Traction Control(ASR) Need a Ginnie pig

mrrhtuner

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Mar 29, 2011
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London Ont Canada
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2003 Jetta Wagon TDI, 2004 Jetta TDI, 2009 Jetta TDI, 2010 Touareg TDI
I tapped ground under the dash and power under the dash too with a 3 amp inline fuse. I didn't want to splice into the fuse box area.
The dimmer power comes from the dimmer adjuster by the headlight switch.

Is there a reason you used a 3amp fuse robnitro?
 

robnitro

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Jan 19, 2004
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NYC area, NY
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2001 Jetta TDI GLS silver
In case of a short, the small wire used wouldn't make enough fault current to blow whatever main fuse that feeds those termanls by the relays. Safety, mostly!

I'm an electrician by trade and have seen bad wiring burn and never trip the breaker because they were too small for the protective device-breaker or fuse.
Of course it wasn't done properly to the electrical code, but that's another story :)
 
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mrrhtuner

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2003 Jetta Wagon TDI, 2004 Jetta TDI, 2009 Jetta TDI, 2010 Touareg TDI
In case of a short, the small wire used wouldn't make enough fault current to blow whatever main fuse that feeds those termanls by the relays. Safety, mostly!

I'm an electrician by trade and have seen bad wiring burn and never trip the breaker because they were too small for the protective device-breaker or fuse.
Of course it wasn't done properly to the electrical code, but that's another story :)
I may consider adding that also then :)

When I did the full ESP upgrade, I used Posi-Taps by Posi-Lock. Very simple and easy to use.
http://www.posi-products.com/posiplug.html

Thanks RacerTodd,

I did see these before and I know it may be stupid but I've been trying to figure out the best method to run these wires. I would love to keep it completely OEM but I won't be pulling my wire harness for something so sm all. I was thinking of soldering but then there isn't that much space to get all that done.

I purchased 20-22ga Posi-taps just now from this site below (for fellow Canadians). Pretty good price.

http://www.admorelighting.com/ADML-PT-2022Q10?search=posi-tap
 

turbovan+tdi

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What's the difference between ASR and EDL? IF they are all in the same pump unit, how do they work differently if they both reduce wheel spin? I looked up ASR and it says it works above 40 mph, EDL is below 40 mph but my old 1.8T wagon with ASR, worked off idle as I would pin it in the snow and it would kick on?
 
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mrrhtuner

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2003 Jetta Wagon TDI, 2004 Jetta TDI, 2009 Jetta TDI, 2010 Touareg TDI
What's the difference between ASR and EDL? IF they are all in the same pump unit, how do they work differently if they both reduce wheel spin? I looked up ASR and it says it works above 40 mph, EDL is below 40 mph but my old 1.8T wagon with ASR, worked off idle as I would pin it in the snow and it would kick on?

I'm still learning about this...but some of the stuff I found:

ASR=Traction Control
EDL=VW's attempt to "simulate" an LSD and keep costs down (by not adding an LSD)

ASR reduces tire spin by reducing the power to wheels
"ASR only operates in conjunction with the electronic accelerator (E gas) and uses components of the anti-lock braking system (ABS). If one wheel suddenly begins to rotate faster than the others (slip), ASR intervenes in the engine management system and reduces power until the wheel stops spinning."
EDL pulses the brakes of a spinning wheel to help direct the power to the wheel with traction.
"The electronic differential lock (EDL) permits smooth, comfortable starts on road surfaces that do not have a uniform coefficient of friction. If a wheel starts to spin, EDL brakes it as necessary so that power is transmitted to the wheel with the better traction."
 

turbovan+tdi

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Thanks, great quotes.
 

mrrhtuner

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Thanks, great quotes.

It can be confusing because they both do something very similar. I wish there was a more clear explanation with road conditions and speeds.

Here is what Volkswagen's technical glossary says:

Traction Control (ASR)
For the high-torque engines, the traction control system offers more comfort and safety, particularly when driving on slippery roads or surfaces with differing degrees of grip. The traction control system facilitates smooth starting and acceleration over the entire speed range without wheelspin or fishtailing.
The traction control system operates in tandem with the electronic accelerator (E-Gas) and uses the wheel speed sensors of the anti-lock braking system (ABS). If a sudden increase in speed is detected at one of the drive wheels (slip), the traction control intervenes in the engine management system to counter this effect by throttling back engine power.
Traction control assures good traction and directional stability in the acceleration phase across the entire speed range and thus promotes active safety. In addition, it reduces tyre wear. Traction control also incorporates the electronic differential lock (EDL) and makes up part of the electronic stabilisation program (ESP).


Here is what they explain for EDL

Electronic Differential Lock (EDL)

The electronic differential lock permits smooth, comfortable starts on split-friction road surfaces with differing levels of grip. If one wheel starts to spin, the electronic differential lock will brake the wheel as necessary, directing power to the wheel with better grip in the process. The electronic differential lock reduces tyre wear and operates at speeds of up to around 40 km/h (4MOTION: up to about 80 km/h). As a software function, it forms part of the electronic stability control (ESC) and traction control (ASR).
 

robnitro

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NYC area, NY
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2001 Jetta TDI GLS silver
I wish there was a way to make the asr allow a bit more wheel slip, less sensitivity.

example: let's say it engages at 5% slip and averages 2% slip (sometimes cutting power below slip level- due to delay, slight turbo lag, etc)

If it could allow 10% slip, the average let's say 4%, it would be less invasive for performance. (the dips below slip periods would be less because there is less of a narrow range the controller is looking to achieve)

Some cars allow adjustment of this and are actually faster with the sporty levels than off!

I can say only in multiple racing sims, adjusting slip a bit higher helps a lot especially in wet conditions when friction is not as smooth (stick-slip).
That's where I got the 5% and 10% examples from.
 
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smopoim86

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Knoxville, TN
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03 Jetta Wagon, 11 Sportwagen
I installed the pump and never connected the defeat switch. I have a Wavetrac and have noticed the only time the traction control lights up is if both wheels are spinning. So the ASR must allow a single wheel to spin more than the LSD does.
I haven't yet ran into a situation that I needed it disabled. I couldn't make it up a hill in the snow last year and pulling the ABS fuse didn't make any difference (tires would have). Without the LSD, that probably isn't the case.
 

turbovan+tdi

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I have 2 ASR units, going to wait for an EDL unit. I drive a lot in the snowy mountains so I think EDL will be better for the wagon, especially with the wife driving.
 

mrrhtuner

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I have 2 ASR units, going to wait for an EDL unit. I drive a lot in the snowy mountains so I think EDL will be better for the wagon, especially with the wife driving.

1) 1C0 907 379 C/J ABS
2) 1C0 907 379 D/K ABS/EDL/ASR
3) 1C0 907 379 E/G ABS/EDL/ASR/ESP
4) 1C0 907 379 F/H ABS/EDL/ASR/ESP 4MOTION

ASR/EDL are one unit.

ABS only or ABS/EDL at the very least without ESP
 

turbovan+tdi

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Location
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TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
1) 1C0 907 379 C/J ABS
2) 1C0 907 379 D/K ABS/EDL/ASR
3) 1C0 907 379 E/G ABS/EDL/ASR/ESP
4) 1C0 907 379 F/H ABS/EDL/ASR/ESP 4MOTION
ASR/EDL are one unit.
ABS only or ABS/EDL at the very least without ESP

Got it.

Ha, found an ESP unit in a GLI 5 speed. Now if I can get the wagon back from insurance, got side swiped, its going in.
 

casioqv

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FYI I have a late 2001 TDI Golf w/ the MK60 pump, and the ASR/EDL works after swapping the ABS pump without reflashing the ECU, which there seemed to be some question over, since the late '01 models are similar to the '02 models. I did have to set the ABS soft coding from 4097 to 21505 to make it work. I can now see the triangle appear on the gauge cluster when the tires slip...


For reference, the pump I used is a 1C0 907 379 D removed from an MK4 GTI (according to eBay), which cost me $30.
 
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yurtesen

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Golf Variant
FYI I have a late 2001 TDI Golf w/ the MK60 pump, and the ASR/EDL works after swapping the ABS pump without reflashing the ECU, which there seemed to be some question over, since the late '01 models are similar to the '02 models. I did have to set the ABS soft coding from 4097 to 21505 to make it work. I can now see the triangle appear on the gauge cluster when the tires slip...


For reference, the pump I used is a 1C0 907 379 D removed from an MK4 GTI (according to eBay), which cost me $30.
Why 21505? How did you come up with it?

What about calculating from here?
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/VW_Golf_(1J)_Brake_Electronics_(MK60)

Also 18945 is suggested for 1C0 907 379 D ? : http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=988515&postcount=9

See: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=5483946&postcount=14
 
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casioqv

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Why 21505? How did you come up with it?
Honestly, I was in a hurry and googled it, and that seemed to be what people on vwvortex said they had as factory coding if they had factory ASR MKIVs. I didn't know about the instructions you posted above.

As claimed earlier in this thread, the difference between 18945 and 21505 seems to be that 21505 also turns on the feature of automatically accelerating the engine during a hard downshift, to keep from skidding the font tires:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=4336243&postcount=668

In any case, my system works well with this coding (test details here), so I will keep it like this.
 
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