Volkswagen's Clean Air Act violations on 2009+ TDIs spark huge recall, investigations

[Matt927]

At a local VW dealer today. They still had a TDI in the showroom. Between the stop sale for the Emissions issues, they can't move any cars with the clock spring recall either. Not one person came through the door to look at a car last Saturday, sales are slow, slow, slow.

 

[740GLE]

Can't resist noting that it's a bit hard to use anything other than a sedan to "transport a family of four in a sedan."

good one! make sure you stop by ATM Machine while your at it

 

[DieselMann99]

I don't have time to read through 2,400+ posts, so forgive me if this was discussed here already, but . . . any thoughts on how this might affect resale value of 2009 - 2015 TDIs? I'm not asking so much how much it might affect them in the next few months, but what about a year or two down the road?

I happen to think that people who love TDIs will continue to buy TDIs. This will cost VW a lot of money, but they'll have this whole controversy behind them in 6 -12 months. Just MHO.

 

[diesel55]

Obvious GM ignition key problem substantially worse than this. With that said, you can't defraud the feds and get away with it. But this reflects a systemic issue with self-testing, which IMO should have never existed. We're talking 10s of billions of $ and lives at stake.

 

[snakefart]

I still love my TDI and understand the concerns, but give me a break!!.........
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...p-across-my-well-moisturized-euro-loving-face

 

[Drivbiwire]

so should I trade in for a Golf gasser ??

Absolutely!!!!

That makes perfect sense, Take a double depreciation on a car that gets even lower fuel economy, that has 1/10th of the service life...

In a way if VW stops selling TDI's anyone who has one has a proverbial "Unicorn".

And seriously do people really buy a car just because of an emissions sticker? I thought the point of buying a TDI was fuel economy and the fact it can pass emissions at all was just factor in getting the thing into my garage?

This entire thread has me rolling my eyes at the stupidity, and ignorance.

CARB and the EPA with the latest emissions have little to do with clean air, the fact the exhaust has cleaner air coming out than the air going in should be telling enough, apparently not based on the moronic posts here.

NOx is not some demonic gas that kills children and turns the world upside down, if anyone wants to target gas emissions lets talk SOx, CO2...

Meanwhile in China where the gasoline engine reigns supreme...

Of course lets also ignore the forest fires, volcanic eruptions... and forbid lightening form the over 2000 thunder storms at this very moment that produces NOx like diesels.

Carry on...

 

[Stealth TDI]

Mods,

We're working on creating a new locked thread, perhaps in the TDI News/Tech session that will have regular updates of the facts as they unfold. You will be able to subscribe to that thread for information updates and unsubscribe from this discussion thread. This discussion thread will live on for people who want to discuss the issues.

Thank you! My official cue to leave. I want to keep up with what's important, but not the other BS here. I look forward to the new thread.

Later,

Scott

 

[john.jackson9213]

Justice for VW - should be taken over by FIAT

Just thinking about appropriate corporate punishment for Volkswagen Corp.

How about they get taken over by FIAT as punishment?

Talk about being in purgatory!

If VW stock price keeps falling, it may get cheap enough!

And yes, I know about the stake in VW held by the state and the state laws governing VW ownership. Still, I like the idea of VW being taken over by FIAT as punishment!

With that, I also am exiting this thread.

 

[DieselMann99]

I have DIRECT correlation between GM's willful act and actual deaths. I have no correlation between TDI NOx emissions since 2009 and ANY increasing health issues in the US or worldwide due to TDI NOx. There should be some studies somewhere that would show this, otherwise it is speculation. VW DID cheat and should be held responsible but politics being what it is, some are more equal than others. I too am pissed at being lied to by VW, seeing I just purchased a 2015 TDI Passat. However my VW 'problem' pales in comparison to someone who lost a friend or family member due to 'willful negligence' by an auto maker who appears to have bought 'influence'.

Very well said.

Yes, there's a lot of politics that's going to play a role here, not the least of which is the current Regime probably not being happy that a fossil fuel TDI is giving a lot of competition to this Regime's favorites: hybrids, electric cars, windmill-powered cars.

And btw, how much coal needs to burn to generate the electricity to charge an electric car? Or a million electric cars?

 

[bring]

They sold a product with false claims even cheated the public knowing the vehicle was not right. A buyback of my 2015 Jetta SEL TDI is the only acceptable option I see.

If not a lifetime warranty on the engine, transmission and exhuast system because you don't know how or what results of the changes they will make will have in the vehicle. Obviously they knew it was substandard and had to cheat to try and make it right.

sums up my feelings if the fix downgrades the performance

 

[Jimmy Coconuts]

I will be buying VW Stock now. It is on sale.

Anyone that thinks VW is just going away because of this should not be on the TDIClub website....

Scores of people kept buying after the Nasdaq bubble burst and lost everything. Many bought Enron all the way to zero. Good luck!

 

[allride]

Mods,
Thank you! My official cue to leave. I want to keep up with what's important, but not the other BS here. I look forward to the new thread.
Later,
Scott

+1
Agreed

 

[mdevine]

I have a 2013 passat tdi. Many news articles talk about only the 2014/2015 passat having this issue - see below. That makes no sense to me. Page 1 of this thread specifically mentions the 2013 passat. Is the 2013 passat tdi not a concern?

What cars are affected by this?

The cars are 2009 to 2015 TDI Volkswagen Golf, Jetta, Beetle and Audi A3s, and the 2014 to 2015 Passat. All are powered by the company’s 2.0-liter turbodiesel four-cylinder engines. There are other diesels engines in the greater VW stable, but those aren’t affected here as far as we know.

 

[diesel55]

VW stock has lost about $35 billion in value since Friday. I'm guessing this reflects the market's estimated total amount of fines, engine recall work, and loss of goodwill VW will sustain.

 

[LRTDI]

I have a 2013 passat tdi. Many news articles talk about only the 2014/2015 passat having this issue - see below. That makes no sense to me. Page 1 of this thread specifically mentions the 2013 passat. Is the 2013 passat tdi not a concern?

What cars are affected by this?

The cars are 2009 to 2015 TDI Volkswagen Golf, Jetta, Beetle and Audi A3s, and the 2014 to 2015 Passat. All are powered by the company’s 2.0-liter turbodiesel four-cylinder engines. There are other diesels engines in the greater VW stable, but those aren’t affected here as far as we know.

Please read Post 1 of this thread. It has the answer you need, including the following image:
http://roa.h-cdn.co/assets/15/38/1442592687-screen-shot-2015-09-18-at-121045-pm.png

 

[GoBucks!]

And btw, how much coal needs to burn to generate the electricity to charge an electric car? Or a million electric cars?

Potentially, not any if your generator is natural gas/nuke powered. Or if you have solar panels.

 

[INA]

NOx is not some demonic gas that kills children and turns the world upside down, if anyone wants to target gas emissions lets talk SOx, CO2...

Exactly! Hearing the news talk about NOx reminded me of that Di-Hydron Oxide scare from years ago...

I really and trully hope for the sake of the brand they are slapped with a minimal penalty that does that following:
1. Keeps Volkswagen alive
2. Keeps TDI alive
3. Keeps Volkswagen & TDI in North America.

 

[JM Popaleetus]

However my VW 'problem' pales in comparison to someone who lost a friend or family member due to 'willful negligence' by an auto maker who appears to have bought 'influence'.

GM's scandal wasn't willful negligence. The ignitions were not purposely designed to be weak enough to lead to deaths. VW willfuly, with INTENT, cheated.

If you can't see the difference, you're blind.

(Moreover, the GM scandal was overblown considering the company responsible is not the same GM that stands today. But that's a whole other argument not appropriate for this thread)

 

[mmn]

They're saying it affects the EA189 engine. Does that mean us folks with 2015's with the EA288 wont be affected?

http://jalopnik.com/volkswagen-admits-it-cheated-with-11-million-engines-s-1732283322

 

[Philpug]

This is strike three for diesels in the US. Smokey Exhaust, Oldsmobile and now this.

 

[Rico567]

I'm just gonna leave this here.....of course, those who most need to read it, won't.

http://larvatus.com/michael-crichton-why-speculate/

 

[Chris Tobin]

Anyone who thinks VW is in the right here, in any way, shape or form, is in denial. There is nothing to argue. VW cheated and got caught. They 'dun goofed. Don't blame any governments for doing their job.

If you disagree with what the EPA does, that's a whole other argument. That does not relate to VW in any way. Go lobby elsewhere.

VERY, VERY True!!!!

It blows me away the people on here defending VW! Even VW is not defending or condoning their actions, but here on TDIClub many users believe their TDIs walk on water and will worship the brand accordingly!!!

 

[15 A3 TDI]

They're saying it affects the EA189 engine. Does that mean us folks with 2015's with the EA288 wont be affected?

http://jalopnik.com/volkswagen-admits-it-cheated-with-11-million-engines-s-1732283322

This was my initial thought...EPA just going after all 2.0 TDIs and not appreciating the differences between non-SCR and SCR cars

 

[Borsig]

They're saying it affects the EA189 engine. Does that mean us folks with 2015's with the EA288 wont be affected?

http://jalopnik.com/volkswagen-admits-it-cheated-with-11-million-engines-s-1732283322

Its sterting to look more and more like he EA288 might not be effected.

Speculation at this point - but the data is:

VW says EA 189 is the problem
No EA288 was tested by WVU in the study.

 

[Borsig]

This was my initial thought...EPA just going after all 2.0 TDIs and not appreciating the differences between non-SCR and SCR cars

There are SCR EA189s. Passats.

 

[Lightflyer1]

I don't have time to read through 2,400+ posts, so forgive me if this was discussed here already, but . . . any thoughts on how this might affect resale value of 2009 - 2015 TDIs? I'm not asking so much how much it might affect them in the next few months, but what about a year or two down the road?

I happen to think that people who love TDIs will continue to buy TDIs. This will cost VW a lot of money, but they'll have this whole controversy behind them in 6 -12 months. Just MHO.

You only have to read the first one, the rest are just drivel. No one has a crystal ball, they won't know what the future holds.

 

[Wankel7]

Wow, 162 pages so far.

Change your settings in your control panel...this thread is 41 pages for me...makes it a lot easier to follow.

 

[Lightflyer1]

Change your settings in your control panel...this thread is 41 pages for me...makes it a lot easier to follow.

25 for me

 

[Slurry Pumper]

I just sent the last check in about 2 weeks ago for my 2010 Jetta to pay it off. I guess I can't say anything about the emissions since I deleted all of that with a stage 2 tune, but if the state requires me to do something to register, I would be a little pissed. If VW does have a software fix and no hardware is needed, and I need to get some paperwork stating a fix was required to register, I would be willing to send in my computer unit only for reflashing, if VW can't handle that then too bad. I would then look for other free market solutions to my inherited problems.

After reading all 160 some odd pages, well correct that, I don't have time to read all of this excitement. I'm guessing that VW doesn't have a true fix that will satisfy everyone because if they did they would have already used it.

I praise the VW engineers for the work around on the emissions, good work boys, too bad you got caught, by the way the stock price has been cut in half because of this, so your probably gonna get fired at the end of the week. Then the company will say your all malcontents and problem employees.

 

[diesel55]

GM's scandal wasn't willful negligence. The ignitions were not purposely designed to be weak enough to lead to deaths. VW willfuly, with INTENT, cheated.

If you can't see the difference, you're blind.

(Moreover, the GM scandal was overblown considering the company responsible is not the same GM that stands today. But that's a whole other argument not appropriate for this thread)

Again, not quite. GM is being investigated for criminal misconduct in handling the ignition key issue, although actual charges have been delayed.

There is no question that the GM issue directly attributed to more deaths (153) than the VW fraud, and GM officials were aware of it. (below)

http://www.justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr...l-charges-against-general-motors-and-deferred

GM is charged with concealing a potentially deadly safety defect from its U.S. regulator, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (“NHTSA”), from the spring of 2012 through February 2014, and, in the process, misleading consumers concerning the safety of certain of GM’s cars.

Misleading a govt. agency is still fraud, no matter how you look at it.