Volkswagen's Clean Air Act violations on 2009+ TDIs spark huge recall, investigations

[bizzle]

And I am also sure that each and everyone of you complainers have parked the car and have not driven it since right??? Sure you did.

I can't speak for anyone else, but my wife and I leased a 2016 eGolf with the loyalty bonus last year, had our JSW's oil changed one final time since it was due, and then parked it until a resolution is finalized.

 

[ATR]

No, but the amount of feigned shock and disbelief is simply amazing. Diesel has never been clean. The amount of emissions equipment should have been enough to scare anyone who is a gear head far far away...
Its like people who believed in the safe cigarette... I guess when someone wants something bad enough, they will believe anything.

<Gear head here...

I didn't really see much of a issue with the emissions equipment. Following the advice of a German VW sales man "GIVE IT HELL!" the throttle peddle routinely sees the floor board

Going from the other threads on the subject of keeping the emission systems in good working order that advice seems to be quite solid. So long as you don't shut down in the middle of a regen
The regens are the ONE thing about the emissions system that I really don't care for. 10-15 minutes of blow torching the turbo and DPF with 1300-1400°F EGT

 

[austintg]

No, but the amount of feigned shock and disbelief is simply amazing. Diesel has never been clean. The amount of emissions equipment should have been enough to scare anyone who is a gear head far far away...
Its like people who believed in the safe cigarette... I guess when someone wants something bad enough, they will believe anything.

So you've done research on the "safer cigarette?" I actually personally know Dr. Denoble http://www.victordenoble.com who did a ton of that research and came up with some pretty good stuff, but now speaks to teens around the world as a part of an anti-tobacco campaign. Largely with DuckTexas, but not limited to them. I don't really see how the emissions of the TDi play into that though, did I miss something?

 

[pkhoury]

I heard through the grapevine that VW will be hiring these skilled mechanics when the fix for our CR TDIs comes out. Now we have assurance the fix will be installed correctly the first time.

 

[IFRCFI]

I'm not sure how you can easily dismiss the emotional distress claims? Not being able to trade in your vehicle for over 6+ months without taking it in the shorts if your needs change could be stressful to some.

Emotional distress? Over a cheap economy car, that is still functioning? Emotionally disturbed, unbalanced, weak...I could agree with that. Emotional distress....Waaaaaahhhhh.

 

[bubbagumpshrimp]

Emotional distress? Over a cheap economy car, that is still functioning? Emotionally disturbed, unbalanced, weak...I could agree with that. Emotional distress....Waaaaaahhhhh.

I think in this case...emotional distress is the courtroom approved way of saying p1ssed off. Of course VW would just counter with "it's better to be p1ssed off than p1ssed on," lol.

 

[RedBug]

Darn it, I am gaining too much weight eating this popcorn....

While I can respect differing opinions, to make the assumption that the average car shopper knows anything about the inner workings of the technology that they buy is not reasonable.

Car buyers start with a need, perceived or otherwise. They look at the advertising and talk to friends. VW was not targeting the gear head crowd.
The advertising was for a car that was as efficient as a hybrid with power and that was clean and fun to drive. Remember the commercial with a Prius holding up an RV and a Jetta on a twisty road....

As for the environmental impact, yes a lot of buyers did the math based on the advertising and concluded they would be using about 1/2 the amount of fuel and thus emitting the same or less pollution per mile than a gas powered vehicle. Certainly it would slow down the utilization of fossile fuel.

So, while I agree that the gear heads really don't want to touch these cars, the average consumer was defrauded.

This is an issue of Fraud.

Do I want to give up my car? No. Do I want the performance and mileage affected? No. Can I replace it with something that is as much fun with the same fuel economy? No. Do I trust VW? Not any more.

Will I give up my car? Only if I am not going to loose my shirt.

NADA - North American Dealers Association
Something about the fox in charge of the chicken coop comes to mind....

Why are car depreciations not on a linear scale like any other piece of equipment?

My apologies for rambling...I need some coffee....

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

What if you purchased used? Would you be paid MSRP?
.

hi Perry,

Bought mine new --- no trade in --- got a nice discount off of MSRP

...... more and more the last several days ... thinking no (fast) buy backs.

..... if a buy back does ever come believe it will be based on 2015 Sept KBB or NADA trade-in PLUS some additional amount, PLUS TT&L --- HOPE

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

Pardon me - but I don't see an easy way TO monetize said emotional distress claims ...

Anyone can claim it, but how do you objectively quantify it ?

In the CAS? .... let your mouth piece (shark) do it for you

 

[Redgrom]

Emotional distress? Over a cheap economy car, that is still functioning? Emotionally disturbed, unbalanced, weak...I could agree with that. Emotional distress....Waaaaaahhhhh.

I will 100% admit I'm not distressed at all, but I'm sure people are. For me it's a daily driver to keep the miles of my trucks. But I'm sure others didn't drop $30,000 otd at the drop of a hat. Like it or not emotional distress is real in the eyes of the court. Waaaahhhh all you want but a judge just might award some people some cash.
I won't see anything, I'm guessing any settlement/buyback will occur after I have a repair that exceeds the value of the car. And like you stated its a $30,000 station wagon.... It's not something I'm personally going to loose sleep over.
But it was a lesson about how VW treats customers... And I know I will be looking at something else for a dd when the time comes.

 

[TCBinaflash]

Agree, I knew nothing about diesel Except long lasting, dependable and fuel efficient. I'm honestly equally pissed off no one told me there would be an almost mandatory $3500 repair at 120,000 miles or so with the DPF.

I would have bought a gas car if I knew that. That doubles the engine premium over 4-5 years ownership for me personally.

 

[jimbo1mcm]

Has anyone produced a chart showing the loss in trade value since the problem surfaced?

 

[Redgrom]

I think in this case...emotional distress is the courtroom approved way of saying p1ssed off. Of course VW would just counter with "it's better to be p1ssed off than p1ssed on," lol.

I think your spot on with the analogy. As often as some post here (on both sides of the issue) I'd say quite a few are pissed. And I should admit when I tried to trade mine in a few months back I wasn't exactly happy but she's still going and this thread does help pass a slow day at work....

Back to driving more worrying less... Or something like that.

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

The other stuff you post, yes, sources are important. We'll take your word for it with this letter. It was interesting reading their response, however.

(BOLD BLUE) thanks pk

The letter (email) ... was mildly surprised to get the response rather quickly. Or even get a reply ---- EPA do what it do -- glad I wrote

--- hope you and others will write too & post the EPA response(s) .

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

Has anyone produced a chart showing the loss in trade value since the problem surfaced?

If anyone has any info please come forward.

I bought my car (new) in July 2015 --- I started tracking mine just days after the mess hit

 

[740GLE]

hi Perry,

Bought mine new --- no trade in --- got a nice discount off of MSRP

...... more and more the last several days ... thinking no (fast) buy backs.

..... if a buy back does ever come believe it will be based on 2015 Sept KBB or NADA trade-in PLUS some additional amount, PLUS TT&L --- HOPE

I want to be entitled to your compensation of TT&L even though I didn't pay for it, dealer doesn't charge it, I demand to be made whole!!!

no ones going to be happy, everyone should hope for the worse and be surprised if you get anything out of it.

Set your expectations low and you won't be disappointed!

 

[740GLE]

Has anyone produced a chart showing the loss in trade value since the problem surfaced?

There was a site that listed TDI vs Gas KBB prices over the past year or so.

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

Rain all day long, especially after 8pm. Already got several inches, as I have a lake in the back of the property with around 20,000 gallons of water in there from 4 hours of rain.

Got to drive in it, too - flooded roads, hairpin turns, doing the speed limit or up to 10 below, with the car over the weight limit. Wish I could do it again!

Assume no hail for you --- some poor Texans got 1-4 inch stuff --- on TV last night. --- guessing any car worth less than (say) $10,000 is-was a total loss


pk, please slow down and live for another day

 

[autdi]

There was a site that listed TDI vs Gas KBB prices over the past year or so.

It's not being updated anymore, now that the KBB prices are back up 2-3% from what they listed. It does still have the Sept price though.

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

Darn it, I am gaining too much weight eating this popcorn....

While I can respect differing opinions, to make the assumption that the average car shopper knows anything about the inner workings of the technology that they buy is not reasonable.

Car buyers start with a need, perceived or otherwise. They look at the advertising and talk to friends. VW was not targeting the gear head crowd.
The advertising was for a car that was as efficient as a hybrid with power and that was clean and fun to drive. Remember the commercial with a Prius holding up an RV and a Jetta on a twisty road....

As for the environmental impact, yes a lot of buyers did the math based on the advertising and concluded they would be using about 1/2 the amount of fuel and thus emitting the same or less pollution per mile than a gas powered vehicle. Certainly it would slow down the utilization of fossile fuel.

So, while I agree that the gear heads really don't want to touch these cars, the average consumer was defrauded.

This is an issue of Fraud.

Do I want to give up my car? No. Do I want the performance and mileage affected? No. Can I replace it with something that is as much fun with the same fuel economy? No. Do I trust VW? Not any more.

Will I give up my car? Only if I am not going to loose my shirt.

NADA - North American Dealers Association
Something about the fox in charge of the chicken coop comes to mind....

Why are car depreciation not on a linear scale like any other piece of equipment?

My apologies for rambling...I need some coffee....

OMHO --- regarding car depreciation. Think it is bases on real market sales.

....as cars get older they slow down in yearly depreciation ... particularly if the mileage is low in nature

... enjoy your coffee

 

[autdi]

Why are car depreciations not on a linear scale like any other piece of equipment?

It's the new car smell. Copiers are good for X thousand pages, tractors are hours of use based, roof wears out in 10-20 years. They perform similarly over their useful life, and then are basically worthless, and unless there is an accident before that life expires, they perform as expected.

Cars on the other hand, go rent something, I had one last week that had 300 miles on it, nice car. I've had some that had 5000 on the clock, and it was nearly trashed, interior rattles, scuffs on everything, nothing broken, just not that great. New, you know what happened to the car with the exception of what 12-15 miles, even at 2000, I've rented cars that I wouldn't dare buy, ignoring the brand or model, say I wanted that model, I wouldn't buy that one.

After 3-4 years, it falls back to close to linear, the car's on the flat part of the curve by then, just using up the remainder of the useful life.

 

[Chris]

...Why are car depreciations not on a linear scale like any other piece of equipment?

You're comparing apples to oranges.

Equipment depreciation is artificial as used for tax purposes.

That's different from market-driven used car prices (supply and demand). If a car becomes rapidly undesirable it will depreciate rapidly.

 

[kevin_in_idaho]

I've stated my opinion before and I'll state it again. VW has to do some type of trade-in, trade-up program. They shouldn't (for their sake) just offer us cash for our cars. Why? A lot of us will go somewhere else (I'm looking around already). They need to keep their customer base, their dealers happy, their service bays working, etc. They may do a 2 tier plan where you can get X dollars or a deal on a new car at a very good price where we don't have to put out a lot of money and based on miles, etc. If they can do a fix (doubtful) they will have to offer up an extended warrantee.

It's interesting to read all the posts from the beginning where people stated there would never be a buy back, I'm holding onto my car until the cows come home, etc. but the longer this goes on, the tide is changing. Now, a lot of people want out.

Back to my regularly scheduled catching up on this thread and all the off topic postings.

 

[GSwag]

Emotional distress? Over a cheap economy car, that is still functioning? Emotionally disturbed, unbalanced, weak...I could agree with that. Emotional distress....Waaaaaahhhhh.

i don;t think cheap is the proper term here. Mine was around $30 K. That's not cheap to me. If so, how bout giving me $10k, that's less than cheap. Maybe you have a checkbook the size of Donald trump's but most people do not and this car represented a major purchase in which we counting on using for over a decade.

I need an AWD by next November. I moved to a ski resort area where snowfall is too high to drive a FWD car. I actually needed it this past winter but swaped vehicles with family because they knew the situation. Now I'm held hostage to this car unless I want to take a bath on value. i won;t say I am emotionally distressed but nobody should be held captive to a car or anything else because of company fraud. I'd claim emotional distress or anything else at this point to help me get out of this situation. i have about 7 more months until I will need that AWD. think it will be settled by then? I don't, but I hope. we are left with no options. I hope to just get out of this without too big of a loss but hope VW takes it up teh a$$ for how they did this. I hope they are having emotional distress

 

[Torque17]

I heard through the grapevine that VW will be hiring these skilled mechanics when the fix for our CR TDIs comes out. Now we have assurance the fix will be installed correctly the first time.

These guys are WAAAAAAY overqualified for vw's quality standards .

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

You're comparing apples to oranges.

Equipment depreciation is artificial as used for tax purposes.

That's different from market-driven used car prices (supply and demand). If a car becomes rapidly undesirable it will depreciate rapidly.

yup


general care - maintenance with records - lower mileage - one owner(s) - garage kept - interior CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN (zero food in the car) stay off the salted roads - good CARFAX - works ever time

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

I've stated my opinion before and I'll state it again. VW has to do some type of trade-in, trade-up program. They shouldn't (for their sake) just offer us cash for our cars. Why? A lot of us will go somewhere else (I'm looking around already). They need to keep their customer base, their dealers happy, their service bays working, etc. They may do a 2 tier plan where you can get X dollars or a deal on a new car at a very good price where we don't have to put out a lot of money and based on miles, etc. If they can do a fix (doubtful) they will have to offer up an extended warrantee. <snip>

.... some other person on this forum said this also--- with any fix has to be a very long warranty

 

[Gonehuckin]

i don;t think cheap is the proper term here. Mine was around $30 K. That's not cheap to me. If so, how bout giving me $10k, that's less than cheap. Maybe you have a checkbook the size of Donald trump's but most people do not and this car represented a major purchase in which we counting on using for over a decade.

I need an AWD by next November. I moved to a ski resort area where snowfall is too high to drive a FWD car. I actually needed it this past winter but swaped vehicles with family because they knew the situation. Now I'm held hostage to this car unless I want to take a bath on value. i won;t say I am emotionally distressed but nobody should be held captive to a car or anything else because of company fraud. I'd claim emotional distress or anything else at this point to help me get out of this situation. i have about 7 more months until I will need that AWD. think it will be settled by then? I don't, but I hope. we are left with no options. I hope to just get out of this without too big of a loss but hope VW takes it up teh a$$ for how they did this. I hope they are having emotional distress

Just an aside, very few people NEED an awd or 4x4 in a mountain town. Most mountain towns have very good public transport and great snow tires on a fwd is much safer than all conditions tires on a 4x4. The key is stopping which awd/4x4 doesn't help with l. The argument can be made that clearance could be important and if you drive for work (visiting places where the roads aren't maintained) then you might have the right idea. Otherwise, fwd is generally just fine. Source: I grew up in CO and lived deep in the mountains for most of my driving life.

But you're right, these VWs sucK in the snow. ...much worse than other fwd drive cars I've owned.

 

[autdi]

But you're right, these VWs sucK in the snow. ...much worse than other fwd drive cars I've owned.

Seems this is also a new problem, the 2000 and 2003 have no issues, with snow tires (x-ice). Drive circles around the 2014. I know I drove home in the 2000, then took the wife out in the 2014, what an unbelievable difference, I had no concerns in the driveway, going out was interesting.

While in ON, realtor had a MB, she was slipping all over the place in a 2010, again the 2000, no issues, nothing interesting on the drive, minor wheel spin when starting on a hill, but nothing of any real note.

 

[tobianogreg]

Can anyone explain why VW execs deserve any bonus at all?