Troubled 03 ALH wagon

[oldpoopie]

So a customer brought an alh to me for a timing belt/cam/lifter job...the car when cold also smokes and coughs and is throwing a cyl 2 misfire code intermittently.

1st thing I did was compression test
Cyl 1 420
Cyl 2 385
Cyl 3 390
Cyl 4 410

Then swapped in a spare set of injectors..
no change

Then I did the timing belt, cam, lifters, oil change, coolant temp sensor, thermostat, and new injection pump.....
No change

I ran it from a separate fuel source....
no change

I swapped in a spare crank position sensor....
No change

Cleaned the intake manifold AND the ports in the head (very dirty).....
no change

Did a leakdown test. All 4 cyl test between 6% and 10%

Im really at a loss on this one... on cold start it knocks and pings like crazy.... hot it smooths out. Smoke is all white unburned fuel smoke, NOT oil....

 

[maxmoo]

If you are at a loss how do you think we can help?
Looks like you've covered pretty well all the bases.

How about sticking valves, weak springs......also those center two cylinders compression being the lowest does make one wonder if rods are slightly bent.

Any history?

 

[steve6]

That engine had a timing belt or runaway 'event' at one point, I would think given the differences in compression.

 

[Windex]

Where is the timing set? What is the iq? How are the group 13 injector balance #'s? How is the intake?

 

[maxmoo]

egr?.

 

[jasonTDI]

That's bent rods. pretty simple. not a lot, but enough to cause the blue smoke. Seen it many, many times.

 

[oldpoopie]

That's bent rods. pretty simple. not a lot, but enough to cause the blue smoke. Seen it many, many times.

Smoke is not blue but white.
Turbo is original.
Engine burns no oil.

 

[oldpoopie]

egr?.

Ran it removed, no change.

 

[oldpoopie]

Where is the timing set? What is the iq? How are the group 13 injector balance #'s? How is the intake?

Timing is set to top of graph.
IQ is set at about 4. (Remember i swapped pumps no change) all adaptation values at 32768
Injector balance is well within spec.
Again, intake and ports in head were quite dirty. Cleaned them, no change.

 

[oldpoopie]

That engine had a timing belt or runaway 'event' at one point, I would think given the differences in compression.

The compression isnt that far off though.

 

[James & Son]

How about something to do with glow plugs: would that not cause white smoke( raw fuel) (if compression is good) on warm up if it is still cold enough. How about anything that will cause large fuel droplets and liquid fuel, so what about the fuel temperature sensor in the IP.

 

[oldpoopie]

How about something to do with glow plugs: would that not cause white smoke( raw fuel) (if compression is good) on warm up if it is still cold enough. How about anything that will cause large fuel droplets and liquid fuel, so what about the fuel temperature sensor in the IP.

Its 60 here.
Swapped pump and injectors....

 

[bbarbulo]

second the bent rods, but that's negated by your 'turbo is original' comment... how do you know it's original?

what's the MAF readings like? fuel temperature reading?

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

When my wagon had bent rods it started and ran great. Some blue smoke at start up, but not more than you'd expect with a 300K mile head. FE was good, no codes. Never blew a turbo. But all four rods were slightly bent. Without tearing the engine down you'd never have known.

Of course my bent rods were because of abuse I gave the engine in its life, not from a runaway or hydrolock. Question is if that can happen on a stock car that hasn't had an "incident."

 

[oldpoopie]

Thats the thing. This car is a BONE STOCK automatic. I bent rods in my golf from abuse too, and it ran fine.... blue smoke and oil consumption....
this car starts and runs crappy when cold and smokes white.... then smooths out when warm.

 

[oilhammer]

Sounds like bent rod(s) and/or some wear on the engine for whatever reason.

 

[csstevej]

I third the bent rod theory, #2 and 3, they are slightly bent for what ever reason.
Play it safe and suggest removing the head and doing a height check on the Pistons. Your gonna find those two slightly lower.......going through that my self on the one I'm working on now.......one rod .006 below other three. Just my .02.

 

[oldpoopie]

Yeah that's what I'm leaning towards too.

 

[Geordi]

Why are the rods on this engine so soft that they can be bent without a runaway or other catastrophic event?

Are there stronger options available?

 

[oilhammer]

Why are the rods on this engine so soft that they can be bent without a runaway or other catastrophic event?

Are there stronger options available?

They are plenty robust. But if something went wrong in that car's past, even something as simple as ingesting a bunch of water from a giant puddle, then the rods can bend. No different than any other diesel really.

 

[bbarbulo]

at least 2 people in just this thread have said they have bent rods from abuse and not hydrolock or detonation. doesn't sound like the definition of robustness

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

I bent rods because I was running a lot more fuel, 26 PSI boost, and a 6000 RPM tune that I used frequently at the track. I did that for over 100K miles before the engine, at 265K miles, started to show some ill effects. I think that's pretty robust.

 

[Geordi]

Ok... Peter, that isn't abuse, that is flogging the everluvin HECK outta it!

 

[maxmoo]

Nah.......that's called "Fahrvergnügen"....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOnne-90CLI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJy9HdUC7nU

 

[oldpoopie]

I bent rods because I was running a lot more fuel, 26 PSI boost, and a 6000 RPM tune that I used frequently at the track. I did that for over 100K miles before the engine, at 265K miles, started to show some ill effects. I think that's pretty robust.

Same......

 

[oilhammer]

Yeah, you have to take it WELL beyond its normal intended operating conditions to do anything like that. The ALH is a VERY good engine.

 

[James & Son]

Yeah that's what I'm leaning towards too.

The thread is very similar to your situation, but had a little more history to go on but the symptoms and compression and leak down were very similar to your case. Bent rods.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=325658

 

[Windex]

"Easy" to check - yank the head and check piston protrusion.

 

[jokila]

I knew a guy who had on a few occasions had his engine "stumble" and ran rough temporarily when he drove it in the rain. On another occasion when it rained heavily, it really locked up when after some time of him driving start and stop traffic. I guessed that the water slowly leaked into the intercooler and pooled up finally killing the engine.

Turned out the intercooler had a crack at the top due to an accident on that side of the car. Putting on our CSI hats on we figured the previous owner had a wreck on that side because of the new headlight and newer paint. Body shop must have fixed everything but didn't know about the intercooler. It ran fine despite the crack in it. I guess it wasn't bad enough to cause a boost leak that was noticeable but let the water in.

My point to all this is it could have had a "minor" incident in its past like my friend's engine, but is really significant now. Which pistons bear the brunt of a hydrolock situation?

 

[bbarbulo]

Omg that's not just abuse! Lol alright that's pretty robust then. I was thinking you drove hard in stock form at extended periods of high rpm, didn't mention you were doing tractor pulls