Trouble putting in new struts

[jlav0330]

So let me start by saying that I knew about the strut spreader tool, and opted for a 1/4" extension, and it worked fine to hammer into the gap in the hub assy and get the old strut out. Also, let me note that while I took the strut out, I also took out my lower control arm (LCA) because I needed to replace the cracked rear bushing. So the only thing that's still attached to my hub/rotor assy is the tie rod and the brake line, and I have my jack under the bottom of the rotor to support it.

I have my new strut in there, and it's partially fastened in there (waiting for it to be in the hub assy hole before I tighten down the top, it'll not rotate when it's in there). But I am now having the hardest time to try and put the bottom part of the new strut back into the hole of the hub assy. Even putting in the 1/4" extension and widening the hole is not helping. Please note that I still don't have my LCA in, because I still need to press in the new rear bushing, and am going to bring it to a shop to have it pressed in. So I am trying to jack up the hub assy where it's at on the bottom of the rotor, and I think that's where the problem lies. The force that's pressing isn't center under the strut, so it just wants to go in crooked. So what should I do, put back in my LCA and reattach it to the hub assy, and try it that way? It would eliminate the need for the jack under the rotor because the hub is now being supported under again.

 

[Vince Waldon]

Are you working on the passenger side or the drivers side?

Drivers side should slide in, especially with no lower control arm.

Passengers side not so much, because the longer axle on that side will hang up on the subframe mount.

VW wants you to pull the axle and CV out. I pull the tie rod. Either lets you slide the knuckle forward more and clear the axle/subframe interference.

If it's all lining up properly but won't slide in:

- perhaps there's some rust build-up that's getting in the way. I use a small rotary wire brush on the end of an electric drill to clean the "socket" the shock slides into

- it may be your improvised strut spreader opened the gap wide enough to pound the shrut out, but not wide enough get it back in easily.

 

[jlav0330]

Driver's side. I have the axle out, because it's easier to slide out the LCA that way. Also I purchased some new ball joints (car has 200k miles, might as well replace it), so it's better having the axle out and to the side. Will it be impossible to put the strut into the "socket" of the hub assy if everything else is attached?
Side note: boy, you got me excited to do the passenger side now with you saying it's even harder...

 

[Vince Waldon]

On the drivers side there should be enough clearance to slide the shock into the knuckle socket with the LCA and ball joint in place. Just did it last weekend, in fact.

Some people find it helps to use a pry bar to push the LCA down. Others find they prefer to compress the spring a bit with spring compressors to buy an inch or two. Did not have to do either last weekend, but I remember needing a crowbar once in the past.

Sway bar is unbolted, right?!

 

[jlav0330]

Oh yeah, sway bar is definitely unbolted. Think that was the first thing I did after taking off the wheel, lol. Well, then I will put back in LCA and I have a pry bar in case it gets difficult. I just think it will help because it creates more support for the hub assy and I don't have to deal with my jack supporting it. I can try and clear the "socket" in the wheel hub assy from any rust, but there really isn't any rust to speak of on the bottom of the car. It's been a central coast California car almost all its life (now Southern California), so no Edmonton winters to speak of

Because you did this literally last weekend, what do you recommend for the passenger side? Remove the tie rod makes life a little easier?

 

[Brett San Diego]

One tip, use some bearing grease on the strut's barrel.

I recall a minor battle with the passenger side strut on my 02 Jetta. I separated the inner CV joint from the transmission flange, which I think is a factory procedure. I think I had trouble with a metal tab on the strut hanging up on the knuckle. I also recall that I actually had it seated all the way in before I thought I did. I didn't look at the fitment closely enough before I disassembled things, so I didn't realize it was seated all the way down when it was.

Brett

 

[Vince Waldon]

Because you did this literally last weekend, what do you recommend for the passenger side? Remove the tie rod makes life a little easier?

With the LCA disconnected, either removing the axle (so that the knuckle assembly can pivot forward) or the tie-rod (so that it can move to the front) should work.

I prefer the tierod 'cause there's no fancy torqueing proceedure or breaker bar required for that nut (unlike the axle)... but either should work.

9 times out of 10 when I'm doing this job I'm doing a full suspension refresh (tie rods, ball joints, LCA bushings, strut bearing and bushing) so that I only have to do this once... and pay for one front end alignment... every 5-10 years. So, I've already got the tie rod disconnected.

 

[jlav0330]

Yeah I went and rented a tool to remove the ball joint because I will be replacing both of them. This tool can be used for the tie rod too, so I will be doing that also.

And Brett, would Moly grease work too? I got a whole tub of that.

 

[super1]

I remove the hub assembly, and mount the strut on to the hub on the floor, seems like you got everything disconnected except the tire rod so you might as well take the tire rod off and remove hub & work on the floor so much easier to mount the strut onto the hub then


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[PakProtector]

I did this twice now. On both Koni and Bilstein the tab that insures the strut is properly clocked in the knuckle had to be ground down so it allowed the spreader tool to get further into the crack. Not ground a lot, or to remove the fail-safe protection of it engaging the clamp bolt, but some of it had to go.

Once properly spread, the strut went right in. This done with the knuckle bare; no brakes as it was in one case part of the 288mm upgrade. I think on the stock job, I took off the rotor and disc.
cheers,
Douglas

 

[9755]

It's not as bad as it seems. Just did it last night. Sway bar link off and sprayed some penetrating oil on the strut. That allows for a smidge more wiggle it seating it. Also found it was easier with the top of the strut mounted. Thing the tiny but if lube is what helped me so much. I did koni oranges with lift springs. Under an hour to do both sides

 

[Andyinchville1]

HI,

FWIW , I bought the spreader tool and it did not seem to open things quite enough so we wedged in something else (I think maybe a dime) into the gap and twisted the spreader tool .... it opened things up just enough to get the strut bottom to slide in.

I think the spreader tool should be made to spread more.

I like the idea about lube but I didn't try that myself

Hope this helps

Andrew

 

[Vince Waldon]

Also found it was easier with the top of the strut mounted.

Absolutely... plus good to have the top of the shock anchored if pounding on the knuckle is needed.

 

[jlav0330]

Update: got the strut in after I put back the LCA with new bushing and new ball joint (the ball joint didn’t have a factor in getting it in, just needed to put in a new one). Just trying to push the stem of the strut in the wheel hub assy hole by supporting it with a jack just makes it push out too much. Having the LCA in keeps it centered.

 

[PakProtector]

HI,

FWIW , I bought the spreader tool and it did not seem to open things quite enough so we wedged in something else (I think maybe a dime) into the gap and twisted the spreader tool .... it opened things up just enough to get the strut bottom to slide in.

I think the spreader tool should be made to spread more.

I like the idea about lube but I didn't try that myself

Hope this helps

Andrew

I got a set of those spreaders, came with a small and a large. So far the large one is still new...
cheers,
Douglas

 

[KrashDH]

I got a set of those spreaders, came with a small and a large. So far the large one is still new...
cheers,
Douglas

This was not mentioned so I'll throw it in a something to look for...

Those spreader tools are made of tool steel... It's much harder than the soft casting of the knuckle. That tool will actually "wear" out a part of the knuckle in the slot... To where it won't actually spread anymore because you've now worn a groove into the material... Which is exactly why they make the larger one.

I had a beast of a time with the standard tool spreading the gap enough to set the strut drop in. I had to work it up and down the slot where there was still material there. It was so frustrating. I didn't have the larger spreader.

Next time I do struts I will need to invest in the larger tool.
If that doesn't work there are some tricks you can use.

 

[PakProtector]

Once again, If you grind off some of the tab on the strut, you can engage more of the knuckle with the spreader...
cheers,
Douglas

 

[KrashDH]

Once again, If you grind off some of the tab on the strut, you can engage more of the knuckle with the spreader...
cheers,
Douglas

May be an option yes. Grinding on new parts really isn't my jam though unless I'm fabbing from scratch. Don't want to remove too much, that tab that is around your bolt is your only backup safety factor to the pinch bolt. Remove too much material and it pops... Could be bad.

Highly unlikely, but yeah the things I think about being a designer...

 

[jlav0330]

Update #2: wow, the right was quite the PITA. As another user said here, the larger diameter axle really likes to get in the way. On the left side, I was able to get away with keeping the ball joint on the hub and fastened to the LCA while I pushed up the strut into the knuckle. The right side? I had to disassemble everything, even caliper and rotor, and start off with just the hub assy as I forced in the strut into the hole. I worked my 1/4" extension (as it was serving as the spreader tool) down as the strut got further and further into the hole, and eventually got completely seated. From there, I put back in my axle, then the ball joint to LCA, then the tie rod, then put back the rotor and finally the caliper. Wow. So if anyone's reading this and doing the right side, you can maybe follow these steps. Maybe you have another easier way, but this is what worked for me.

The backs however? Jeez, what a different story. Both sides took me 30-45 min each. What a difference! Driving around today, I noticed that there's a spring noise that's coming from the back left side. It's as if the spring's not seated properly. Maybe I didn't force the boot on enough when I was putting in the shock into that upper mount that bolts to the frame. Either way, I can maybe even adjust that with the wheel off, who knows.

 

[super1]

Update #2: wow, the right was quite the PITA. As another user said here, the larger diameter axle really likes to get in the way. On the left side, I was able to get away with keeping the ball joint on the hub and fastened to the LCA while I pushed up the strut into the knuckle. The right side? I had to disassemble everything, even caliper and rotor, and start off with just the hub assy as I forced in the strut into the hole. I worked my 1/4" extension (as it was serving as the spreader tool) down as the strut got further and further into the hole, and eventually got completely seated. From there, I put back in my axle, then the ball joint to LCA, then the tie rod, then put back the rotor and finally the caliper. Wow. So if anyone's reading this and doing the right side, you can maybe follow these steps. Maybe you have another easier way, but this is what worked for me.

The backs however? Jeez, what a different story. Both sides took me 30-45 min each. What a difference! Driving around today, I noticed that there's a spring noise that's coming from the back left side. It's as if the spring's not seated properly. Maybe I didn't force the boot on enough when I was putting in the shock into that upper mount that bolts to the frame. Either way, I can maybe even adjust that with the wheel off, who knows.

I remove the hub assembly, and mount the strut on to the hub on the floor, seems like you got everything disconnected except the tire rod so you might as well take the tire rod off and remove hub & work on the floor so much easier to mount the strut onto the hub then

I guess you missed us on post #9


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[PakProtector]

May be an option yes. Grinding on new parts really isn't my jam though unless I'm fabbing from scratch. Don't want to remove too much, that tab that is around your bolt is your only backup safety factor to the pinch bolt. Remove too much material and it pops... Could be bad.
Highly unlikely, but yeah the things I think about being a designer...

Glad you are thinking about it. Ultimately IMO, if the bolt isn't clamping that wee sheet metal tab is going to part company with the strut body fairly quickly.

I can't escape the idea that it is there for a brake line and sensor wire holder clocking confirmation during 1st assy. Beyond that the holding is a benefit, but it is not going to hold much, or for very long.

All that said, I only removed a little of it when I did struts on my car and my Son's...
cheers,
Douglas

 

[Shenandoah]

I've mentioned this in other posts: It's easier to pull the entire strut/knuckle assembly out of the car and replace the strut on the bench. You unbolt the tie rod end nut, hit the flat area with a ballpeen hammer and the tie rod end is loose. Unbolt the lower ball joint from the control arm. Take the axle nut off and press it out of the bearing. 30 minutes or so and you have the complete assembly out.

When I do struts, I do lower ball joints and wheel bearings. I also check the tie rod assembly and lower control arm bushings and replace as needed.

To remove the strut I use a medium size cold chisel that I drive in the slot from the bottom towards the top. That spreads the knuckle so the strut can come out. It also doesn't make a groove in the knuckle slot like mentioned in this post.

Eric

 

[jlav0330]

I did remove the tie rod also. Sorry super1, I did read your post, and pretty much did what you do too. Don't want to make it seem like I didn't take your advice! Your post did cross my mind when the right side wasn't working out, and I concluded that I had to disassemble everything. Thanks.

 

[P2B]

FYI it's possible to re&re both struts without undoing anything other than the sway bar.

Before lifting the car, replace the shouldered nut on top of the old strut with a tie rod jam nut. This allows the rubber bump stop to be removed when the car is lifted, which provides an extra couple of inches clearance when removing the strut.

Assemble the new strut with a tie rod jam nut and leave the bump stop off until after the strut is installed in the knuckle, then swap in the proper top nut once the car is back on the ground.

This technique can also be used to replace strut bearings easily - with the bump stop removed you can access the bearing while the weight of the car compresses the spring.

Simon

 

[Nuje]

Driving around today, I noticed that there's a spring noise that's coming from the back left side. It's as if the spring's not seated properly. Maybe I didn't force the boot on enough when I was putting in the shock into that upper mount that bolts to the frame. Either way, I can maybe even adjust that with the wheel off, who knows.

Make sure the spring is fully seated in the zinc plate on the bottom, and that the top end of the spring is right up against the "stop" of the rubber spacer up top.

 

[UhOh]

Not a new rodeo for me but I'm just dead in the water on getting the right/passenger (US) side new strut installed. Spring compressors have the bulky heads on them which reduces the starting spread (making them wider to start with ends up jamming them against the inside of the towers. Collapsed I'm a good 2" shy of getting the strut end into the knuckle.

I've read of people doing all sorts of stuff and I've read of such not working for other folks. I really need a sure-fire way to do this with disassembling as little as possible. I am ONLY replacing the struts: don't have any new ball joints or other available; no new hardware (other than an axle nut), especially no new subframe bolts.

I've done this other times, but was replacing all suspension bits: new control arms (so ball joints loose etc..

Seems that if a person can get an old strut out that a new one ought to go back in.

 

[Nuje]

Honestly, I don't know how anyone does that without removing the ball joint bolts. I remember one time fighting for a few hours trying to figure out something with spring compressors of various shape and orientation, before just pulling the knuckle off (ball joint bolts and tie rod end nut - if they're not in too bad shape, I've re-used them with some blue loc-tite with no ill effects (not recommending, just what I've done out of necessity a couple times )- and wishing I'd done that a few hours earlier).

Scribing the ball joint bolt nut-plate should allow you to get it pretty close to the proper position so you don't need an alignment afterward. Clean up the bottom threads on the tie rod end "bolt" section before you remove the bolt so that it doesn't get jammed up on there. You can put a big pry lever on the tie rod itself if the nut starts spinning on you.

If you end up needing new ball joint plate bolts / nuts, 10.9 hardness spec from a bolt shop should do the job - that's what I find in the bag with some aftermarket ball joint kits.

 

[03TDICommuter]

Honestly, I don't know how anyone does that without removing the ball joint bolts. I remember one time fighting for a few hours trying to figure out something with spring compressors of various shape and orientation, before just pulling the knuckle off (ball joint bolts and tie rod end nut - if they're not in too bad shape, I've re-used them with some blue loc-tite with no ill effects (not recommending, just what I've done out of necessity a couple times )- and wishing I'd done that a few hours earlier).

I've yet to take the ball joint apart to change out the struts. On my Jetta, I lowered the subframe. On my beetle, I compressed the springs while the strut was still in the car. I had to take the strut compressor apart and use a length of 3/4" copper pipe to space the threaded shaft so that it could compress the spring without jamming itself up into the strut tower. It worked, had to compress the spring quite a bit, and it was still a struggle to get the new strut in as they always seem oversize going into the knuckle, but it can be done. In fact I had to do it 2.5X on the beetle as the first time I put in Sachs and they were too soft. Then was going to do them again with Koni Reds, but found the fairly new Sachs strut bearing had cracked, so I put it back together until new bearings came in, then did it all again when they did.

 

[Genesis]

Not a new rodeo for me but I'm just dead in the water on getting the right/passenger (US) side new strut installed. Spring compressors have the bulky heads on them which reduces the starting spread (making them wider to start with ends up jamming them against the inside of the towers. Collapsed I'm a good 2" shy of getting the strut end into the knuckle.

I've read of people doing all sorts of stuff and I've read of such not working for other folks. I really need a sure-fire way to do this with disassembling as little as possible. I am ONLY replacing the struts: don't have any new ball joints or other available; no new hardware (other than an axle nut), especially no new subframe bolts.

I've done this other times, but was replacing all suspension bits: new control arms (so ball joints loose etc..

Seems that if a person can get an old strut out that a new one ought to go back in.

Turn the compressor upside down. I can get 'em in and out this way with the compressors I have.

 

[P2B]

Trouble putting in new struts

So let me start by saying that I knew about the strut spreader tool, and opted for a 1/4" extension, and it worked fine to hammer into the gap in the hub assy and get the old strut out. Also, let me note that while I took the strut out, I also took out my lower control arm (LCA) because I needed...

forums.tdiclub.com

You don't need to use compressors to install struts.