vw diesel into a mazda rx7

[12MPGHWY]

The Vue has an electric motor driving the PS directly with no pump, I don't know of any GM's with electric pumps, fords and some others yes.

On the note of PS options...has anyone looked into adapting an electric PS pump from, say, a Saturn Vue? I believe GM even turns it off at highway speed = more efficiency. Haven't priced one yet though. You can remote mount the little turkey pert'near anywhere you want (trunk?) just need a custom hose set to adapt up to the Mazda rack.

Travis

 

[lews930]

Ok VW guys. Were there any 1.9td's that didnt have power steering and if so, how is tension applied to the water pump belt? as explained earlier, the p/s pump/pulley is hitting the steering rack in the mazda. The simplest thing to do would be to remove the p/s pump. If I have to use the p/s pump for belt tension can I run regular power steering fluid in it ie tranny fluid? I am waiting for the answer to decide my next move. Are we allowed to post pics with these threads?

thanks
lewis

 

[Rub87]

yes

Don't know for idi's, but for tdi's the waterpump is driven by the flat belt with cars without airco, so maybe you can go this route<..

 

[lews930]

Ok I give up. I did some more test fitting today with a friend and we both came to the conclusion that the only way the VW motor will fit into the chassis is remove the a/c compressor, cut and weld the oil pan to new shape and put idler pulley for the water pump. The a/c has special concern becuse it is part of the timing set up. Even with all these things taken care of the motor still sits to high in the car. I would have to put a cowl hood on the car to clear the intake horn. UNLESS. I hear mention of a low mount turbo. On this setup where is the intake opening at, top or side? If it is on the side I might be able to just cut some of the supports off the bottom of the hood.

Do the non a/c cars have a pulley in the same location as the compressor or is it some where else?

At this point it seems like I'm beating my head into a wall. I appreicate all the help I've gotten so far but unless a miracle happens soon I think my project is dead


lewis

 

[Rub87]

Just use a tdi without airco, turbo is at the bottom, pulleys are fine, use a SDI manifold from a golf mk3 and cut the bend and weld it upside down, problems solved.. think out of the box, the TD engines are scrap anyway.. (unless heavily modded)

 

[lews930]

Can get a low mount turbo/intake for the td? I would like to think that the bolt holes in the head havent changed but who knows?

 

[12MPGHWY]

sure it would be a custom cut and weld job, or could the engine be put in canted 30 deg to the left.

 

[Rub87]

no, tdi turbo manifold is pnp on aaz head..

 

[lews930]

what is pnp? I would need it to go 30* to the passenger side of the car to work. I would like to have a/c and it hits the steering box at current. if I remove it and modify or geta different intake it will be a close fit


lewis

 

[Rub87]

Turbo is no problem, its close to the block, look for pics of a AHU engine..

When you tilt to passenger site there is nor problem for AC, oil pan need to be custom anyway..

Intake manifold will be challenge..

 

[bigblue]

.... I would like to have a/c and it hits the steering box at current. if I remove it and modify or geta different intake it will be a close fit


lewis

Seems canting the engine might be the right idea. The stock application (at least my B4) has it canted.

There probably would end up being room somewhere around the engine to relocate and drive an AC compressor. I'd put that on the backburner for now to get it running/driving on the bare necessities first and just consider the volume envelope of where the compressor could fit.

 

[Pat Dolan]

Lew:

The AC has nothing to do with timing, so don't sweat that at all. As you can see, there are MANY variations available with this engine, and you need to look at all of them. Most of all, the NA was installed at 50 over in the back of Vanagons (T3), so there are a lot more options than just the cars.

Sorry can't be of more help, travelling in middle of nowhere (again), not around my shop.

Pat

 

[lews930]

anyone know what the max amount of tilt I can put the motor at? If I tilt it toward the passenger side the a/c compressor will clear the steering box. There are also some bolt holes on the front passenger side of the motor that I can use to install an idler pulley for the water pump belt. Also, if I tilt the motor I wont need to use a different turbo/manifold setup. The motor needs about 3.5 inches to clear the hood and I think by tilting it I can make up that 3.5. Thanks for the infusion of ideas and the pep talk

lewis

 

[Rub87]

Here you see some pics of belt and height comparison I just made..

Sorry for the bad quality, on the last pic, top of picture is top of the wood..

 

[Rub87]

Should I resize the pics?

Resized..

 

[lews930]

The VW motor is 1.5 inches taller than the Mazda engine but the peripherals are located lower on the VW motor. I see the wter pump on that motor has a serpentine pulley and no a/c. My water pump has a V belt running it and the p/s pump which I have since removed. I dont need p/s but a/c is essential in Florida. Moving the compressor should be easy but I think rotating the motor over 30* or so should allow the a/c compressor to saty in its factory location.

nice wankel

 

[rotarykid]

The VW motor is 1.5 inches taller than the Mazda engine but the peripherals are located lower on the VW motor. I see the water pump on that motor has a serpentine pulley and no a/c. My water pump has a V belt running it and the p/s pump which I have since removed. I don't need p/s but a/c is essential in Florida. Moving the compressor should be easy but I think rotating the motor over 30* or so should allow the a/c compressor to stay in its factory location.

nice wankel

If you could find a Quantum or a 4000 from the 80s gas or diesel it would have the setup you need to do this , pulleys & brackets . And you block already is drilled for this stuff to work .

 

[12MPGHWY]

Could you move the engine FWD, it may not be possible but what I'm thinking is with no PS pump the rest of the accessory belts could sit in front of the steering rack.

An easy solution to the water pump belt, is that V belts are available in practicly any length, measure between water pump and drive pully with a string and get a belt with the exact length (they can be ordered), it goes on by taking off a pulley, it sounds mickey mouse but this works especially for something like a water pump with very low drag. Its very common to do this with rx7's when removing the air pump, that is a belt between the E shaft pulley and water pump, which is non adjustable, works like a charm.

 

[Pat Dolan]

anyone know what the max amount of tilt I can put the motor at? If I tilt it toward the passenger side the a/c compressor will clear the steering box. There are also some bolt holes on the front passenger side of the motor that I can use to install an idler pulley for the water pump belt. Also, if I tilt the motor I wont need to use a different turbo/manifold setup. The motor needs about 3.5 inches to clear the hood and I think by tilting it I can make up that 3.5. Thanks for the infusion of ideas and the pep talk

lewis

Lew:

As I said about the T3 installations: there is an oil pan and pump/pickup hardware to bolt your engine in at 50 degrees from vertical. Check out the brickyard or the 80-90 club for bits and pieces.

Pat

 

[lews930]

!2mpg, I cant move it forward. the sway bar is in front of the steering rack and a little higher too.
the small belt around the water pump/crank is a good idea.

Pat, what is a T3? How is the motor tilted? In a VW for example, is it tilted backwards or forward? I need it to tilt toward my passenger side to work. Is this 80-90 club on this site?


lewis

 

[Pat Dolan]

Lew:

A T3 is the rear-engined van (Vanagon over here) with a longitudinal installation of many different engines (air cooled and water cooled). It got the 1.6 diesel in this market during the '80s.

some reference links:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jfarrugi/dustbin/vwresources.html
http://forum.80-90.co.uk/index.php
http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/

The rear installation layed the engine over to the driver's side (passenger's side for a US model front installation RX7) enough to clear the decklid of an engine room meant for a horizontally opposed (flat) engine.

Almost anything you can dream up has already been done by VW in SOME application for this engine (please remember that the VW inine four diesel is the highest volume production diesel in history).

Hope this helps some.

Pat

 

[lews930]

I'll give it a whirl.

thanks Pat

 

[lews930]

It seems as though the vanagon oil pans and such are as rare as hens teeth. I have tried all the the aforementioned sites and no luck so far. do you think I could buy this from a VW dealer? Or would they look at me like I was crazy?
thanks again

 

[Rub87]

mod the existing oil pan, it's iron, not that hard to do..

 

[lews930]

Easier to buy one. then I have a factory reference line to work with.

Rub, do you know if the 1.6 motors used the same bolt holes for the oil pan as the 1.9? I have had several people respond to my request for a pan but I dont know if it will fit

thanks

lewis

 

[Rub87]

Don't know.. If I were you, I'd just see wich angle you can still get away with the intake manifold, then make an adapter for the tranny with the correct angle and as last obstacle fix the oil pan..

Tought about going dry sump?

 

[12MPGHWY]

Do they use an Oil pan gasket?

Try cross checking the part numbers for the pan gasket.

Easier to buy one. then I have a factory reference line to work with.

Rub, do you know if the 1.6 motors used the same bolt holes for the oil pan as the 1.9? I have had several people respond to my request for a pan but I dont know if it will fit

thanks

lewis

 

[lews930]

I dont know the answer to that. I'm guessing that they could use silicone as they are a cast aluminum pan. I'm not a big fan of silicone unless you have to use it..

Pat has informed me that they use the same bolt pattern. will check on gaskets

 

[12MPGHWY]

Use either hondabond, or "therightstuff" these will never leak.

Hondabond takes a long time to dry.

I dont know the answer to that. I'm guessing that they could use silicone as they are a cast aluminum pan. I'm not a big fan of silicone unless you have to use it..

Pat has informed me that they use the same bolt pattern. will check on gaskets

 

[Rub87]

Tdi's don't use gaskets, 1.6 I don't know..