Volkswagen's Clean Air Act violations on 2009+ TDIs spark huge recall, investigations

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tomo366

TDI Lifer, Member #68
Joined
Jun 30, 1997
Location
Kensington, Maryland USA
TDI
2015 Jetta SEL TDI
I am looking for a Passat just like that and I would have paid more.....
There was a Loaded 2012 Passat TDI 62,000 just like this on Facebook last week and Car Max offered the guy 13,500 and was going to sell it for $1 more I just couldn't get the money together and missed out :(
 

bizzle

Veteran Member
Joined
May 21, 2013
Location
Southern California
TDI
2015 GSW SEL (totaled), 2013 Touareg Executive
I finally found a dealership that would take the trade. Super clean 2013 Passat TDI SEL with 40K highway miles = $11,000. KBB trade-in value before the scandal was $21,000. VW really screwed me on this one. The worst experience with an auto brand so far. Hopefully, my last.
There's no way your trade-in value was $21,000. Maybe your private sell value was $21,000 but MSRP on your car was $22K so how would the trade in value only be $1,000 lower three years later with 40,000 miles on the clock?
 

pknopp

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 29, 2011
Location
WV
TDI
2012 Jetta Sportwagen
Have been trying to sell my A3 TDI with 63,000 miles on it for 1000 less than the KBB for some time now. This week, two separate buyers brought up the fact that they were denied financing because it was a TDI.
So **** me, right? Can't wait for the dealership gift cards to start rolling in.
I think they lied to you.
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
He screwed himself.
What LNXGUY said.

Another TDI owner selling their car in a panic over fears of the sky falling and basically threw a perfectly good car away. :eek:

Many affected TDIs will be well past federal emissions warranty by the time any recall comes out to fix these cars. If you don't want any recall done to your TDI, KEEP IT and KEEP DRIVING IT! (caps lock used for emphasis, not shouting).
 
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VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
There's no way your trade-in value was $21,000. Maybe your private sell value was $21,000 but MSRP on your car was $22K so how would the trade in value only be $1,000 lower three years later with 40,000 miles on the clock?
MSRP on an SEL is more like $32,000, not $22,000. :confused:
 

Lightflyer1

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 13, 2005
Location
Round Rock, Texas
TDI
2015 Beetle tdi dsg
MSRP on a Loaded SEL was 32,000 + new
Yes and that is about exactly what I paid for mine at the time. $21k was about what KBB said it was worth when I sold mine a week before all this happened. Pending layoff forced sale and couldn't wait. Sold to CarMax for $17,500. Not ideal but for the best considering my situation. $11k is giving that car away. Almost doesn't seem real, but stranger things have happened.
 

DownByTheRiver

Active member
Joined
Oct 25, 2015
Location
florida
TDI
2012 passat
I think they lied to you.
One was a bonafide TDI enthusiast that was pretty well-versed in what they wanted and what the car was. The other one, that's up for debate.

Either way, it's made things pretty tough. I still love the car, but can't justify keeping it when I bought a truck for work. I'm listing it in the classifieds here, because I really believe it's going to take a TDI person as a buyer. Your average schmuck would be more inclined to buy this before the whole scandal.
 

giuseppe_b

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2007
Location
Albuquerque, NewMexico
TDI
2015 Golf SportWagen SE 6MT
Great addition to your collection oilhammer. It looks like a 2009 eh, judging by the MFD.
I also forget about the 6th gear, I don't use it unless I am really moving above 60, I like my RPMs to be in that sweet 1800-2200 range.
By the way, you mentioned that you replaced two turbos on CR motors in recent weeks. Do turbos fail because people lug the motors too much and then step on it? What is likely cause for the turbo failure?

Congrats by the way on getting the post # 10,000!
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Great addition to your collection oilhammer. It looks like a 2009 eh, judging by the MFD.
I also forget about the 6th gear, I don't use it unless I am really moving above 60, I like my RPMs to be in that sweet 1800-2200 range.
By the way, you mentioned that you replaced two turbos on CR motors in recent weeks. Do turbos fail because people lug the motors too much and then step on it? What is likely cause for the turbo failure?

Congrats by the way on getting the post # 10,000!


No idea why the turbos fail, other than they are simply under built for the task at hand.

Yes it is a 2009. Will be selling the '10 before too long. Going to wait a bit and see what happens with all this fiasco, though. I may even sell the '09.
 

TCBinaflash

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2011
Location
Chagrin Falls, OH
TDI
2012 Golf TDI
From what I hear there will be a big filler port attached to the top of your hood. It will open automatically when the nozzle is inserted.

There will be a DEF monitor in the car with a cell link.

When it comes on as soon as you hit the Interstate a big VW DEF tanker plane will fly overhead and automatically top you off ala midflight jet refueling. You speed up to 100 and it matches your speed, then a refueling boom is lowered until it mates with the port.

It sounds complicated but VW was trying to come up with a way to spill less DEF on your car than the service technicians do.
This is the first post in this entire thread that I hope is true.
 

ndmike88

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2009
Location
Hendersonville,TN. 37075
TDI
'09 Jetta TDI
Just came from the dealer......A gift card and trade in appraisal is coming to TDI owners this week or next week. He didn't know how much the gift card would be for but he said everyone who is THINKING about trading in their TDI should hold on.
He also said next month VW is going to start up their Sign & Drive promotion. He expects to sell 25 new VW's compared to the normal 15.
Also he said that no one will be forced to have the recall performed. The government can only force safety recalls. (California might be the exception)
They promised to keep me informed as to what else they hear.
 

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e

bizzle

Veteran Member
Joined
May 21, 2013
Location
Southern California
TDI
2015 GSW SEL (totaled), 2013 Touareg Executive
MSRP on an SEL is more like $32,000, not $22,000. :confused:
I didn't have it in front of me so I googled before I responded and used a caranddriver article for my information. I went back and double checked just now and realized I misread what the review.

You can probably see why I made that mistake here
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2013-volkswagen-passat-tdi-diesel-long-term-test-review

Yes and that is about exactly what I paid for mine at the time. $21k was about what KBB said it was worth when I sold mine a week before all this happened. Pending layoff forced sale and couldn't wait. Sold to CarMax for $17,500. Not ideal but for the best considering my situation. $11k is giving that car away. Almost doesn't seem real, but stranger things have happened.
KBB says his car's trade-in value is "worth" 16-17K and private party sale is 19-20K.

So even though I had my MSRP wrong, I still had the overall point correct.
Trade-in value does not equal market value, and his 21K value assessment is still nearly right in line with KBB values...provided he sells it private party.

11K is giving it away and if people want to sell their cars they need to do so on the private market and take the time to deal with tire kickers and etc. just like any other sale that doesn't have anything to do with this scandal.

If you are in a hurry to sell your car and you don't want to deal with it then take it to the dealer but expect to get taken to the cleaners.

I have a 98 TDI Bug with 200k on it with an immaculate interior and all service records from the day it was driven off the lot. KBB value is around 2K I think but I'd be surprised if a dealer offered me more than $1000. I estimate it'd probably sell in the 4-5K range if I wanted to sell it on the forums.

People need to quit freaking about about KBB and the ridiculously low amounts being offered by dealerships who are in the business of making money, not giving eager sellers fair market value for their vehicles.
 

rick_deckard

Member
Joined
Oct 29, 2015
Location
NC
TDI
2014 Golf TDI Sun/Nav
Just came from the dealer......A gift card and trade in appraisal is coming to TDI owners this week or next week. He didn't know how much the gift card would be for but he said everyone who is THINKING about trading in their TDI should hold on.
He also said next month VW is going to start up their Sign & Drive promotion. He expects to sell 25 new VW's compared to the normal 15.
Also he said that no one will be forced to have the recall performed. The government can only force safety recalls. (California might be the exception)
They promised to keep me informed as to what else they hear.

Well, I consider this great news... Thanks for sharing!
 

romad

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 27, 2011
Location
Prescott, AZ
TDI
2005 Jetta GLS Wagon "Cranberry"
I said dog in the fight, so get your reference straight...Mark
Ah, the colloquial phrases "skin in the game" and "dog in the fight" mean the same thing: the person using the phrase has an interest in the subject being discussed. The actual phrases developed in different regional areas but are now used nationwide. BTW, Mark, your posts are at least literate and I can understand you (unlike another recent poster). Thank you for writing clearly.
 

romad

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 27, 2011
Location
Prescott, AZ
TDI
2005 Jetta GLS Wagon "Cranberry"
From what I hear there will be a big filler port attached to the top of your hood. It will open automatically when the nozzle is inserted.

There will be a DEF monitor in the car with a cell link.

When it comes on as soon as you hit the Interstate a big VW DEF tanker plane will fly overhead and automatically top you off ala midflight jet refueling. You speed up to 100 and it matches your speed, then a refueling boom is lowered until it mates with the port.

It sounds complicated but VW was trying to come up with a way to spill less DEF on your car than the service technicians do.
Wouldn't a probe and drogue system work better? ;)
 

jen_madcity

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2015
Location
Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf Sportwagen TDI SEL
My dealer has said they know as much as we know. Nothing more. It's interesting how some know nothing and some know something!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Torque17

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2015
Location
New York
TDI
2012 Golf TDI
Why I bought a TDI

I bought my 2012 Golf TDI for the following reasons in the order:

1a. Handling & Performance
1b. High mileage (mpg)
2. Longevity that diesels offer (better built vs. gasolines)...I wasn't looking for dumping the car in 3 nor 5 years...10 years was the plan with full intentions to do the recommended maintenance to get the max. usable life possible
3. Clean/low emissions (at least at the time of purchase)
4. owners on forums were extremely satisfied with power, performance, mileage, durability, lot of guys claimed over 200k miles of relatively trouble-free ownership
5. safer than Hondas/toyotas

In addition, I was very well aware of the fact that repair work and maintenance on VWs is not as economical as Hondas/Toyotas but I was willing to make that compromise by following the recommended maintenance schedule and could only hope for a least amount of unexpected failures.

Having said the above, if the retrofit increases the chances of failure(s) or other compromises and cost to owners, I would be disappointed. And if VW does not account at a minimum for this reasonableness that the customers can/should expect, then they are initiating opening a can of irrationalness. VW cannot expect unfairly treated customers to be reasonable with them either.

...enjoying my golf even more!
 

the beave

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 19, 2015
Location
seattle washington
TDI
2015 Jetta TDI S
@lightflyer. Hey man hostility in displayed in rudeness to one point in my original post coincides to other post made towards me after commentin in fuel additive forum. As always i conceded perfect mechanical knowledge in the question i posted about the fix and my right to understand its mechanical effects. I said i would like to hear more about this point.
The other two points you insultingly dismiss my rights as a consumer to intentional decptive fraud. And the incresed scrutiny at inspections.
On the last.. Alhough they dont sniff in Jefferson county. My stickers are due by 12/15 and the first thing my inspection guy asks about is the lAwsuit. So you expect to believe next time i go if i put a different muffler on he wont say "oh you modified the jetta"...this is scrutiny my coal rolling cummings driving buddies just skip on through. Im supposed to just eat it. That aint what i bought

gorts, can we please get a 'PopCorn' Emoticon like they have on the Hoffman Forums.....I really think you guys need one here desperately.
Thanks
the beave
 

PFCoppinger

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2013
Location
Worcester, MA
TDI
2014 Jetta Sportwagen
FWIW, I am not as certain as many seem to be that it is a certainty that all states will require the "fix" whatever it might be, to be completed in order to renew registration. For the most part, emissions tests check sensors, and if they all check out "ready" then you pass-- which all of these cars will do in their present condition. It seems to me that any rule targeting "affected" TDI owners will require new legislation at the state level. As far as I can tell, this is even true for California, because I am not sure that CARB has authority to target specific vehicle owners, rather than automakers. Because they will have to change the emissions test rules for these specific cars.

Nor is it very obvious, as many seem to think, that the EPA could force the states to do this. Through what mechanism? The EPA has zero control over auto registration at the state level. It is possible, as some have noted, that the federal government might attempt to force the states to act, in the same way that it forced the adopting of the Age 21 drinking age, or 55mph speed limit, etc. But that would likely require an new Act of Congress to support the EPA position. Have you checked in on the Congress lately? Not likely to support the EPA on anything, ever.

And even if it were, the "withhold funding" mechanism to force states to do XYZ, which produced the Age 21 drinking age and 55mph speed limit, among other things, was ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court just a year or two ago (the Obamacare decision).

It is going to be a very long while for a fix to be designed, proposed, and approved. It will then be another very long while before there is any mechanism to compel adoption of the fix by vehicle owners. And then yet another very long while to get the fix, because of the queue that would then exist at VW dealers.

I think it likely that I will put another 60 or 70k miles on the car before any of this could become an issue that I must deal with.
 

bizzle

Veteran Member
Joined
May 21, 2013
Location
Southern California
TDI
2015 GSW SEL (totaled), 2013 Touareg Executive
So out of curiosity I called our local VW and asked them about the loyalty bonus and then went into leasing an eGolf. So using the 7500 credit toward the negative equity in our JSW our payments would work out to $500 dollars per month. If we just keep the JSW and lease the eGolf outright without trade in, it's nothing out of pocket and $265 per month. lol
 

ray96disco

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2014
Location
San Antonio, TX
TDI
2014 Jetta Sportwagen
So out of curiosity I called our local VW and asked them about the loyalty bonus and then went into leasing an eGolf. So using the 7500 credit toward the negative equity in our JSW our payments would work out to $500 dollars per month. If we just keep the JSW and lease the eGolf outright without trade in, it's nothing out of pocket and $265 per month. lol
Seems the best advice is to keep your car.
 

rick_deckard

Member
Joined
Oct 29, 2015
Location
NC
TDI
2014 Golf TDI Sun/Nav
My aversion to the eGolf versus the TDI is long road trips and the potential of not finding a charging station. Unless I'm driving through California, I'd imagine it would require at least a few trips out of the way to ensure I made it (I'm on the east coast - Carolinas).

That and living in an apartment without charging stations currently installed, which alone would be a nightmare uphill battle against the older population that lives here.
 
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