WHEN can we buy a new TDI

[Dodoma]

Maybe VW should suggest a possible solution by adding fuel conditioner in the tank. And provide conditioner cans free for at least 5 years to all whose TDIs are cheated. Alternative would be to buy all the cars and ship to developing countries where these "cheating" emissions are still much advanced. There will be some loss, but much reduced. For example, say PapaPoo bought a 2015 for an overprice of $28,000. VW should pay PapaPoo $28,000 and ship this car to Mexico or Brazil or some other country and offer it for $10000. Even after shipping cost, the original loss of $28k would be reduced to $19k. And it could offset this loss with exuberant gains on selling other "non-cheating" cars for tax purpose. For cars with mileage, VW just pay the full buying price to avoid lawsuits and donate these cars to the countries with lax emission laws, or sell in the states were emission are not required, and claim value of donation as tax deduction.

 

[Dodoma]

Why Chevy Cruz is not available in 2016? Has that got to do with dieselgate?

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Why Chevy Cruz is not available in 2016? Has that got to do with dieselgate?

No. Chevy introduced a new generation Cruze this year and didn't have all engine options ready. Diesel will return in '17, they say.

 

[LogicBomb]

Jaguar, Land Rover, Mercedes, BMW, Jeep, Chevrolet, even Audi are still adding or planning to add diesel models to their US Market model selections. Mercedes has just developed an entirely new line of diesel engines for Europe and the US. Bob Lutz has never liked diesels, and he also tends to say a lot of things that data doesn't support.

When Dieselgate was first uncovered VW maintained that the '16s meet current emissions standards. They were only pulled from the market because they unnecessarily had defeat devices installed. Dealers and others I've spoken to still maintain they'll be compliant with a simple reflash.

The 16's models were pulled because the EPA decertified them. Without that cert, they cannot be sold in the U.S. And under threat of 2015's losing their certification, VW finally admitted to the cheat. They only admitted at this point because they had already sold some of the 15's, and there would have been lawsuits up the wazoo that they had 0 chance of winning.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

They can't be sold until the EPA certifies them. Which, according to what I've read and heard, they will. Most people think the EPA is holding the '16s hostage as incentive for VW to come up with a solution for the earlier cars. Once that's resolved it appears the re-flashed 16s (and leftover 15s) will be sold again.

 

[LogicBomb]

They can't be sold until the EPA certifies them. Which, according to what I've read and heard, they will. Most people think the EPA is holding the '16s hostage as incentive for VW to come up with a solution for the earlier cars. Once that's resolved it appears the re-flashed 16s (and leftover 15s) will be sold again.

Which is odd, because they've put forth a buy back of all 480,000 (approx.) 2.0 TDI's. I'm not saying you're wrong, but there's just too much speculation from all fronts to lean one way or the other. I wonder how intrinsic the "cheat" is in the software. Is it simply "deleteable", or will it require serious modifications. It also begs the question if there's any hardware present to facilitate the cheat, will the EPA/CARB require VW to remove it as well. I guess we'll all have to wait until June to find out just exactly what will be going on.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

From last Thursday's article in Green Car Reports:

According to Road & Track, the "agreement in principle"—which is preliminary—owners of the affected cars will have the option either to sell them back to Volkswagen or to have them modified to comply with the EPA emission limits.

Buy back or modified, it says. And it's preliminary, as you noted. But what VW has maintained since the start of the scandal was that the defeat device was unnecessary in the '15s and '16s, but VW had installed it anyway. A reflash would remove the device and make the car compliant. Or so they say.

 

[mhouck]

From last Thursday's article in Green Car Reports:

According to Road & Track, the "agreement in principle"—which is preliminary—owners of the affected cars will have the option either to sell them back to Volkswagen or to have them modified to comply with the EPA emission limits.

Buy back or modified, it says. And it's preliminary, as you noted. But what VW has maintained since the start of the scandal was that the defeat device was unnecessary in the '15s and '16s, but VW had installed it anyway. A reflash would remove the device and make the car compliant. Or so they say.

This is interesting. With this in mind, I could potentially get a killer deal on a CPO '15 Passat TDI SEL, that performs exactly as it should.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Or a new one.

 

[J.R.]

Who is going to pay $28K for a base model TDI when they can get the same car for $20K in the 1.4L TSI?

It's closer to a $4k - $5k price difference...but regardless, I plan to pay the premium as I need to do occasional light duty towing which is better with the added torque of a diesel.

Otherwise yes, the gasser or a Mazda 3 or Impreza are excellent alternatives.

I'm still hopeful Mazda manages to bring it's long rumoured diesel to N.A. as well for some competition to the TDI.

 

[gatz]

The fuel economy on the GTI is supposed to be pretty good. Probably not as good as the 1.4 TSI, but the new EA888 motors are crazy with a stage 1 tune alone:

https://www.getunitronic.com/ecu-tuning/Volkswagen-GTI-20L-TSI-EA888-2015-2015-stage1

Tons of torque for towing.

 

[J.R.]

The fuel economy on the GTI is supposed to be pretty good. Probably not as good as the 1.4 TSI, but the new EA888 motors are crazy with a stage 1 tune alone:

https://www.getunitronic.com/ecu-tuning/Volkswagen-GTI-20L-TSI-EA888-2015-2015-stage1

Tons of torque for towing.

Not available in the GSW. Also like $5kCA more than the TDI.

 

[frugality]

Which is odd, because they've put forth a buy back of all 480,000 (approx.) 2.0 TDI's. I'm not saying you're wrong, but there's just too much speculation from all fronts to lean one way or the other.

From the Reuters article posted in the News forum:
http://www.reuters.com/article/volkswagen-emissions-idUSL2N17O0Z4

The judge said the settlement includes VW's offer to buyback 482,000 2.0-liter vehicles, fix them if regulators agree on that step after further testing, or cancel outstanding leases.

With regards to the 482,000, it's either buy-back OR fix. They're not saying all 2.0L's will be bought back. I think there is a software fix for the late-model urea-system TDIs. I don't think there's a fix yet for the non-urea-system cars. One of the other articles that came out on 4/21 referred to "a fix if one was to be developed." Those of us with 2009-2014's will likely be subject to buy-back only. For me with an older, high-mileage TDI this is less of a problem, because it wasn't worth much to begin with. Those with the newer ones....VW will have to sweeten the deal in order to keep customers happy because they weren't mentally preparing for needing a new car so soon.

 

[earnric]

Buy back...

Those with the newer ones....VW will have to sweeten the deal in order to keep customers happy because they weren't mentally preparing for needing a new car so soon.

I have a late '14 TDI Sportwagen ... I wish I could just keep it, but from my latest research it looks like it'll probably be a buy back for me.
If they can get a '15/16 compliant, and offer me the right deal, I'll stick with the TDI Wagon.

 

[Shawn MacAnanny]

From the Reuters article posted in the News forum:
http://www.reuters.com/article/volkswagen-emissions-idUSL2N17O0Z4
With regards to the 482,000, it's either buy-back OR fix. They're not saying all 2.0L's will be bought back. I think there is a software fix for the late-model urea-system TDIs. I don't think there's a fix yet for the non-urea-system cars. One of the other articles that came out on 4/21 referred to "a fix if one was to be developed." Those of us with 2009-2014's will likely be subject to buy-back only. For me with an older, high-mileage TDI this is less of a problem, because it wasn't worth much to begin with. Those with the newer ones....VW will have to sweeten the deal in order to keep customers happy because they weren't mentally preparing for needing a new car so soon.

So it's speculated that the 2012-2013 Passat TDIs may have a fix with just minor changes since they are urea injection?

 

[bubbagumpshrimp]

So it's speculated that the 2012-2013 Passat TDIs may have a fix with just minor changes since they are urea injection?

Yes. That is one of many rumors that have flown around. They are just that though...rumors/speculation.

 

[scooperhsd]

Yeah 2012- current Passats, and the GEN 3 cars are rumured to be able to get compliant with just a reflash of the ECU (mostly more urea use / delete of the cheat code). However- I'm NOT going to be the guinea pig....

 

[Shawn MacAnanny]

I'd be really concerned about the system/engine reliability. Most already approaching 80-100k and then being required to have a system "updated" that hasnt been tested for any length of time. They'd have to come out with an additional warranty or something to make that resonable i would think. I would think if they knew it wouldnt affect any of the reliability that they'd have just done that to begin with and had is use 4 times more urea or something which would have been easier to sell than risk a potential fine on 150k cars or so.

 

[Jniemann]

The sales manager at Team Volkswagen in Merrillville, IN told me that a federal judge representing the EPA was suppose to rule on the 3 Liter six cylinder diesel engine back on June 21, but obviously this never happened. It has not been announced why no ruling was ever made or when this issue will be cleared up. Many VW dealers are sitting on 3 liter six cylinder vehicles and want to move them out. You can bet money there are lots of people sitting on the sidelines waiting for some super bargain to come be released as soon as the dealers can sell these cars. We'll wait and see what the judge has to say about this situation.

 

[Lightflyer1]

http://www.scpr.org/programs/take-t...s-prelminary-approval-for-diesel-buybacks-ca/

"What’s the status with the 3-liter diesel vehicles that also have emissions defeat devices?
The Department of Justice met with the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and California Air Resources Board twice in July to discuss the technical issues for resolving the emissions-cheating issue that affects 85,000 3-liter vehicles from Audi, Porsche and Audi sold in the U.S. Testing for proposed fixes is ongoing to see if the repairs can make the vehicles fully emissions compliant and durable, according to a spokesman for the U.S. Department of Justice. The court will hold its next status hearing on the affected 3-liter diesels August 25."

 

[tomo366]

I would be willing to sell my 2015 Jetta SEL TDI for the right money......