VW hits it's C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

jayp111

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Undisclosed location
TDI
n/a
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

I work for one of the "Big 3" (not at a dealer) and I can tell you that they currently have no plans to introduce a hybrid vehicle and are looking at expanding their diesel lineup (I suppose you've figured out which of the Big 3 I work for...LOL).
Very cool!

Will we see Jetta like passenger sedans and wagons? (Can you hear me VW? What a dumb move temporarily dropping the wagons)

I'll buy my first American car since the early 80's if they offer a good Diesel...
 

jayp111

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Undisclosed location
TDI
n/a
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

They make more money (VWofG) since the engines are produced in Poland and there is no shipping costs to VW Mexico where US production originates. Made sense to me but we have heard very strong statements made on the topic in many different directions. As an Investigator, I would believe that the complete truth is a combination of all of the reasons.
I s/w VWoA last week and they indicated that ALL Jetta and Golf production worldwide will be done in Mexico....they are shutting down or have already shut down all Jetta and Golf production in Europe. If that is in fact true then the cost due to shipping from Poland (engines) to Mex is the usual bad info from the dealer....to bad VWoA doesn't do a better job of keeping dealers in the know....

My concern is that in order to cut costs they may also consolidate engine prod/car assembly in Mexico....I personally don't feel all warm and fuzzy about that prospect.
 

01tj

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Location
Fairmont WV
TDI
not yet
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

Chrysler is working on expanding its diesel line up. Hopefully soon every Jeep will be available with a CRD; the CRD KJ's have been selling well. They are also sharing some platforms/parts with Mercedes who is also looking to expand its diesel line up
 

saabguru

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2001
Location
The Capital of the Great State of Texas
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

Everyone sounds worried. Most of us here have or will soon have a TDi. I should be worried, since mine is a nearly antique A3! Relax, have a glass of port, beer, wine or a caipihrina and go listen to your beautiful TDi engine clatter. It's still music to my ears.
 

saabguru

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2001
Location
The Capital of the Great State of Texas
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

OK, wayyy off topic, but- public transportation will HAVE to get better, AND be more available. As much as I love it, it won't likely be the airborne kind. We need trains. Our rail system would shame Bulgaria.
 

StElmo

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Location
Northern Virginia
TDI
'08 Ram 2500 6.7; '15 Golf SportWagen
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

OK, wayyy off topic, but- public transportation will HAVE to get better, AND be more available. As much as I love it, it won't likely be the airborne kind. We need trains. Our rail system would shame Bulgaria.
That's the problem with the rail system belonging to the private sector. BNSF didn't want to pay for line maint west of Gillette for the past 5 years. Well every 6-8 weeks they derail with a load of coal and the line gets shut down. With a max speed of 80mph on lines that aren't well maintained it's no wonder folks don't want to use our rail system. You can get from PT A to PT B and all stops in between for less and probably faster (under $250 to drive from Everett WA to Newport RI in a TDI.)
 

spryde

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 12, 2005
Location
Saginaw, MI
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI GLS 5sp, 2006 Jetta Pkg 2 DSG Blue Graphite (order cancelled by dealer :( )
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

I am trying to be a god n00b here and not stepping out of line but I am still trying to find a .gov document (web page or otherwise) that shows that CAFE and emissions are tied together. So far, I cannot.

The CAFE standards are *not* complex. They are probably the easiest regulations to understand in terms of the Government. It simply mandates the average fuel economy level a set of cars must meet without penalties from the .gov. The EPA collects the data, the NHTSA runs the data through the formula published in the code, and an average is generated. Not much too it. (Source: EPA Fuel Economy and Emissions Programs).
The NHTSA is under the Department of Transportation which is not concerned with the emissions of the vehicles, merely their function and most importantly, their safety. Emissions regulations are the responsibility of the Environmental Protection Agency.

There is no mention anywhere in the CAFE code that I have found on the NHTSA website that regulates emissions. In fact, the only link on the CAFE site about emission are in studies that estimate how much reduction in emissions would occur if certain CAFE levels were set. (Source: CAFE Page at NHTSA )

More than anything, it sounds like everyone is getting a different story from VWoA, their brother, a little green alien that told them that the diesel gods are pissed at the USA and withhold the TDIs forever!

Is it the CAFE standards or emissions blocking the import of more diesels? From my research, I can say with confidence no for the following reasons:

1. CAFE does not restrict import or sale based on emissions. It doesn't even restrict import or sale of guzzling vehicles. It assesses penalties and taxes for those vehicles failing to meet standards.

2. The 2007 EPA regulations which will affect emissions on the TDI have not gone into effect (and will not until January 1, 2007). Even though car companies are working on meeting those regulations, it should have *no* effect on current production and designs (until the 2007 MY).

3. Calling VWoA for anything is akin to rolling the dice at the craps table at your favorite casino. You are liable to get any answer to your question and more times than not, the outcome is not the one you are looking for.

If anything, all we have now is rumor and conjecture to go on. The only plausible theories I have seen put forward (in my opinion) are those about supply limits. You can't suddenly take thousands of unexpected orders and expect to fulfill them quickly if you don't have the production/supplies to make it happen. It will take time.

SP
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

This just plain sucks! I can't find a Jetta TDI Wagon anywhere.
You can, but you'll pay between $26-30K. And yes it does suck.
OMG! I'm glad I picked up my 05 PD Jetta Wagen earlier this year (in April)! The Wagen only has 7100 miles on it right now since my Golf is normally my daily driver TDI.
 

TornadoRed

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 3, 2003
Location
Saint Paul (ex-San Diego)
TDI
2003 Golf GL 5-spd, red; 2003 Golf GLS 5-spd, indigo blue; 2003 Jetta TDI wagon, Candy White (SOLD); 2003 Jetta TDI wagon, silver
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

I s/w VWoA last week and they indicated that ALL Jetta and Golf production worldwide will be done in Mexico....they are shutting down or have already shut down all Jetta and Golf production in Europe.
Jetta/Bora, yes. Golf, no. Golfs are built in many countries, and I can't imagine that they would close those plants just to build/expand in Mexico.

My Golf was built in Brazil, and a Google search did not find any evidence that Golf production for North America was going to move from Brazil to Mexico.
 

deming

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2003
Location
Illinois
TDI
(2) 2005 TDI Passat Wagons
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

Thanks for clearing the air. You said exactly what I wanted to say but I did not have the time to write a report.

The only bugger facing ALL diesel engine manufacturers for the U.S would be the new ULSD requirement that will phase in late next fall 2006 and the 2007 and 2010 EPA requirements.

A good friend and fellow Deutscher with VW AG said that they are simply tooling and re-tooling several plants, re-aligning procurement (suppliers) and trying to get the Houston Port geared up after the Hurricane. He also stated that tey are adding a second engine plant in Bratislava Slovakia because the demand for their Diesel engines (GLOBALLY) has exceeded their production capability.
He joked and said "We just launched three new cars in the last six months and everybody expects to buy one like a loaf of bread at the market". His advice was to be patient and place your order.
 

01tj

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Location
Fairmont WV
TDI
not yet
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

We placed our order last week and they told us that it could be in as early as late nov but I am not counting on it. either way there is one with our name on it heading our way
 

PDJetta

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 6, 2003
Location
Northern Virginia
TDI
'04 Jetta GLS TDI Pumpe Duce Platinum Grey w/ Leather
VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

Gad, I just checked the on-line inventory of the 5 VW dealers local to me, and this represents about 700 cars. I saw ONE listing for a TDI in stock (Martens VW in Washington, DC)! Just amazing!

--Nate
 

tdijerry

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2003
Location
greenville north carolina-usa
TDI
2000/ beetle/sliver
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

i dont think this will happen.we will still be able to get the tdi even if vw has to make changes. the tdi sells are up.we are going to a cleaner diesel fuel any way.even other comanys are looking at bring diesels to the us.one local dealer told me that he could sell all the tdis that he could get he was getting them by the truck load from other dealers.i mean just look at all the stories that we hear about oil for our tdis/you can use this one/no use this one and so forth/ i think that we will be ok.
 

Oberkanone

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 16, 2001
Location
NW Indiana
TDI
13 Jetta TDI Premium manual "gone"
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

I s/w VWoA last week and they indicated that ALL Jetta and Golf production worldwide will be done in Mexico....they are shutting down or have already shut down all Jetta and Golf production in Europe.
Jetta/Bora, yes. Golf, no. Golfs are built in many countries, and I can't imagine that they would close those plants just to build/expand in Mexico.

My Golf was built in Brazil, and a Google search did not find any evidence that Golf production for North America was going to move from Brazil to Mexico.
All North American A5 Golf will be manufactured in Mexico.
You still relying on Google? I'll tell you what, I'll bet you a steak dinner that the A5 Golf will be made in Mexico.
 

matthewgb

Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2005
Location
Houston, TX
TDI
2006 A5 . TDI . 5sp . Pk1. Platinum Grey (ON ORDER)
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

I called the dealer who I ordered mine from to confirm this information about the CAFE limit & no more deliveries for 2005 and he said that is entirely possible. When mine was ordered in the first week of October, I was told to expect 12 weeks for delivery. That makes it 2006.

On another note, I read that the tax credit for hybrid or diesel would only apply to new purchases in 2006 (pending ULSD and emissions test). Deliviery in 2006 might not be a bad thing. Does anyone know anything more about this subject.

Any info is appreciated.
 

overbite

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2004
Location
Eagle Lake, MN
TDI
1996 passat
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

As for the tax credit. The 2006 Jetta TDI does qualify as a "lean burn" vechical under the 2006 tax rules. However, ability to recive the credit is based on the car passing EPA emissions testing. Right now as a 2005.5 - 2006 model on rot gut US diesel the Jetta is a teir II bin 9 vehical (maybe 8 depending on where you look). It has to be down in the bin 5 to recive the credit.

Now I think (the exact information is not at my finger tips) that the Jetta gets close using ULSD. The problem is will the EPA certify the car at a lower emissions level in Sept of next year or will they say piss on you? The IRS is not your enemy here
it is the EPA N(Ox)aizs. If you are takeing deliver of hte car near the end of december, either wait until Jan 1 or see if the dealer will date everything Jan 1 just in case.

Oh and start a letter writting campaing to the EPA, see if they care more about reducing emissions or just helping out hybrids
 

StElmo

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Location
Northern Virginia
TDI
'08 Ram 2500 6.7; '15 Golf SportWagen
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

Remember, if you itemize your taxes, you can claim the sales tax this year, which is almost as good as the tax credit for the clean vehicle.
 

TornadoRed

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 3, 2003
Location
Saint Paul (ex-San Diego)
TDI
2003 Golf GL 5-spd, red; 2003 Golf GLS 5-spd, indigo blue; 2003 Jetta TDI wagon, Candy White (SOLD); 2003 Jetta TDI wagon, silver
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

All North American A5 Golf will be manufactured in Mexico.
Not sure if this counts:
VW to build new model at Puebla plant

Volkswagen de México plans to build a new station wagon at its Puebla plant, starting in the fourth quarter of 2006. Francisco Javier Garcia Sanz, global head of purchasing, said VW's management board selected Mexico to be the sole producer of the Jetta station wagon, known in Europe as the Golf station wagon. The plant already makes the Jetta sedan sold throughout North America
http://www.purchasing.com/article/CA631801.html

But it does answer the question, when will the Jetta wagon be back. In a year, maybe, and maybe it will be a Golf wagon, not a Jetta. I predict it will look like a Golf, not a Jetta.
 

Mdbtyhtr

Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2005
Location
King George, Virginia
TDI
2006 VW Jetta TDI Black
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

I have had my 06 Jetta for 1 month now. My son just took delivery of his 06 Golf TDI on Friday. There is another TDI Jetta at Southern VW in Waldorf, MD at that time. Call me and I will give you their number.
877-574-0500 Scott MacLean
 

aaronscool

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 18, 2004
Location
Seattle, WA
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

An 06 Golf TDI!?! Are you sure?

I was told by many many folks that there were no Golf TDI's coming until the new Golfs arrived in June next year and even then there was not yet a decision on a TDI for it given that there may be no TDI's at all in 07.
 

StElmo

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Location
Northern Virginia
TDI
'08 Ram 2500 6.7; '15 Golf SportWagen
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

An 06 Golf TDI!?! Are you sure?
Yeah, lets see some photos to confirm the A5 Golf TDI is available in NA.
 

cpermd

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2002
Location
Hills of AR
Re: VW hits it\'s C.A.F.E limit for diesel imports....

The 06 Golf TDI is same A4 that has been sold here the last six years.It is not the A5 the rest of the world has.
Chuck
 

jasonTDI

TDI GURU Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Apr 26, 2001
Location
Oregon, WI
TDI
20' RAM 3500 CCLB dually HO/Aisan. 2019 Cherokee 2.0T
Re: VW hits its CAFE limit for diesel imports....

I talked to a VW rep a couple of months ago and he said it is CAFE related and WARRANTY related since the crap fuel here is killing them in warranty claims.
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
I was browsing the showroom at my local VW dealer after picking up some parts and....they had an A5 Jetta TDI manual tranny in the showroom. I was honestly expecting to see NO TDIs at all.

Nice gray color, manual tranny, around $25k on the window sticker.
Located at Tulley VW, Nashua NH, in case anybody might be interested in grabbing it.

I casually chatted with a salesman there and he told me it the customer canceled out on the deal and that's why they still have it. They've had a few cancellations recently since the gas prices have dropped and diesel prices have remained higher. If those customers did some simple math, they'd realize that even at the current prices they'd still have a lower cost/mile with a TDI compared to the gasser they probably bought instead.

So to prospective TDI buyers thinking they've missed the boat on grabbing an A5 Jetta TDI, my advice is to keep on looking and be prepared to travel some distance to get one if necessary. You might get lucky enough to find one that a dealer got stuck with due to a cancellation because a customer (foolishly) opted for a gasser instead.
 
Last edited:
Top