get much better than a normal q5. But let's say that your normal usage looked like drive 40 miles each trip for the full tank and you charged to full after each trip. Let's assume you get 20 miles out of the battery( many many journalists said that 20 without any hypermiling or even being conservative was no issue ). Then let's assume the gas engine is getting 20mpg, 25, and 30 during those trips for three different models at the same time. 1 gallon of gas used for a 40 mile trip, 1 gallon cor a 45 mile trip, and 1 gallon for a 50 mile trip. Effectively 40mpg, 45 mpg, and 50 mpg. That is ifcourse assuming that length of trip each time. That alone would be FAR better than my diesel for fuel economy. As far as fuelly... when I was looking a few months back they only had the 21 numbers. I'd assume it has to do with individual users not refilling battery and such or just really long trips often.

Also for my individual usage. I do a TON of trips sub 10, 20 miles and some 30 or so. So for me its even more worth it.

Also I got an update from audi it is in production, and tentatively I get it between 5/8, and 6/8. Well see once I start driving it.

 

[Daemon64]

As far as solar the powerwalls are to maximize the solar credits for 2 different programs and because my heat will be electric transitioned from nat gas I never want to not have hear when its 0 deg here... haha

Where I live between destination charge and etc... our electricity is around .267 / kwH. Think $205 bill but only using 765 kwH. Also we have programs that pay back extra for having solar, and even more for storage, and then our supplier will pay us for peak demand to pull from our batteries so it works like this:

16.32 kW Solar: $32,000
4 Powerwalls: $30,000
GateWay: $1000
Install: $2000
Cost Reduction: -$3000

Total: $62,800

MA SMART Solar Incentive: -$3,941
MA SMART Storage Incentive Adder: -$6,598
MA ConnectedSolutions: -$14,000

Fed Tax Credit: -16,328
MA Solar Tax Credit: -1000

or:
$45472 after tax credits ( Which i will be able to take full advantage of )
I will save around or be paid back basically $600 / mo or $43,200 in 6 yrs.

So I currently have $205 / mo Electric bills( JUST moved in ) and $200 - $300 / mo Gas bills. Around the time panels are installed i will get my PHEV which will raise usage to around 1,325 kWH or $355/mo electric bills. We are also going to have full mini-split heat and cooling pumps installed, and remove all nat gas, which will likely raise usage 1000 kwh to 2000kwh / mo. But we are insulating and etc... better, so assuming an extra 1000 kwh or $267/ mo. We are at $622 /mo.

Google estimates 1112 peak on my roof per yr which assuming .75% on my array ( during peak hours i have no shade on the roof what so ever, but i assume 25% / mo is junk ). That size array should produce 1080 kwh / mo or more( likely ALOT more ). Which negates the mini-splits 100% and eliminates my gas bill entirely.

So breaking it down a little bit more in cashflow:

I pay $500ish / mo now or more but will be adding to that:

Loan is $350 / mo.

The panels alone reduce that price $288.36 / mo or MORE. to: $211.64 / mo, the incentives above are locked for 10 and 5 years respectively: Connected: -$125 / mo or $86.64 / mo to pay both smarts for 10 yrs - 87.83/mo or I get payed back about $1.20 / mo over my current price... in reality i will likely pay a bit once the other things come online, but i was paying that before.

So for cashflow its awesome too.

Sure I could have maximized payback by getting only 2 powerwalls and then I could run around 100 maps if I needed it but I am err on the side of caution ofcourse.

 

[Bob S.]

When we had gas cars, we typically did not include the gas already in the tank or refilling a day or so later.

By that calculation model, I can road trip 1k + in my B4V at no cost. If only!

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Interesting numbers. I have a much smaller array (6 kW) on a well sited but occasionally shaded garage roof, installed in 2013. The system net meters, which works out well and saves the cost of batteries. Battery technology and availability also wasn't great 8 years ago. I still heat with oil, but the panels pay for about 90% of what were $125-$250 electricity bills, including running a pool pump and central air in my 3,300 square foot house.

For what it's worth, my system has consistently delivered more power than projected. I'm in Duxbury, not that far from you. Payback was less than 4 years. I also get about $2K annually in carbon credit payments. In retrospect, installing the system was a no-brainer. I could add more panels in the pool area and probably get away from heating with oil altogether, and might at some point. But I want to do a more thorough heat loss test and improve sealing in my house first.

 

[tikal]

Tikal what turbo said. It's simple math.... I'd you drive the q5 phev from full to empty in one go with no charging in between... you wont get much better than a normal q5. But let's say that your normal usage looked like drive 40 miles each trip for the full tank and you charged to full after each trip. Let's assume you get 20 miles out of the battery( many many journalists said that 20 without any hypermiling or even being conservative was no issue ). Then let's assume the gas engine is getting 20mpg, 25, and 30 during those trips for three different models at the same time. 1 gallon of gas used for a 40 mile trip, 1 gallon cor a 45 mile trip, and 1 gallon for a 50 mile trip. Effectively 40mpg, 45 mpg, and 50 mpg. That is ifcourse assuming that length of trip each time. That alone would be FAR better than my diesel for fuel economy. As far as fuelly... when I was looking a few months back they only had the 21 numbers. I'd assume it has to do with individual users not refilling battery and such or just really long trips often.

Also for my individual usage. I do a TON of trips sub 10, 20 miles and some 30 or so. So for me its even more worth it.

Also I got an update from audi it is in production, and tentatively I get it between 5/8, and 6/8. Well see once I start driving it.

Ok, I am with you. I guess it will be difficult for Fuelly to come up with a way to allow a a consistent way of entering data for plugin hybrids.

 

[vikingrob]

I have an order pending right now for a Model 3, which is scheduled to be ready for me in May.

Currently, I am driving a 2018 Ford Focus, which I bought three years ago as a bridge until I was ready to make the jump to the Model 3.

At this point, I really can't envision another VW as my daily driver; Dieselgate left a very bad taste in my mouth.

Now, I have to develop a spreadsheet that will work well to determine my efficiency, but the task is complicated by the fact that you generally don't recharge EV's to 100%.

 

[turbobrick240]

Nice. I also bought a bridge car to a Model 3. I just put new rotors/pads and tires on it, so I'll probably want to squeeze out some mileage before making the leap. Also waiting to see what happens around the $10k tax credit/rebate I've heard is in the works.

 

[gulfcoastguy]

Normally you recharge to 80%. That is what I did today. Any electric car could charge their today for free since it was Earth Day.

 

[vikingrob]

Just found out from the order management page on Tesla's website that I have been assigned a VIN and the estimated delivery period is today through May 29.

 

[turbobrick240]

Very cool. Looks like you'll be getting a $10k tax credit/refund pending passage of the infrastructure bill. They say it's retroactive to eligible EVs bought after May 24th. Good timing!

 

[gulfcoastguy]

Assuming that it passes. I just hope they don’t try to wipe out the federal tax credit of $7500 since I got my ID4 about 6 weeks ago. Then there is the fact that the new bill is supposed to be aimed at EVs built by US companies that use US union labor. Last that I heard Tesla is non union.

 

[turbobrick240]

Looks like Tesla would just lose out on $2500 of the $12,500 credit for not being unionized in the latest legislation.

EV tax credits jump to $12,500 in latest legislation -- with a catch

GM would be the big winner with the updated regulations, while Tesla would again receive some federal tax credits.

www-cnet-com.cdn.ampproject.org

I wouldn't worry about your $7500 tax credit- that's already locked in.

 

[vikingrob]

Assuming that it passes. I just hope they don’t try to wipe out the federal tax credit of $7500 since I got my ID4 about 6 weeks ago. Then there is the fact that the new bill is supposed to be aimed at EVs built by US companies that use US union labor. Last that I heard Tesla is non union.

I just took delivery of my Tesla on 05/28/2021, and wonder if the retroactive credit would apply, so long as I took delivery after May 24.....

 

[turbobrick240]

It should apply, my understanding is that Tesla purchases become official on the date of delivery.

 

[El Dobro]

There's a fellow up the road from me that had a 3 in his driveway for about a year or so. When I drove by today, there appears to be a Mustang Mach-E in its place. The shape of things to come?

 

[turbobrick240]

Yup, EVs are the future of automobiles. You'll be seeing many more Teslas, Mach E, ID4, etc. parked in the neighborhood in the days ahead. I really like the Mach E. I think Ford has thrown down the gauntlet to GM with the Mach E and F150 Lightning. If the Bolt and E-Hummer are the best GM can muster in response.....