Wagon hatch "lock" logic

[milktree]

I've been trying to figure out what kind of crack the VW engineers were smoking when they designed the hatch lock logic on the wagons.

For instance: It's impossible to leave the hatch unlocked. You can only unlock it for a single opening, and then it re-locks. This is really annoying if you're moving multiple things to and from the car and it's raining, or there's some other reason you don't want to just leave it open. Some other reasons: You're not in a great neighborhood. You're camping and don't want the raccoons to eat your food. You don't want to run the battery down by leaving the tailgate open (light on) but you live somewhere safe and you're not worried about theft.

Here's another one I just noticed: Once the hatch has been "unlocked", there is no way to re-lock it without physically opening and re-closing it. Try this: Press the hatch button on the door or the key fob. Press the "lock" button on the door or the key fob. The hatch is still unlocked. So, if you're playing with the fob, or press the wrong button by accident, you can't re-lock the car without actually going over to it and opening and closing the hatch.

Am I being stupid and missing some other option?


Is there a way to make the way-back hatch behave like the passenger door locks?

Here's what I'd like:

One unlock click: unlock the driver's door
two unlock clicks: unlock all the doors
hatch button: Unlocks the hatch, and it *stays* unlocked until the lock button on the door or the remote is pressed.
lock button: lock all the doors including the hatch

 

[Alchemist]

I went through the same frustration with my Golf hatch, so I know what you are talking about. My solution may seem a bit drastic to some, but it works for me. I found the wiring for the hatch lock in the C pillar, and ran two wires to the control module in the left rear door. This allowed me to disconnect the hatch lock solenoid from the CCM and connect it in parallel with the lock solenoid in the rear door. You need two wires because the polarity is reversed to go from lock to unlock. If you do this, it may be backwards, and lock when it should unlock. If that happens, just reverse the connections to the hatch. It now works the same as the doors, and doesn't have a mind of its own.

Paul

 

[daboss]

Do you have the color of the wires from the hatch lock that was disconnected in the c-pillar and the lock solenoid in the rear door you were connecting?

 

[Lug_Nut]

Alchemist! You are my 'effing hero!
Please confirm for me that unlocking the car doors also makes the outside rear hatch switch 'live' and leaves it 'live',
that is, able to be opened and shut and then reopened by just the exterior hatch switch (no remote, no driver's door switch) as many times as I wish until the car doors are locked.

 

[greengeeker]

http://4130-products.com/step/hatch/index.htm

 

[Growler]

Mogolf made my 2003 Wagon think its a B5.5 Passat Wagon.. using vag tacho.

now my hatch locks & unlocks with the doors. stays unlocked until the doors get locked, can be opened N closed multiple times without worry. and I no longer need to use the middle button on my fob.

this does not however work on the golfs.. only the wagons. (2003 specifically in this instance)

so find yourself someone with a vag tacho and make it so

 

[Alchemist]

Here's what worked for me on the 04 Golf. In LR door I tapped into the blue and lilac(purple) wires between the control module 18 pin connector pins 7 and 17 and the lock unit. Two wires were then run to the C pillar where they replaced the blue and green wires from the Central Control Module at pins 4 and 12 of the Brown 5 pin connector. The hatch is no longer controlled by the Central control, so the driver door switch doesn't work, but if the car isn't locked you don't need it.

Hope this helps

Paul

 

[AntonLargiader]

Mogolf made my 2003 Wagon think its a B5.5 Passat Wagon.. using vag tacho....

Can you give any more details on how this is done? If a simple recode (of the CCM I'm guessing) makes this work properly, I will absolutely do that!! It sounds like this makes the hatch work the way it should.

I have a VAG-COM but I just don't know how one makes the Jetta think it's a Passat.

 

[Growler]

cannot do it with vcds. gotta have vag tacho, and have someone who knows how to use it do the deed.. you could EASILY brick your CCM if you do something wrong and I dont wanna be the one responsible.

with that waid, yes, it looked easy. he had a list of known good values (likely posted on this site somewhere) and he changed a couple of digits in the right address.. and bingo, my Jetta wagon thinks its a Passat and the hatch works perfectly.

I would try to find someone with a vag tacho in your area and pay them a visit if they are up for the job. otherwise, do some research and spend the $50 or so to get your own and have fun

 

[Lug_Nut]

http://4130-products.com/step/hatch/index.htm

Not good enough.

When the driver's door unlocks, the Comfort Control Module will think you also triggered that switch in the door to unlatch the rear hatch. If you don't go to the hatch after 60 seconds, then the hatch won't open.

Mogolf made my 2003 Wagon think its a B5.5 Passat Wagon.. using vag tacho.
Now my hatch locks & unlocks with the doors. (It) stays unlocked until the doors get locked, can be opened and closed multiple times without worry, and I no longer need to use the middle button on my fob.

And the B5.5 Passat Wagon doesn't do as you've just described either....

at least not from the factory.

Now the vag-tacho search begins....

 

[mtnick]

Anyone know if my dealer can do this for me? I asked and they didn't know, but they said it would be $45 to try. I'd pay the $45 if I know that they will be able to do it, but I'd hate to pay them if they can't... Thanks.

 

[tommyt]

I have a Vag Tacho but have never seen ability to do functions like this with it. Are you sure you aren't thinking of a VDS Pro instead? That one gets into controllers and does things nothing else does - - including the ability to brick things if you don't know what you are doing.

If someone has actually used a Vag Tacho to do this, please let me know how!

 

[Lug_Nut]

Yeah! What tommyt says!

 

[MOGolf]

Reference thread http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=161339

Growler's Jetta Variant uses the same control module as my Passat Variant.
It was reprogrammed accordingly.
1C0 959 799 C (Wagon)
Memory Address old value new value
04361 203 195
04362 203 195
04363 203 195

The "key" to the hatch lock behaviour is the rightmost bit. '194' (binary 1100 0010) won't do it. '195' (1100 0011) does.

 

[fase2000TDI]

I want this bad.

 

[Ausgezeichnet TDi]

I want this bad.

Agreed, do want badly! Reading the coding thread went waaaay over my head. Anyone in the Chicagoland area that could help me understand/achieve this?

 

[KITEWAGON]

I would love this mod. I can't stand the trunk logic. My #1 annoyance with my wagon. It sounds pretty technical though. I would want a guru to do it so they didn't somehow brick my ECU.

 

[blizzard60]

Reference thread http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=161339
Growler's Jetta Variant uses the same control module as my Passat Variant.
It was reprogrammed accordingly.
1C0 959 799 C (Wagon)
Memory Address old value new value
04361 203 195
04362 203 195
04363 203 195
The "key" to the hatch lock behaviour is the rightmost bit. '194' (binary 1100 0010) won't do it. '195' (1100 0011) does.

Edit: nope, I only talked about 04367,8,9...

Mogolf, why have you never posted this in the non-locked vds-pro threads? I switched my hatch lock and wiring to make this work!!!! Are you saying a simple bit-change would have made this work?!

I swear that I changed that bit and all it did was make the hatch "pop". I need to go check my notes...

 

[Mike_V]

Haha, I'm in the same boat as blizzard60 - swapped in Euro/NA 2001 rear lock and hatch wiring, and the irony is it still doesn't seem to work without additional CCM programming! (Have the cable and software, just haven't tracked down an old laptop that can support serial in DOS yet).

On the bright side, while I was replacing the wiring I found a leak in the rear washer fluid line that I would have taken much longer to notice otherwise . . .

 

[blizzard60]

Mike, I can confirm with 100% certainty that mo golf's instructions above work. I did this on a completely stock '05 jetta wagon ccm last Friday and it worked exactly as it should. What frustrates me is I SWEAR I tried that coding. Furthermore, if it is a "known" bit change, why is it not posted anywhere?

I have been remiss not to edit my previous posts around here. I'm so sorry that you bought extra parts for no reason. However, you will, when it is all said and done, be able to roll your windows down from your hatch

Cheers,
-Chris

 

[Mike_V]

Chris, no need to apologize - at the time, all the posts here and on the Vortex indicated some form of rewiring was necessary (and pretty much nobody other than you had posted up about a "clean" solution I was acceptable with), and I decided it was worth it. Thanks again for the help! My only fear now is that MOGolf's instructions might *not* work with the new Euro hatch wiring for some reason! Once I get VDS Pro running you can probably expect a PM or two about the coding in your wagon.

I have to say, it makes a lot of sense to me that there does exist a software-only solution to this problem. Glad it's out in the public now!

 

[blizzard60]

Agreed - I could NOT believe that it wasn't a bit-change somewhere. I'm actually gonna go down to my car and test the change this afternoon. As I think I mentioned somewhere, when I first installed my euro wiring and lock it didn't work for me, however my own notes on what I'd changed were very vague, so I simply changed it back to stock and it worked... I will make a post in the VDS resource then when I have confirmed a few other variables.

 

[Mike_V]

Finally found a laptop that VDS Pro works with. I have a 1C0 959 799C CCM in my 2003 Jetta Wagon, with original values stored in 04361, 04362, and 04363 of 202 (consistent with the values in this post for 2003 Jetta Wagon TDI's: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=1553448&postcount=9). I swapped in the Euro wiring to no effect, but then changed those address values to 195 and the hatch (and window rolldown) now works perfect. Thanks so much everyone, especially Chris and MOGolf, for your help!

Ausgezeichnet_TDi, once you've moved to the South Bay I can help you out with this.

 

[AntonLargiader]

Am I correct in thinking that the hatch button does nothing except send a signal to the CCM which then opens a ten minute (or so) window during which you can operate the hatch? It doesn't actually do anything mechanical?

And that this coding change simply tells the CCM to allow hatch operation whenever the car is unlocked, rather than just within that time window?

 

[mech644]

Thinking out loud here...
As I understand it this coding change will not work for Golf's, only Jetta and Passat.
What if I were to obtain a Jetta CCM, install it my Golf, and then turn off the non-applicable controls; would I then be able to enter coding referenced above?

 

[melsalz]

Okay so you guys are all talking over my head. Can I have a simple answer on how to fix my hatch. Mine quit working all together, after leaving the hatch open during a rain storm. The only way now to open it is with the key.

I think I get the jest that with reprogramming I could actually hear it pop open (that would be awesome) and then the door lock would also work on the hatch, so it doesn't stay locked all the time (that would be even more awesome).

So I just realized that this subject doesn't apply to my Passat. Maybe you can still help me.

 

[mech644]

I'm almost sure that for pre B5.5 and MKIV parameters for anything controlled by the CCM module (windows, locks, etc) can only be changed using VDS Pro.
Melsalz- your Passat windows and lock can be adjusted, but only with VDS Pro. You might try posting a thread in your regional forum looking for someone with VDS Pro and skill to operate.

 

[Mike_V]

Melsalz, the fixes we are discussing involve recoding the computer that controls an already-functional hatch. It sounds like you have electrical damage that is preventing your hatch from working; you would probably be best off fixing that before trying to perform further modifications.

 

[Ausgezeichnet TDi]

Ausgezeichnet_TDi, once you've moved to the South Bay I can help you out with this.

Thanks Mike! I'll be in Santa Barbie from time to time visiting my buddy, also have a wedding there in Oktober, thanks for the offer, I WILL be taking you up on it!

 

[Mike_V]

Cool, that would obviously be most convenient for me. I also visit the Bay Area frequently but often am short on time when I'm up there. Shoot me a PM whenever you've arrived and are ready to fix that $#!@ hatch lock.