U.S. regulators approve fix for VW 3.0-liter diesel SUVs - Gen 2

Fourplay

, TDI Parts Ninja Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Nov 6, 2015
Location
Atlanta, GA
TDI
2014 A8L
I agree I wish they would have approved the PC class as well today to get the ball moving.
Agreed. If they are going to end up approving PC anyway (and it seems like there is no reason they wouldn't), it would be nice to get the fix money now and start offloading cars.

Oh well.
 

psd1

Veteran Member
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Aug 4, 2011
Location
OR
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2006 Jetta 2013 Passat SE 6Man
Agreed. If they are going to end up approving PC anyway (and it seems like there is no reason they wouldn't), it would be nice to get the fix money now and start offloading cars.
Oh well.
Don't give up hope yet. :)
 

dandel

Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2010
Location
new york
TDI
vw jetta sportswagen DSG
What about 2013 and 2014 Audi Q7? These were not included in the list?

Gen 2.1 SUV need software update and hardware modification to make them emissions compliant. When will the final restitution payment be made? When both are completed?

https://www.epa.gov/vw/epa-and-carb...and-vw-diesel-30-liter-sport-utility-vehicles

Hi,

Did they approve a fix for the 2013 and 2014 Audi Q7? It does not look like they were included in the list:

Vehicle Models Fix Description
Generation 2.1
SUVs VW Touareg (Model Year 2013-2014)
Porsche Cayenne (Model Year 2013-2014)
Audi Q7 (Model Year 2015) Software update plus
hardware modification.
Generation 2.2
SUVs VW Touareg (Model Year 2015-2016)
Porsche Cayenne (Model Year 2015-2016) Software update only.
 

Q5TDI

Veteran Member
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Jul 10, 2017
Location
US
TDI
Q5
Some great info in that link:

What you need to know:

  • November 6th will be the first date in which you can schedule an appointment to complete the ECR. These need to be scheduled through the VW Court Settlement portal (https://claims.vwgoa.com/#/)
  • Gen 2.1 repairs will take approximately 3 hours and Gen 2.2 repairs will take approximately 1 hour.
  • Gen 2.1 repairs will be both hardware and software, while Gen 2.2 repairs will be software only
  • The ECR is only eligible for customer vehicles at this point. New 2016 3.0L TDI vehicles are still under a stop sale.
  • The repair will come with a 10 year/120,000 mile from the original in-service date or 4 year/48,000 mile from emissions modification (whichever occurs first) extended warranty on the entire exhaust gas after treatment system, the entire fuel system, the EGR system, turbocharging system, ECU, TCU, OBD, and engine long block.
 

Fourplay

, TDI Parts Ninja Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Nov 6, 2015
Location
Atlanta, GA
TDI
2014 A8L
Some great info in that link:

What you need to know:

  • November 6th will be the first date in which you can schedule an appointment to complete the ECR. These need to be scheduled through the VW Court Settlement portal (https://claims.vwgoa.com/#/)
  • Gen 2.1 repairs will take approximately 3 hours and Gen 2.2 repairs will take approximately 1 hour.
  • Gen 2.1 repairs will be both hardware and software, while Gen 2.2 repairs will be software only
  • The ECR is only eligible for customer vehicles at this point. New 2016 3.0L TDI vehicles are still under a stop sale.
  • The repair will come with a 10 year/120,000 mile from the original in-service date or 4 year/48,000 mile from emissions modification (whichever occurs first) extended warranty on the entire exhaust gas after treatment system, the entire fuel system, the EGR system, turbocharging system, ECU, TCU, OBD, and engine long block.
Other than this bit that they got wrong, great info.

The warranty is 10 years/120,000 miles from the original in-service date or 4 years/48,000 miles from emissions modification, whichever occurs later.

Otherwise, any car with over 120K would have no warranty.
 

Marshfield

Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2017
Location
Marshfield, MA
TDI
2013 Touareg
OK fellow TDI 3.0 gen II owners the proposed fix is in...

10/25/2017

OK fellow TDI 3.0 gen II owners

Yes there was a fixed announced late last week

My dealer promptly called me to schedule it

I said, hooold on--Let me meet with VW rep on 1/2 pmt of $3300 on 11/2/2017 for "ownership verification".

I read the fix--think I am going to take the 1st 50%--run till I sell then do the fix to get the 2nd 50% --why?

The Fix degrades performance significantly

A: No more down hill safety shift down

B: Louder exhaust

C: Longer warm up time

D: 40% more Ad Blue consumption (Even though they offer free ad plue for a
short period of time)

E: No More bridge warranty (I am about to roll over to 100K miles and my
extended VW warranty will end)

F: Once I get my first payment "A" I was just told by Bosch they then send
$1,500 but with no specific date

G: 1-3 miles fewer miles per gallon (I currently get 29 HWY-sometimes 31..!)

Or the reason to do the fix,

A) $3,300 on 2nd payment--then

B) Emissions warranty that will cover future faulty expensive fuel pump issues

Sooo, if anyone wants the printed fix--email me as I am not sure how to add a PDF to this thread--or better yet please advise how to do that so I can post the PDF of the fix

Additional comments welcome

Signed,
Tired of this 3.0 G2 owner...
 

marmur99

Active member
Joined
Sep 5, 2017
Location
San Diego
TDI
2014 Beetle DSG Sun+Sound+Nav; 2015 Touareg Lux
Can someone help me understand the difference between these two:
2.0L gen1 extended warranty:
The On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) system, any malfunctions detected
by the On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) system other than those related
to the transmission
3.0L gen 2.2 extended warranty:
The On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) system, any malfunctions detected by the On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) system.
3.0L warranty doesn't exclude issues related to transmission that are reported by OBD.
Does it mean that the transmission is also covered by this warranty?
 

Fourplay

, TDI Parts Ninja Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Nov 6, 2015
Location
Atlanta, GA
TDI
2014 A8L
10/25/2017
OK fellow TDI 3.0 gen II owners
Yes there was a fixed announced late last week
My dealer promptly called me to schedule it
I said, hooold on--Let me meet with VW rep on 1/2 pmt of $3300 on 11/2/2017 for "ownership verification".
I read the fix--think I am going to take the 1st 50%--run till I sell then do the fix to get the 2nd 50% --why?
The Fix degrades performance significantly
A: No more down hill safety shift down
B: Louder exhaust
C: Longer warm up time
D: 40% more Ad Blue consumption (Even though they offer free ad plue for a
short period of time)
E: No More bridge warranty (I am about to roll over to 100K miles and my
extended VW warranty will end)
F: Once I get my first payment "A" I was just told by Bosch they then send
$1,500 but with no specific date
G: 1-3 miles fewer miles per gallon (I currently get 29 HWY-sometimes 31..!)
Or the reason to do the fix,
A) $3,300 on 2nd payment--then
B) Emissions warranty that will cover future faulty expensive fuel pump issues
Sooo, if anyone wants the printed fix--email me as I am not sure how to add a PDF to this thread--or better yet please advise how to do that so I can post the PDF of the fix
Additional comments welcome
Signed,
Tired of this 3.0 G2 owner...
Host it here and share the link:
http://freepdfhosting.com/

Interested to see what this says. Sounds like the performance of the car is pretty significantly affected - wonder what the PSC attorneys would say if you reached out to them (probably nothing, since they already got paid).
 

MBQ

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Location
Houston, TX
TDI
2012 Golf TDI 4Dr DSG
Host it here and share the link:
http://freepdfhosting.com/

Interested to see what this says. Sounds like the performance of the car is pretty significantly affected - wonder what the PSC attorneys would say if you reached out to them (probably nothing, since they already got paid).

This is what I was worried about the most.

From the pure technical standpoint of view, the cars are hard to fix without affecting the performance. But the "political" side of the things won: the EPA/CARB was bribed with enough money and showed "lenience" and the PSC lawyers got paid. Why do they bother doing more for the affected owners for nothing more?
 

marmur99

Active member
Joined
Sep 5, 2017
Location
San Diego
TDI
2014 Beetle DSG Sun+Sound+Nav; 2015 Touareg Lux

marmur99

Active member
Joined
Sep 5, 2017
Location
San Diego
TDI
2014 Beetle DSG Sun+Sound+Nav; 2015 Touareg Lux
10/25/2017
...
B: Louder exhaust
C: Longer warm up time
...
G: 1-3 miles fewer miles per gallon (I currently get 29 HWY-sometimes 31..!)
Where exactly did you read about B, C and G?

The booklet says:
"Engine sound may differ somewhat from your vehicle’s prior operation"
and
"Your vehicle’s fuel economy will decrease by up to 1 mpg, depending on driving style and habits"

doesn't mention longer warm up time
 

Fourplay

, TDI Parts Ninja Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Nov 6, 2015
Location
Atlanta, GA
TDI
2014 A8L
This is what I was worried about the most.
From the pure technical standpoint of view, the cars are hard to fix without affecting the performance. But the "political" side of the things won: the EPA/CARB was bribed with enough money and showed "lenience" and the PSC lawyers got paid. Why do they bother doing more for the affected owners for nothing more?
I don't think EPA/CARB were bribed - I believe the vehicles now meet their certified emissions levels.

However, the vehicles were tangibly made worse, but the PSC has absolutely zero motive to do anything about it, since they've already been paid out as part of the 3.0L Settlement 5 months ago.

Obviously, I'm bummed to not get a windfall from the 3.0L cars, but putting that aside, I do think 3.0L (Gen2) owners got screwed. The PSC fought tooth and nail to get every other car bought back on the basis of reduced performance/false advertising, even those which eventually had approved fixes. It's unfortunate that the same didn't happen here, for whatever reason.
 

Mythdoc

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2017
Location
Tennessee
TDI
2011 Touareg, 2015 Q5, 2015 Golf
Where exactly did you read about B, C and G?



The booklet says:

"Engine sound may differ somewhat from your vehicle’s prior operation"

and

"Your vehicle’s fuel economy will decrease by up to 1 mpg, depending on driving style and habits"



doesn't mention longer warm up time


Exactly. Sounds pretty fair to me.
 

Mythdoc

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2017
Location
Tennessee
TDI
2011 Touareg, 2015 Q5, 2015 Golf
I don't think EPA/CARB were bribed - I believe the vehicles now meet their certified emissions levels.

[snip]



I do think 3.0L (Gen2) owners got screwed. The PSC fought tooth and nail to get every other car bought back on the basis of reduced performance/false advertising, even those which eventually had approved fixes. It's unfortunate that the same didn't happen here, for whatever reason.


This is an old argument, dating back to when the 3.0 settlement was announced. To summarize, yes, it *seems* unfair on its face, but since these cars could be made compliant, with very minor changes, the EPA and FTC did not have the same basis for demanding a buyback.

If this case had been only a consumer class action, with no regulatory violation, do you think the settlement would be anywhere near this good? Look at the rest of the world to see what happens when a company defrauds consumers from nations that don’t have strong regulatory powers.

To conclude, you can say the newer 3.0 owners got shafted, but it is truer to say the older 3.0 owners and the 2.0 owners got more because VW’s violation of CAFE standards was that much worse.
 

bhuizer

Well-known member
Joined
May 26, 2017
Location
Iowa
TDI
2014 Toureg TDI, 2014 Q5 TDI, Past: 2012 Touareg TDI, 2012 Jetta TDI
I don't dispute that Gen-2 owners should have been given a choice to sell back to VW.

However, from an owners perspective who loves the 3.0. The $10k per vehicle PLUS the 120k mile warranty for some of the most failure prone components on a new diesel engine are more than worth the downsides listed in that PDF. Zero complaints from me.
 

DanB36

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2003
Location
Savannah, GA
TDI
2014 Q5 Prestige TDI, Monsoon Gray
10/25/2017
D: 40% more Ad Blue consumption (Even though they offer free ad plue for a short period of time)
That's "up to" 40% higher consumption, and the "short period of time" is 10 yrs/120k miles from new, or 4 yrs/48k miles from when the fix is done, whichever is longer.

E: No More bridge warranty (I am about to roll over to 100K miles and my extended VW warranty will end)
As already noted, your bridge warranty is already gone--it expired when approval of the fix was announced.

F: Once I get my first payment "A" I was just told by Bosch they then send $1,500 but with no specific date
That's not been my experience--I got my "participation payment" in July, and more recently got $750 from Bosch.
 

843tdi

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2016
Location
south carolina
TDI
2012 Audi A3 Premium Plus, 2015 Passat SE Tdi
They are giving free add blue during the extended warranty on the emission parts? Sorry I may have not read up enough but if so that's awesome but I wonder how that will work.
 

MBQ

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Location
Houston, TX
TDI
2012 Golf TDI 4Dr DSG
They are giving free add blue during the extended warranty on the emission parts? Sorry I may have not read up enough but if so that's awesome but I wonder how that will work.

We are talking about less than 50 bucks a year.

Yeah, that's better than nothing.
 

saggii

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 24, 2016
Location
Texas
TDI
No longer - Jetta(s), A6
Does anyone know if the Bridge warranty on 2 PC will cover the brake pad/caliper change? Or even just the diagnostics? The bridge warranty terms does mention that it should be treated as New Motor Vehicle Limited warranty. I know for sure that a few years ago they used to cover 1 brake pad change during the 1st 50k miles if required.
 

nayr

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2013
Location
Colorado
TDI
2014 Audi Q7
pads/rotors are wear items and not covered under any warranty, calipers mebe but those shouldn't need changed.. Diagnostic fees are typically incurred if warranty claim is denied.
 

Mythdoc

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2017
Location
Tennessee
TDI
2011 Touareg, 2015 Q5, 2015 Golf
We are talking about less than 50 bucks a year.



Yeah, that's better than nothing.


It’s a convenience for one. For another, you know that there is no possibility that bad DEF will go into the system or that dealer will try to claim such. Small as it is, I have been waiting and hoping for this perk as a cherry on the cake.
 

Careby

Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2017
Location
Kentucky
TDI
2015 Touareg
The extended emissions warranty definitely has some value to me. I expect to keep my Touareg for a long time, and since I'm not likely to exceed 12k miles per year, the coverage should continue until 2025. It does devalue the extended warranty I purchased when I bought the car, but I guess that might come in handy for something not covered by the emissions warranty, like a transmission.
 
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