VW Won't Attempt to Regain Diesel Leadership in US; Many TDI Models May Never Return

[NYC-TDI]

Two-stroke scooters are becoming less and less common in Europe. That is not to say that the four-strokes are inherently clean, just cleanER.

 

[bhtooefr]

And new mopeds will be required to meet Euro 4 emissions as of January 1 next year. Anything bigger (IIRC, mopeds are 50 cc max) needs to have met that standard by January 1 of this year.

Previously, mopeds were only held to Euro 2 (as of June 17, 2002), and motorcycles to Euro 3 (as of January 1, 2006).

And, as of January 1, 2020, they'll have to meet Euro 5.

So, the standards are getting stricter, at least, and these things are so primitive that the technology to make them able to cheat could also make them actually comply just as easily, right now.

 

[kjclow]

Two-stroke scooters are becoming less and less common in Europe. That is not to say that the four-strokes are inherently clean, just cleanER.

IIRC, the two stroke motors were banded from new sales in India a few years back. Not sure that regulations the motors have to meet, but all the new ones are supposed to be four stroke.

 

[wxman]

My only point is that diesels are receiving too much blame for air quality issues in Europe, in spite of what's being reported.

There was a paper published in the May issue of the Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society (Bohnenstengel et al., “Meteorology, Air Quality, and Health in London.”) which provided in-depth air quality monitoring results in London. Based on that study, diesel exhaust PM could be no more than 15% of ambient PM10, even assuming ALL black carbon (BC) measured at the monitoring sites came from diesels. Even then, it was concluded in that paper that wood burning was the single largest source of BC in the area based on the timing of peak BC measurements (evening). This study was conducted between January 2011 and January 2013, which means that most diesel cars there would not be equipped with a DPF at that time (DPF was effectively mandated for the 2012 model year).

Also, the NO2 limit was exceeded on only one day over the two-year study period.

Ozone was the most significant air quality issue during the study period (21 days exceeded the ozone ambient air quality limit). It was noted in the paper that NOx emissions suppress ozone production (i.e., London was VOC-limited during the study period).

 

[kiwibru]

Just got back from a trip to Italy. Wow, I was blown away by the number of diesels and TDI cars, trucks, vans I saw. VW and lots of other brands all running diesel engines. And the air quality so really good too. Must be all the bicycle riders which far outnumber the cars in most areas that are small. In Bologna it was the scooters, followed by the cars, then cyclists.
We have a lot to loose if the diesel gets hosed in the states.

 

[Diesl]

No more VW diesels in US!

I just heard on the radio that VW has announced they will not sell any more diesel models in the USA.
From http://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-strategy-idUSKBN13H0OE :

"At the moment we assume that we will offer no new diesel vehicles in the U.S," Diess told European business daily Handelsblatt.

 

[oilhammer]

I think that was already assumed.

I just hope I can get my Sprinter before they ban them too.

 

[lewisfromindy]

I spoke with an owner of a VW dealership here in Oregon. He told me that if they were going to have the fixes ready, and the equipment, and the training for their people, they would have had large stores of Parts already at the dealership for the future fixes. He said they have zero parts and there's been no training for any of their service department people. He thought that that was not a good sign that there will not be a fix coming anytime soon. I am dismayed at this, because my car has been literally Flawless at 64000 miles, I've only spent $164 on an actual part that needed to be replaced, my rear latch electronic lock. And part of that money I used of the $300 amount, came from money left over on my Goodwill money. However, because they missed the first deadline on November 11th, the next deadline is January 27th of 2017. Because there is no fix yet, I'm likely to simply receive my buy back money and probably get a 2017 Wolfsburg Edition TSI Golf. I've already got a couple of dealerships down five thousand bucks from the MSRP, so I can get them a little lower and then I'll still have plenty of money left on my buyback cash package. I have not officially decided yet but I'm heavily leaning towards now, replacing my diesel Golf because of the news that came out yesterday in the fact that they're going to remove the infrastructure of diesel cars out of the US. Repair costs and part replacement costs, will only go up in cost. I'm bummed.

Are any of you going to get another VW to replace your TDI? Why or why not?

 

[Diesl]

Thanks for sharing this info, Lewis. I'm still hoping (a bit less confidently after reading your post...) that I can replace my 2012 Sportwagon with a fixed 2015. Otherwise it's back to the original plan A, from before the whole fiasco: keep the 2012 for 10+ years, just like my previous car.

 

[lewisfromindy]

You're welcome. The owner of that VW dealership, I know personally as that's where I purchased my 2012 TDI in October 4 years ago. The dealership is in Corvallis Oregon called Sheppard Motors. I've had nothing but great experiences there and believe what he had to say. He did also say, that said that electrification is the main focus of VW now. He thought there will be a demand for existing diesel cars in the US in terms of their being worth enough money to keep, if there is going to be proper repairs done to the cars that won't compromise the way they run long-term. My personal opinion is if it was easy, VW would have released the data on exactly what the repairs will do to the emission systems and how performance will change and that information should have been released months ago so owners of these cars could make a logical decision to keep the car and they fix money, or get the larger package buyback money. They're not giving us a logical choice, it's as if they're pushing us towards wanting to do the buyback amounts and then get all their cars and sell them in Europe somewhere for a profit.

Thanks for sharing this info, Lewis. I'm still hoping (a bit less confidently after reading your post...) that I can replace my 2012 Sportwagon with a fixed 2015. Otherwise it's back to the original plan A, from before the whole fiasco: keep the 2012 for 10+ years, just like my previous car.

 

[turbobrick240]

You're welcome. The owner of that VW dealership, I know personally as that's where I purchased my 2012 TDI in October 4 years ago. The dealership is in Corvallis Oregon called Sheppard Motors. I've had nothing but great experiences there and believe what he had to say. He did also say, that said that electrification is the main focus of VW now. He thought there will be a demand for existing diesel cars in the US in terms of their being worth enough money to keep, if there is going to be proper repairs done to the cars that won't compromise the way they run long-term. My personal opinion is if it was easy, VW would have released the data on exactly what the repairs will do to the emission systems and how performance will change and that information should have been released months ago so owners of these cars could make a logical decision to keep the car and they fix money, or get the larger package buyback money. They're not giving us a logical choice, it's as if they're pushing us towards wanting to do the buyback amounts and then get all their cars and sell them in Europe somewhere for a profit.

One thing is for sure: VW will not be profiting from dieselgate.

 

[HBarlow]

Where did the information that VW is going to remove the infrastructure come from? What infrastructure are you talking about?

I didn't reach the same conclusion from the dealer's statement that VW has not provided parts or training for dealership techs to retrofit the cars.

How could they?

There is no approved fix. What would VWAG ship and what procedures would they train techs to perform?

I'm not in a hurry to write all the current VW TDIs off and send them to the scrap yard. I'm still optimistic that some models will receive a retrofit and continue soldiering along as before.

I also see no reason to conclude there will be parts shortage. There will still be hundreds of thousands of TDIs on the roads and will continue to be a lucrative market for parts and service.