TURBO: 2012-2014 Passat turbo failures [discussion thread]

[kevdanani]

VW Denied Extended Warranty for 2013 Passat

Thanks Gents. Here is my problem. Driving 70 MPH and Glow Plug came on shortly followed by a complete acceleration meltdown. By the Grace of God, no one rear-ended me and I was able to get off to shoulder for tow to dealer. Dealer never mentioned 120k/10yr extended warranty-rather drained the oil, took samples, and had VW rep inspect claiming the vehicle was not maintained. My car has 75k miles, last oil change was 12k ago and when turbo blew it burned oil. Dealer claimed that 2.5 quarts of oil and lack of maintenance caused turbo to blow. By the time I met the dealer he had already built his case so my claim to VW of A failed. I want my money back and need advice on how to effectively accomplish same.

 

[Ares]

Thanks Gents. Here is my problem. Driving 70 MPH and Glow Plug came on shortly followed by a complete acceleration meltdown. By the Grace of God, no one rear-ended me and I was able to get off to shoulder for tow to dealer. Dealer never mentioned 120k/10yr extended warranty-rather drained the oil, took samples, and had VW rep inspect claiming the vehicle was not maintained. My car has 75k miles, last oil change was 12k ago and when turbo blew it burned oil. Dealer claimed that 2.5 quarts of oil and lack of maintenance caused turbo to blow. By the time I met the dealer he had already built his case so my claim to VW of A failed. I want my money back and need advice on how to effectively accomplish same.

http://www.oag.state.md.us/consumer/lemon.htm

You're past the lemon law. So notify VW in writing and see what happens. next steps would be arbitration or lawsuit.

 

[NSTDI]

Thanks Gents. Here is my problem. Driving 70 MPH and Glow Plug came on shortly followed by a complete acceleration meltdown. By the Grace of God, no one rear-ended me and I was able to get off to shoulder for tow to dealer. Dealer never mentioned 120k/10yr extended warranty-rather drained the oil, took samples, and had VW rep inspect claiming the vehicle was not maintained. My car has 75k miles, last oil change was 12k ago and when turbo blew it burned oil. Dealer claimed that 2.5 quarts of oil and lack of maintenance caused turbo to blow. By the time I met the dealer he had already built his case so my claim to VW of A failed. I want my money back and need advice on how to effectively accomplish same.

If you have receipts for oil changes, you should be able to make a case with VW. I'd go directly to them and make a case, the blown turbo is a known problem that was subject to a warranty extension. The original owners were all sent a letter by VW extending the warranty.

Massive smoke and oil consumption is a common symptom of the blown turbo, lots of people on here have reported exactly that happening when the turbo blows.

Don

 

[VeeDubTDI]

What is causing turbochargers to fail in 2013 Passat TDIs?
For example, low engine coolant, infrequent oil changes, fuel filter replacement?

None of the above. It is caused by a small turbo being overstressed by a combination of high boost pressure, high exhaust restriction, and rapid temperature change during the engine and emissions system warm-up process.

The 23N5 computer update attempts to reduce these stresses by lowering maximum boost pressure when the engine is very cold.

VW has acknowledged a serious problem with the tubochagers and rather than issue a recall they offer an extended warranty coverage.
Can someone knowledgeable elaborate on what an owner can do to ensure he/she is covered by the warranty once failure occurs?

The best course of action an owner/operator can take to ensure turbo longevity is to install a ScanGauge, monitor temps, and drive smoothly and gently during the emissions warm-up cycle. I have elaborated on this extensively in numerous posts throughout the Passat forum. I also recommend making sure that exhaust temperatures are below 450F before turning the engine off. It would also be prudent to have the 23N5 software update done to your vehicle if it hasn't been done already.

 

[VeeDubTDI]

Thanks Gents. Here is my problem. Driving 70 MPH and Glow Plug came on shortly followed by a complete acceleration meltdown. By the Grace of God, no one rear-ended me and I was able to get off to shoulder for tow to dealer. Dealer never mentioned 120k/10yr extended warranty-rather drained the oil, took samples, and had VW rep inspect claiming the vehicle was not maintained. My car has 75k miles, last oil change was 12k ago and when turbo blew it burned oil. Dealer claimed that 2.5 quarts of oil and lack of maintenance caused turbo to blow. By the time I met the dealer he had already built his case so my claim to VW of A failed. I want my money back and need advice on how to effectively accomplish same.

Not trying to beat you up, but I would consider 2.5 quarts low and 2,000 miles overdue on the service schedule (unless backed up by a used oil analysis showing that the oil was safe to run beyond 10,000 miles) to be neglected maintenance.

You are going to have a very hard time convincing them to honor your warranty when you aren't maintaining the vehicle according to the service schedule.

That said, they need to check to see how much of your engine oil ended up in the exhaust system and intercooler, because that could explain where a significant amount of that 2.5 quarts went.

 

[NSTDI]

If you have receipts for oil changes, you should be able to make a case with VW. I'd go directly to them and make a case, the blown turbo is a known problem that was subject to a warranty extension. The original owners were all sent a letter by VW extending the warranty.

Massive smoke and oil consumption is a common symptom of the blown turbo, lots of people on here have reported exactly that happening when the turbo blows.

Don

I missed that 12000 was over the oil change period, mine is 15,000- KM's not miles.

 

[tadawson]

Not trying to beat you up, but I would consider 2.5 quarts low and 2,000 miles overdue on the service schedule (unless backed up by a used oil analysis showing that the oil was safe to run beyond 10,000 miles) to be neglected maintenance.

You are going to have a very hard time convincing them to honor your warranty when you aren't maintaining the vehicle according to the service schedule.

That said, they need to check to see how much of your engine oil ended up in the exhaust system and intercooler, because that could explain where a significant amount of that 2.5 quarts went.

2-1/2 quarts low was likely eaten by the turbo . ..

- Tim

 

[TypeRod]

Hi everyone, can someone please catch me up on the turbo failures? Since I traded in my 2013 passat tdi, two years ago after my turbo failure (which was a HUGE hazzard when it happend almost causing a massive rear ending of my passat with my kids in the back seat), i've lost touch with whats been happening. Has the new warm up program helped any? Did they come out with a revised turbo part number? I saw a new passat the other day and missed my old one, lol. This new one has LED tails and I think I saw HID and LED DRL's, all factory OEM. It looked awesome! I'm almost tempted to come back to VW, but how does that saying go, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me a third and I should sue you? lol! Yes, my family has had issues with each of the VW's we've had in the past 4 years. I still lurk on here weekly, but just have no time to sit and sift thru the long turbo failure discuss thread. Thanks in advance!

 

[tdiatlast]

I've been casual here for months, and my observation is that the turbo issues have settled down considerably...my opinion, of course...

 

[VeeDubTDI]

Turbo failure frequency has been reduced quite significantly. Why? I think a combination of three factors:

1.) Volkswagen's 23N5 flash to reduce turbo boost when cold
2.) Warmer winter temperatures this year
3.) Operator awareness and mechanical sympathy

As for the new Passat you saw with LED tail lights, it also has LED headlights (not HID). Finally, although not in time for TDIs, since those don't exist anymore.

 

[jason_]

#1.

Asking a lot to push a turbine hard enough to whip bearings in gooey oil @ 10k+ rpm when it's below freezing.

I start mine and let it idle for 3-5 mins

Block isnt warm, but the exhaust will heat the turbo housing, which in turn heats the oil a bit.


My 1ton with a nv4500, when it gets super cold, releasing the clutch in neutral will almost gag the engine and the truck will roll forward if on flat ground from thick gear lube....

So I can imagine impeller and shaft stress in turbos with the same concept.

Sent from my s-off'ed m7 with CM11

 

[tdiatlast]

#1.

Asking a lot to push a turbine hard enough to whip bearings in gooey oil @ 10k+ rpm when it's below freezing.

I start mine and let it idle for 3-5 mins

Block isnt warm, but the exhaust will heat the turbo housing, which in turn heats the oil a bit.


My 1ton with a nv4500, when it gets super cold, releasing the clutch in neutral will almost gag the engine and the truck will roll forward if on flat ground from thick gear lube....

So I can imagine impeller and shaft stress in turbos with the same concept.

Sent from my s-off'ed m7 with CM11

...think you left a zero off that number! (yes, I'm exaggerating, but not by much!)

 

[jason_]

There's some force applied to get things whirling that fast. And it's all transfered down the shaft.

Making 20# of boost will require some rpm, and it's possible a firmware update is keeping things mild until warm.

I wouldn't doubt there's high rpm to get mild boost of 4#

Sent from my s-off'ed m7 with CM11

 

[kydsid]

There is also a possibility the slowdown is due to lacknof interest or people coming here to report. I didnt post my own turbo failure here. Why bother when its a known issue?

 

[VeeDubTDI]

There is also a possibility the slowdown is due to lacknof interest or people coming here to report. I didnt post my own turbo failure here. Why bother when its a known issue?

Why bother? Because it helps the community identify and track issues, even ones that are known. If others join the "why bother" camp, it makes it start looking like the problem is going away.

 

[kydsid]

I see your point but counter with we have enough selective data to say their is an issue. Other than 23N5 nothing has changed in a stock Passat. Dpfs kill turbos. Our turbos are no longer if but when. It isnt going away.

 

[NYTDIBoy]

I see your point but counter with we have enough selective data to say their is an issue. Other than 23N5 nothing has changed in a stock Passat. Dpfs kill turbos. Our turbos are no longer if but when. It isnt going away.

I am in your camp for sure, it's the DPF and it's associated regen that are killing turbo's not excessive boost at low operating temperatures.

My old Jetta, which I gave to my friend when I bought my Passat, currently has over 360,000 miles on it. As far as I know the ECU wasn't programmed to limit boost when cold to the extent that our passats are. I drove that car until it had 300,000 on it and my buddy has put another 60,000 on it. Neither of us warm the engine up before driving it. Just let the engine idle for a few seconds then down the road. When I owned it I always used Mobil 1 Delvac or Rotella T. Knowing my friend he puts the cheapest crap he can buy at Walmart in it. I did 10,000 mile drain intervals, not sure what he does, but it probably has to do with "when I get around to it". The body, interior, and suspension of the car has seen much better days, but the turbo has never had an issue. With that many miles I really doubt the issue of adequate lube at startup is an issue for a modern turbo. You don't hear of it happening on gasoline turbocharged cars! Oils can be engineered to flow at low temperatures, but they can't be engineered to withstand the super high temps of a regen. It's the shutting the car down when it's the process of doing a regen that is doing the damage. That's why right after my turbo failure I bought a Scantool and mounted a tablet in my car to monitor regens.

 

[ben2mx]

There is also a possibility the slowdown is due to lacknof interest or people coming here to report. I didnt post my own turbo failure here. Why bother when its a known issue?

The purpose of posting it here is not simply to let others know "It happened to me" but if you look at the form, it has other fields where we try to identify the root cause.

That helps most forum members, with that vehicle to be able to be proactive and react and if possible, prevent it or the very least prolong it. I know it is covered under warranty, and I still don't want to have a damaged turbo if I can prevent it because I don't think my car will be the same, I don't want to go thru the hassle of being towed at my nearest dealer which is more than 1 hour away from where I live.

The more data the better.

 

[TypeRod]

I've been casual here for months, and my observation is that the turbo issues have settled down considerably...my opinion, of course...

Hows your TDI doing? Hows Texas treating you? You missed out on a nice blizzard we had a few months ago! Are you missing the Northern VA traffic? lol!

Turbo failure frequency has been reduced quite significantly. Why? I think a combination of three factors:

1.) Volkswagen's 23N5 flash to reduce turbo boost when cold
2.) Warmer winter temperatures this year
3.) Operator awareness and mechanical sympathy

As for the new Passat you saw with LED tail lights, it also has LED headlights (not HID). Finally, although not in time for TDIs, since those don't exist anymore.

Makes sense... Ooohh I didn't know they went to LED headlights! The car looked great, maybe I'll go for the V6, lol!

 

[jrm]

id have a hard time buying a gasser VW with the horrible customer service track record- you do know the Accord hybrid gets 50mpg on much cheaper fuel right

 

[NYTDIBoy]

id have a hard time buying a gasser VW with the horrible customer service track record- you do know the Accord hybrid gets 50mpg on much cheaper fuel right

Last Friday at work I got in my car to go to lunch and I got a warning for low coolant. After tearing it apart in my neighbors garage Saturday morning found the water pump is shot at 74k! It leaked all over the timing belt so I guess 130k for a TB change is a little optimistic. I am hoping they offer buy backs, I am done with this POS

 

[tdiatlast]

Hows your TDI doing? Hows Texas treating you? You missed out on a nice blizzard we had a few months ago! Are you missing the Northern VA traffic? lol!

Loving the Ft. Worth area, much less traffic than Dallas, or Northern VA. In fact, because of 3.5m commute to TCU, bought a 2015 Leaf for my wife, getting 4 miles per KwH, only $.066/Kwh, 100% wind generated. So $.016 per mile, no smoke, no stink, weirdly linear power delivery, instant torque. Loving it. Summer heat will challenge it, but we'll be careful. (FYI...total junk paint job, makes our VWs look like Bentleys...seriously!)

2014 Passat coming up on 50k miles, just got 52mpg r/t to Dallas, at 70-75mph.

Best of both worlds: Passat is a great cruiser, great mileage. Leaf is perfect for up to 75 miles (real world!) daily use, overnight charge.

Oh yeah...2009 JSW just crossed 100k miles, runs great, no sooty tailpipe whatsoever! My favorite car...

 

[VeeDubTDI]

The Leaf is a very nice little car (actually not so little on the inside), and those wind power rates are outstanding! For comparison, I'm paying $0.135/kWh from renewable power from Dominion here in VA (through their REC purchasing program). They do have other programs with rates as low at $0.05/kWh for off-peak and EV night time charging, but we're still fossil fuel vehicles only for now.

Sorry, that's all way off topic.

 

[TypeRod]

Loving the Ft. Worth area, much less traffic than Dallas, or Northern VA. In fact, because of 3.5m commute to TCU, bought a 2015 Leaf for my wife, getting 4 miles per KwH, only $.066/Kwh, 100% wind generated. So $.016 per mile, no smoke, no stink, weirdly linear power delivery, instant torque. Loving it. Summer heat will challenge it, but we'll be careful. (FYI...total junk paint job, makes our VWs look like Bentleys...seriously!)

2014 Passat coming up on 50k miles, just got 52mpg r/t to Dallas, at 70-75mph.

Best of both worlds: Passat is a great cruiser, great mileage. Leaf is perfect for up to 75 miles (real world!) daily use, overnight charge.

Oh yeah...2009 JSW just crossed 100k miles, runs great, no sooty tailpipe whatsoever! My favorite car...

Wow, that sounds awesome! I would love to get a trouble-free Tesla, but I don't think I can even afford a used one, lol. I would def. get a pure electric if it was reliable, and had a range of at least 300 miles. But again assuming I could afford one, lol.

 

[SilverGhost]

So I'm replacing a turbo for leak around VNT rod and thought I post up the latest part number tag.

Car ran fine, just a MIL for HO2 sensor rich and the exhaust leak.

Jason


Sent from my iPhone

 

[VeeDubTDI]

That's a turbo part number that I haven't seen yet on the NMS Passat. Interesting!

 

[jrm]

0035

 

[meducky]

Question for you guys, I am wondering if my turbo is going.... When I start my car in coldish temperature near zero Celsius, the engine sputter like it is misfiring. When I take off and engine under load in regular driving conditions (engine still cold but warming up), I can hear what sounds to me like a lifter out of oil or metal scratching coming from the engine and the engine shudders (hesitation) in an out of it's acceleration despite me keeping my foot steady on the throttle. Once the engine is hot, I no longer have these issues. My next move is to bring it in to the dealer but the weather is getting hotter now and the symptoms are not present as often. If you guys have any insight it would be appreciated. I have a little bit over 120,000 km on the clock.

 

[VeeDubTDI]

Lifter tick is a common complaint, but nobody has had anything fail yet.

As for the uneven powerband, that is also normal during warmup. Search "emissions warmup" in this subforum.

It's possible that you have another problem, but what you've described sounds normal to me.

 

[kydsid]

Run a scan and see if you have any codes for low injector performance.