VW dealership used 0-30 oil in my 2.0L TDI.

Dieselfriendly

New member
Joined
Sep 3, 2020
Location
Yakima
TDI
ADL Caddy / GL & GLS 2.0L PD 05 Passats
Could this be a contributing factor for problems with the oil pump shaft? Dealer stated it was recommended oil? Owners manual states 5-40. I'm not leaving it in my engine, already got the right oil and a vacuum oil remover. Only reason for taking it there was I just purchased the 05 passat in Denver area and am staying in hotels until the drive back to Wa. State.
 

bigsexyTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 28, 2005
Location
Kentucky
TDI
'98 NB, '04 Jetta
VW created their own oil with the 0-30 and says it is backward compatible for all years. That's what you are gonna get at any VW dealer.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Yeah, I would not want that oil in my PD. That is not the correct oil for that engine. 505.01 is what you need, and as everyone by now knows, a 5w40 version is what is best.
 

Dieselfriendly

New member
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Sep 3, 2020
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Yakima
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ADL Caddy / GL & GLS 2.0L PD 05 Passats
The invoice "E550301DDSP :0W30 high performance VW/Audi O"
Thank you all 505 01 oil for my BHW. Little embarrassed may have lost my cool?
 

towforce

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Mar 12, 2005
Location
West Coast, Canada
TDI
Jetta Wagon, 2005, Red
This is the stuff my dealership handed over to me yesterday. I think this is the 3rd change over the years (I think?). It does say "backward compatible"... the skeptic in me would say VW thinks our BEW's are lasting too long? The 0-30 is a bit disconcerting.

Not particularly fond of changing again.

One interesting experiance I had a little while back was when I went into Lordco saw the Castrol 5/40, the lable included the "505.01".... next time around, same part number, same "product", new lable...... and it no longer had the "505.01" desegnation. 507 is out there, 507 is what VW is now saying is for the BEW... @ 510,000kms I must admit I'm starting loose interest in the VW oil drama ;).
 

towforce

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Mar 12, 2005
Location
West Coast, Canada
TDI
Jetta Wagon, 2005, Red
Dealership saw my 2005 TDI once in her whole life time... the GP thing (another never ending TDI drama ;-) ) the brake switch .... that was it.

The oil drama is kind of funny in a way, Like the Castrol product that I mentioned, things come and go on the lables and none of us really know what is actually in the container. Sometimes I wonder if it all comes out of the same big vat of goo? BTW.... if you google around.... some worship the 0-30 spec.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
0w30 is a weight, not a specification. The PDs call for a 505.01 specification, which has nothing to do with the weight specifically, however a decade and a half of dealing with PDs has proven well beyond a reasonable doubt that the thicker oils are going to be less destructive to the somewhat fragile camshaft design. And 507.00 does NOT "supercede" any previous oil specifications. Think of it like a recipe for cooking: if it calls for 20 minutes in an oven at 400 F, then that is what it calls for. Sure, 450 F "meets or exceeds" or "supercedes" 400 F, but that is not what the recipe calls for.
 

Dieselfriendly

New member
Joined
Sep 3, 2020
Location
Yakima
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ADL Caddy / GL & GLS 2.0L PD 05 Passats
I new better than to have the Dealership change the oil, should have asked first about the oil they were going to use. ☹ New car and new to the club, and out of town, wish I had time to go through all the info here first, I would have known about the lack of customer service and or possible don't give a sht standards.
But I was able to find 505 01 oil to get me the 1000 plus mile home. I have a order of Dzzp being drop shipped to my hotel room, hopefully showing up tomorrow. My new passat has all the bells&W, lol now just need to fix all the little things lol, BSM, dash cluster.
It was like picking up your daughter from a friend's house and finding out she's sporting a Chevy tramp stamp. ?
 

towforce

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Joined
Mar 12, 2005
Location
West Coast, Canada
TDI
Jetta Wagon, 2005, Red
0w30 is a weight, not a specification. The PDs call for a 505.01 specification, which has nothing to do with the weight specifically, however a decade and a half of dealing with PDs has proven well beyond a reasonable doubt that the thicker oils are going to be less destructive to the somewhat fragile camshaft design. And 507.00 does NOT "supercede" any previous oil specifications. Think of it like a recipe for cooking: if it calls for 20 minutes in an oven at 400 F, then that is what it calls for. Sure, 450 F "meets or exceeds" or "supercedes" 400 F, but that is not what the recipe calls for.
Just poking a little fun here so nobody needs to grab a fire extinguisher....

Regarding your post and comment on weight....Well the "weight" has to wander through an old engine... and given your analogy to a "cooking recipe" are we talking about substituting cream with skimmed milk? ;)

Seriously tho, I would prefer to stick to what got the old girl to where she is today (with a pretty good looking cam)... so changing the recipe makes me nervous but I did after all trust the guys that set the standard from day one and "these guys" are now telling me the 507, 0-30 is what they are using. They go out of their way to calm our fears.... " This oil is rated 507.00 for all common-rail TDIs and fully backwards compatible with the 505.01 standard, too, making it suitable fro all TDIs. "

IDP a "trusted vender" cuts and paste the bottle on the web site touting it a "VW High Performance Genuine Engine Oil".... If we can't trust our venders who can we trust?

Realistically, I see this simply as a supply/production issue. Behind the curtain, VW and the suppliers are busy rationalizing those precious marketing skews and have probably decided that 507 meets the needs of the BEW's and are moving on. I bet you'll start to see the other manufactures do much the same and the "Backward compatible" will become the norm.

As I pointed out, Castrol labeled a product 505.01... later the same part number gets a new label and it suddenly is no longer displaying the 505.01 (Tho.. the Castrol Site in the US list the edge product as "Turbo Diesel" and has the 505.01 designation)...

In the end, none of us really know what tank of goo they used to fill the bottles. Life is a risk... Oh... and all changes are bad.

(BTW.... well I'm going to try and source a 505.01 product to replace my dealer supplied product, I do think freaking out and sucking out the dealer changed oil, a dealer that used the oil that the manufacture has specified is a bit over the top... relax your precious TDI will survive.... I suspect your door lock modules will be acting up soon and you'll have something else to worry about !... on the other hand.... what oil did they put in? what oil is "REALLY" in the bottle that you just bought from your trusted vender? )

Cheers

Martin
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
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Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
As someone who used to be a Castrol guy, I ditched them a while ago simply because of the nonsense of not making things available at a normal retail location. When the PDs came out, it was TXT which was 5w40, and it was ONLY available at a Volkswagen or Audi dealer. And I was a Castrol retailer.... even our local wholesaler could not get it (didn't even know what it was), and he actually had to go OVER Castrol USA's hierarchy straight to BP in the UK to figure out that they had some sort of "agreement" with VoA to be the sole source for 540 505.01 TXT in the USA. Seriously. How dumb is that? You could (at the time) by Castrol Syntec 5w40 in retail locations, which is what we had been buying in 55g drums in bulk for a few years already. This was 505.00 compliant (as well as 502.00.... the gasoline spec at the time, and still is for many engines).

I have no idea why the Syntec line did not get, or BP did not pursue, the 505.01 specification, but they never did get it. Since I am being trusted by my customers to take care of their vehicles in exchange for payment, they expect me to be certain that I am doing everything properly "above and beyond" and I take that task with the utmost seriousness. I drive these cars too.

So we continued to buy the Syntec 5w40 in bulk for everything else, but the PDs got liter bottles of TXT from the dealer, which was not cheap relative to the other oil. This was an issue for many new PD owners who had VE TDIs or gas VAG products previously or in addition. Because the price of a service between an ALH and a BEW was around $20 more, and I had to explain why. But, we got through it.

THEN the dealers, for reasons unknown to me, started selling Castrol SLX in place of the TXT, which was a 5w30. Now, call me old fashioned, but I had to wonder if the Xw30 oil was suitable in these hydraulic-lash adjusted flat-tappet direct-on-cam engines that were also subjected to a ~20% reduction in surface area for the valve lobes to operate on which was the whole reason for the change in specification in the first place. That was when I decided to go after a different source. And decided on a Pentosin (Fuchs) product, as they have the High Performance II that is a 5w40, meets the 502.00, 505.00, and the 505.01, as well as meets MB's stringent 229.51 spec.

The Castrol product then changed to the Edge line (displacing both the Syntec brand in the stores, as well as the SLX through the dealer) and this WAS available still through the dealer in 5w40 variety (but most dealers needed to be spoon fed the part number... otherwise they'd just sell you the Edge 5w30).

We've of course experienced piles.... truckloads... of PD cam/lifter failures since then. While certainly not THE only determinator, the use of 5w30 vs. 5w40 does these engines no favors. And I have a pretty good (meaning, not at all anecdotal) evidence of this, because I see these cars a lot. Still. Even though the last PD VAG TDI sold new here back in 2007 as a 2006 model. I see them a lot. I have a 2005 BEW J-wagon here right now for a clutch/flywheel that has well over 400k miles on it. I have a BHW in my driveway with over 200k. I have two more BEW cars behind my house awaiting untooefing with 200k+ miles.

So please understand if I won't ever recommend ANY Xw30 oil in ANY PD TDI ever, no matter its specifications or claimed "backwards compatibility". While there may be no silver bullet to make a PD's valvetrain last "indefinitely", there are certainly steps you can take to at least allow them a reasonable useful lifespan, and this is a pretty easy one. Besides, it isn't like a 505.01 compliant 5w40 motor oil is "unobtainable". I've got a drum of it sitting right here in the shop, and have been using it since 2006, and have never once had any problems obtaining it. I don't think anything will change in the near future.

Keep in mind, regarding dealers: any car as old as a 2006 model is ANCIENT in their eyes. You cannot expect them to cater to anything that would be specific or recommended for anything of that era. We buy thousands of dollars of parts from Volkswagen every month. They almost never have anything on the shelf for something of that vintage.
 

towforce

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Joined
Mar 12, 2005
Location
West Coast, Canada
TDI
Jetta Wagon, 2005, Red
Oilhammer, Thanks... pretty much the history of everything my dealer provided (left out the fact the color of the oil changed).

Reliable availablilty is becoming the issue for myself. Lordco is also selling the Motul product, might check them out (and thoughts on the Motul? https://www.motul.com/ca/en-US/products/8100-x-clean-5w40 ) and thanks for the Pentosin (Fuchs) option.

Martin
 

ApriliaNut

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Jun 4, 2008
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SoCal
TDI
06 pkg 1 Jetta 191k w/Malone Stage 2
My TDI specific shop has recommended Liquii Moly Top Tech 5w/40 and Aaron has numerous commendations from VW corporate on the wall from when he worked @ Palm Springs VW. I had an oil analysis at one of the oil changes [I do 7k] and everything looked fine! He says all the "boy racers' with their modified VW's use it also. Car now has 234k on it and running great!
 
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