Thermostat replacement

[2012jsw]

Just swapped mine, what an undertaking!! Has anybody had one replaced by a shop? Or had one quoted? @oilhammer what do you guys book time on that?? And what’s a rough idea of your shop rate?

 

[ksing44]

I recently had my thermostat replaced at the dealer. It was $1154.95, with just $104.95 in parts including new coolant.

 

[2012jsw]

I recently had my thermostat replaced at the dealer. It was $1154.95, with just $104.95 in parts including new coolant.

it was probably money well spent, it was a serious pain with a ton of parts to remove
to even be able to see it!!

 

[oilhammer]

Book time is 2.7hr. I always replace the plastic pipe that is prone to breaking, too. I think we charge 3.0hrs, we are currently $150/hr.

 

[2012jsw]

The plastic pipe that goes across the front of the motor and then back toward the driver?

 

[oilhammer]

Yep, the plastic pipe. 03L-121-065-T. They crack right where the double-lip o-ring slips into the thermostat housing.

 

[2012jsw]

Yep, the plastic pipe. 03L-121-065-T. They crack right where the double-lip o-ring slips into the thermostat housing.

well, hopefully mine is good
Felt good and looked good
Pain to get it into and out of the thermostat though

 

[oilhammer]

It is less of a pain when you are just replacing it. I've seen too many of those cracked and leaking, so I never do a thermostat without also replacing that. Curiously, the CKRA engine has that pipe made out of steel, but it is slightly different. Otherwise, that would be a nice easy upgrade.

 

[2012jsw]

It is less of a pain when you are just replacing it. I've seen too many of those cracked and leaking, so I never do a thermostat without also replacing that. Curiously, the CKRA engine has that pipe made out of steel, but it is slightly different. Otherwise, that would be a nice easy upgrade.

You book 3 for that pipe? Seems like there is a boat load of stuff in the way to get that out

 

[oilhammer]

Nothing in the way once the front end is off:

I have the front end of some VAG product torn off almost always at any one given time, it seems. Getting ready to take the front off of another NMS Passat (a 2.5L gasser). Just had two CKRAs apart last week, another one still waiting for the OK out back.

 

[2012jsw]

Nothing in the way once the front end is off:

I have the front end of some VAG product torn off almost always at any one given time, it seems. Getting ready to take the front off of another NMS Passat (a 2.5L gasser). Just had two CKRAs apart last week, another one still waiting for the OK out back.

That’s probably the smarter way to go about it

I left Everything in except the throttle body and I pulled the front mount bolt for the plastic tube so I had some play. Had it swapped and reassembled in 3-3.5 hrs. But there was a lot of fighting and cursing and a little blood.

 

[turbobrick240]

Yikes. The last t-stat I replaced was on my 4L Jeep XJ. Took all of 10 minutes and zero cussing involved.

 

[2012jsw]

Yikes. The last t-stat I replaced was on my 4L Jeep XJ. Took all of 10 minutes and zero cussing involved.

Those were the simple days!!! I built classic cars for 15 years, everything was A ok until the 70s and then we had a nice little reboot of manufacturer and engineers actually using their brains again in the like late 80s
“Cocaine is a h*ll of a drug” - Rick James

 

[oilhammer]

ALH thermostats take about 5 minutes... takes longer to heat cycle the engine to make sure the coolant is full, LOL.

The front ends of these cars come off easy, they designed them that way. Certain things you can fight to get in there, certain things you just can't. And it makes the things you can fight to be not a fight at all. I prefer to take the easy way, even if it means a few more steps. Most of these cars, the front end assembly comes off in about 20-30 minutes. Some of the fancier Audis may take a bit longer, but the transverse cars are pretty easy. The NCS and NMS have one-piece fender liners, though, so you either have to take them completely off or leave them hang at the front and work around them.

Only caveat is, you may have a struggle if you cannot easily discharge/recover/recharge the refrigerant. Because some models only allow the assembly to move so far with the condenser lines still attached, and even then sometimes the lines at the compressor can be in the way depending on what task you are doing. But you can always unbolt the compressor and hang it off to the side with the lines still attached.

 

[MrCypherr]

Luckily I was able to sneak the t-stat out from that plastic pipe without breaking it. That being said, I did have a new pipe with me just incase it broke. Perks of being a mechanic. I can leave it till later haha. All I had removed with the EGR, throttle valve and part of the pressure pipe.

 

[DivineChaos]

I'll have to look. I swear mine is metal.. maybe it was done before. Or just the pipe replaced.

 

[oilhammer]

They can break all on their own, it isn't really a case of breaking it during the thermostat change, although that is certainly a possibility. I mean, if they crack and leak all by themselves without ever being touched after original assembly, then handling them is .... ???

 

[MrCypherr]

Thats true. Luckily I havent seen many coolant leaks from a CJAA engine.

 

[DivineChaos]

Thats true. Luckily I havent seen many coolant leaks from a CJAA engine.

I had my coolant outlet flange leaking. That was fun to track down.

 

[borninabus]

what is the recommended replacement thermostat?
OE or aftermarket?
what did you choose @2012jsw?

i'm getting some conflicting info from my trusted shop (who knows their sh*t) and what i've read here. they are saying that the thermostat on the diesel is not a high failure item.....but i suspect that is because i live in PHX where a failed thermostat is not a big deal like other places where it is actually cold.

my temp gauge will fluctuate between--what i assume is--160 & 190 when the outside temp is below, say 75 degrees. it will drop when cruising under light load and gradually come up when sitting @ a light. i don't have any actual VCDS temp numbers, but when it's "cold" in the morning and i stop at a light, sometimes the idle will kick up like i just started the car. so i know the coolant is pretty chilly. i havent had any regen issues, so it won't throw the CEL and even documenting the gauge wouldn't convince my (very good) VW service advisor to attempt a warranty repair so i'm on the hook for this repair.

my trusted shop is telling me 4 hours book time on the repair, which leads me to believe them when they say haven't done many....or they really just don't want to do it

 

[DrGERTol]

what is the recommended replacement thermostat?
OE or aftermarket?
...

That's an interesting concern here: dealer list for 03L121111AM is $131 (discounted to $87-ish + shipping by some online vendors); FCP Euro offers the OEM Mahle Behr 03L121111AC (original p/n) for $51 shipped, and idparts sells a no-name aftermarket for $30. For me, if this were a 30 minute job (including coolant drain/fill), I'd say go with the low-cost part. For a 3+ hour job, OTOH, is it worth trying to save a few dollars on a no-name aftermarket part of unknown quality...

BTW, just read the rest of your edited post: we started noticing dodgy temp reading in our '11 wagon with 175K miles in the early fall when outdoor temps were starting to drop below, say 60F. We were out of warranty 6 months by then, and seeing failed DPF codes regularly, but no DTCs specific to engine coolant/operating temperature. So, another data point: failed/replaced 03L121111AC at about 176K miles (by the dealer, in our case). --g

 

[borninabus]

thanks for your input, DrGERTol.
much respect to your knowledge base

 

[Wilkins]

I bought a non OEM and will be changing it again. It worked fine for about a week, then started opening early and control is poor if it ever does get to temperature. Now eighteen months in service.

The original lasted 11 years and 100,000 miles. It was working better when replaced than the replacement is now.

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

Borninabus situation (Phoenix hot area) sounds like what may(?) be an issue with my 11? I'm in a hot area also and although I've got great drive ability, fast warm up my Kenwood has obdII info from Idatalink. It reads 179* ish when full warm where the factory reads 190*. I know factory "may" round off?

 

[smelly621]

Dash gauge is nearly useless to confirm if the T-stat is worn out or not. I just changed mine out @185k miles, would only get to 180 via ODB readings before, now it will get up to 200 at low load, 212 at sustained 85mph speeds through the mountains

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

Dash gauge is nearly useless to confirm if the T-stat is worn out or not. I just changed mine out @185k miles, would only get to 180 via ODB readings before, now it will get up to 200 at low load, 212 at sustained 85mph speeds through the mountains

@VCDS reading 180*, what was the dash reading? Did you use an o.e.m. replacement? All the info. I could dig up says o.e. thermostat @ 188*. Seems too low. Have you seen MPG difference with new t stat?

 

[oilhammer]

87C- 102C (the CJAA uses a staged thermostat).

 

[smelly621]

Dash has always stayed pegged at 190 before and after the thermostat replacement.

I ordered the aftermarket one from IDparts before I realized how big of a pain replacement was. Knowing what I do now I wish I'd just gone with OEM.

 

[borninabus]

i'm going with an OEVW replacement and am also doing the coolant pipe OH recommends as well. my shop's book time is 4.9hrs
.....but they are reasonable per hour and will "throw in" the labor on the pipe

 

[Wilkins]

I use Polar FIS to display ECU parameters in the MFD. My main screen shows actual speed and actual coolant temperature, neither of which correspond to the values the cluster displays. Coolant gauge starts to move at 50C (122 F). Coolant gauge stands straight up at 75C (167 F) and doesn’t move past straight up until temperatures higher than my coolant has ever reached. I’ve seen 105C (221F) from the ECU - at which point I pulled over and removed the winter front.