The "What did you do to your B4 today" thread...

[Abacus]

I mentioned this and for the price, I think it's the best deal out there. Fwiw, Febi is oem.

Btw, did swapping sensors fix your issue? If pressure is still low, check the intermediate shaft bearings. When these get worn, pressure drops.

The oil pump is a part that I've never seen go bad, until recently. How's the lash on yours? I'm guessing you're only swapping it to get rid of the bad drive tang?

I'd almost be tempted to weld material on, then file flat.

-Todd

Febi is OEM? I didn't know that.

I swapped sensors but have not run the car again. Based on the fact that the chime came on with the light, it's telling me it's a high pressure issue and not a low pressure. I remember reading (found it: Vince Waldon) that the oil buzzer only works with the high pressure switch and since the light and buzzer were going off, I conclude (if correct, have not verified with Bentley) that the oil pump pressure valve was malfunctioning. That I was able to start and drive it the last 5 miles home without incident sort of backs this up. As such I don't trust it and don't want to damage the motor.

I have not pulled the pump off the car yet to check the lash as per Bentley but I will. I am also going to check the lash on the 189K AHU in the barn to see how it compares to the new one. Perhaps I can then predict a replacement schedule for other AHU/1Z's since many of the ones I work on locally are over 300K now.

If the lash is still good, I may weld more material on and file it down, but it seems a gamble for something so critical and (for now) inexpensive.

If you want I can see what our local dealer can get. They'll let us return it.

I would be very interested to know this, yes. I know the dealer list is $285 eek but I would like to know which one they're getting the premium for and where it's made.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Ordered it. Only one in the country, it's in Texas. Should be here Thursday or Friday. Retail is correct, we can do a bit better. And it's returnable if you decide to go another route. I'll let you know when it gets here.

 

[Abacus]

Damn, are they being obsoleted as well?

 

[ToddA1]

OE and OEM are almost used interchangeably, these days. A perfect example would be the SKF timing belt tensioners that I was buying for about $25.

If you bought this part at the dealership there's a good possibility that the actual part may have the VW logo on it and the box would have the logo and part number.

If you bought it at Autohaus AZ you get the same plastic roller, the same Litens tensioner and the same SKF bearing. Likely no VW logo on the part and the box wouldn't have the logo or part number.

Basicly, if a company makes any parts for an auto manufacturer, they're considered OEM. I believe this even applies if a Ford supplier makes a VW part.

Interesting enough, I bought 2 of the Gates ratcheting alternator pullies from Amazon in the same order. One of the pullies came with the VW/Audi logo.

The same happened with an OEM (Kostal) ignition switch that I installed. Made in Spain and had the VW logo on it. No box.

-Todd

 

[minilooker]

Replaced my oem wheel with advanti deriva wrap with nitto tires. All bought from 4wheelonline.

 

[Abacus]

OE and OEM are almost used interchangeably, these days. A perfect example would be the SKF timing belt tensioners that I was buying for about $25.

If you bought this part at the dealership there's a good possibility that the actual part may have the VW logo on it and the box would have the logo and part number.

But that's just it, they are not interchangeable. Just because a part fits in the location does not mean it is of the same quality of the original. The original timing belt tensioner was a Litens with NTN bearing (Japan), so a non-Litens would not be OE/OEM but would be OEM compatible. I'd have no problem using a SKF or NSK (and have many times) but they were all installed on Litens tensioners anyway.

If you bought it at Autohaus AZ you get the same plastic roller, the same Litens tensioner and the same SKF bearing. Likely no VW logo on the part and the box wouldn't have the logo or part number.

So long as it's the same manufacturer. And I'd have no problem using it, or even calling it OEM, under those circumstances.

Basicly, if a company makes any parts for an auto manufacturer, they're considered OEM. I believe this even applies if a Ford supplier makes a VW part.

This is where we differ. Just because it fits, doesn't mean it's right (or OEM). Case in point: the serpentine belt rollers available through Autohaus, one is the larger bearing design (OEM) and the other is not. There is a world of difference between them. The URO one even touts "The Uro line has been OE factory approved on a number of parts for Jaguar and Mercedes while continuing to work on even more OE approvals. APA conducts extensive quality, fitment, and lifecycle testing in-house to assure customer satisfaction that the parts will exceed your expectations. Their engineers also work with manufacturers to design improvements and build better than OE products on those parts that had issues from the original manufacturer on the vehicles. Uro Parts is always striving to build the best available part at the most affordable price."

Well, sorry to say, but their rollers are JUNK, nothing but CRAP. I've been through too many to ever put one on a car again.

Interesting enough, I bought 2 of the Gates ratcheting alternator pullies from Amazon in the same order. One of the pullies came with the VW/Audi logo.

The same happened with an OEM (Kostal) ignition switch that I installed. Made in Spain and had the VW logo on it. No box.

-Todd

I have seen OEM without the brand, and then I have seen CRAP with the VW/Audi logo stamped on it, so they're not really an indicator of what is OEM/real and what is a fauduct (faux product, or junk).

If Febi actually makes the oil pumps, then awesome, I'll have no reservations using it, or even if they're of similar quality. But if they're Meyle, I don't care how many are installed across the US, I'll rebuild an original one before I'll toss it in anything I care about.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Keep in mind, too, that suppliers buy obsolete or worn out VW molds for products and make their own in them. We recently had an issue with a product (I forget what it was) that didn't fit because the mold was worn out and had been sold to an aftermarket maker. Logos on it.

And VW remainder stock is a big source of parts. Logos are usually ground off but the product is genuine.

What you get can be confusing. Even to us, and we're around parts all day.

 

[Abacus]

Yesterday I resealed the (last remaining) IP I have, which was going in the wagon. It has 189K on it and I pulled it from a rusted out A3 in the junkyard, so I assume it works. The reseal went OK, but the diesel inside the pump had turned to varnish, complete with the pure varnish smell.

Usually I'll dump the old fuel in the car to burn it but this went straight into the waste bucket for recycling. There was some evidence of rust starting so I'm glad I opened it up.

I'll fill it with diesel and then cycle the pump to circulate the fluid. I may even build a test stand since I have a variable voltage generator and spare IP wiring harness. It shouldn't be that hard.

While I have done a bunch of IP reseals on the car, I prefer to do them on the bench since you can see all aspects of the head seal. This was such a case, with the pick below. I hosed it off and even used my usual abrasive pipe cleaners, but this wasn't coming off without scraping.

The rest of the reseal went like they usually do, without a problem. I am down to my last reseal kit so I'll have to order more, and I'm out of the good head seals again. If anyone wants some of the Bosch green ones, I have a bunch.

So the IP was ready to go on the wagon. I ran some VCDS logs and did not find anything out of the ordinary like I should have seen, which had me perplexed. A week ago the car started making a noise commensurate with engine rotation, and it was coming from the IP area. At that time I looked over the usual suspects and found no problems. But, since I'm 'in-tune' with my cars and know every little noise and nuance, I perhaps looked at it too early. I am one for correcting issues before they escalate into a monstrosity. I used a mechanics stethoscope and found the IP to be noisy, like marbles or rocks in the pump, and doing research, that is the sound of an IP dying a slow death. Since it just started, I figured the symptoms hadn't manifested fully yet. The timing was good (albeit a little advanced), the IQ stable (3.9), and the injector balance stable as well.

So it didn't make sense that I could hear the problem but not see the problem. I decided to run it for a little while, making only trips to and from work (52 miles RT) and keep an eye on it, which was like listening to fingers on a chalkboard. I finally decided I'd had enough and decided to swap the IP.

I like to confirm things, and did the same as before when pulling things apart, only this time the noise went away when I pulled the serpentine belt off.



Well, the problem was very easy to find this time: the alternator. It didn't do that before so I don't think the bearings were bad enough yet. It still rotates fine though, smooth as silk, and the voltage on the Scangauge is rock solid.

I was a happy camper since I keep a spare on the shelf, ironically it was the one that came out of the wagon in the first place.

So all I had to do was swap pulleys and toss it back on. Easier said than done when you can find your alternator tools. I finally found them in one of the many boxes of B4 stuff I have in the garage, which is not sorted yet.

The rest went easy and I threw on the new harmonic balancer I bought from Bora some time ago, which was not make in China. I'm very happy about that. The old one was of the original design and had the startup chirp when cold.

I also received the K03/04 hybrid turbo from Bora that is going in the sedan this weekend, along with welding a new flex section on the downpipe. I may just make a new downpipe since I have the 2.25" stainless tubing and finally bought some stainless mig wire. It's flux core but negates having to get the Tri-mix gas stainless welding requires. I'd love to get a tig welder but the funds just aren't available and won't be for some time due to other needs.
.

 

[ToddA1]

But that's just it, they are not interchangeable. Just because a part fits in the location does not mean it is of the same quality of the original. The original timing belt tensioner was a Litens with NTN bearing (Japan), so a non-Litens would not be OE/OEM but would be OEM compatible. I'd have no problem using a SKF or NSK (and have many times) but they were all installed on Litens tensioners anyway.

I think anything purchased from a reputable dealership should be considered OE. I'd hope they wouldn't be peddling forgeries or gray market items.

If your statement means that the above tensioner can only be be produced with the NTN bearing to be considered such, I disagree, but hey we're all entitled to an opinion.

Supplier contracts change all the time, for an obvious reason.... money.

I've never heard the term "OEM compatible". I'd use the term "aftermarket". I'd think all aftermarket companies strive to make a part that meets or exceeds the original quality.

This is where we differ. Just because it fits, doesn't mean it's right (or OEM).

I don't believe it's right, but it's what I believe is true. If URO is truly an approved factory manufacturer for Jaguar, I believe they would earn the OEM designation. Again, I wouldn't agree with it, if it's not a quality part.

I have seen OEM without the brand

I agree.

and then I have seen CRAP with the VW/Audi logo stamped on it, so they're not really an indicator of what is OEM/real and what is a fauduct (faux product, or junk).

Unfortunately, we're seeing many manufacturers sending production to China. We'd all hope the quality control would be up to par, but perhaps it's not there yet.

If I walked out of a reputable dealership with a part made in China, I'd have to learn to deal with it and hope the quality control is there or scour sources for what would likely be old stock.

I remember when VW started sending production to Mexico and Brazil. People weren't happy, but people also didn't want to pay more for German labor, transport, import fees, etc.

If Febi actually makes the oil pumps, then awesome, I'll have no reservations using it, or even if they're of similar quality. But if they're Meyle, I don't care how many are installed across the US, I'll rebuild an original one before I'll toss it in anything I care about.

I took a look at my Febi pump. The body is actually cast with the "Febi" name. Even if it were aftermarket and made in Germany, I'd put faith into it.

If I'm not mistaken, Meyle never made anything; they're the Euro Beck Arnley. I think Altrom is the same. I still have NOS Meyle parts sitting on the shelves for old Rabbits. These parts were made in Germany.

The Kostal switch with the VW logo was ordered from the dealership... I technically should be considering it OE, but I called it OEM. I have no clue who originally made the switches, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was Hella.

What would you consider it to be?

-Todd

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

OE is what came on the car. Any car can only have one of each part that's OE. You can replace it with an OEM or aftermarket part, but not OE. That's only put on during initial assembly.

And just because it has a VW logo on it doesn't mean the quality hasn't changed. I'm told that current B4 shocks are Monroe from China. Not quite the same as Boge Germany which originally came on the car. Just one example.

 

[Col Sanders]

Let's see now, made in China, shipped to Mexico, box made in Brazil, packaged in Italy and has the VW logo on box. Shipped from VW factory in Germany. OE , OEM, compatible, fits like a OJ Simpson glove. That makes it all just as clear as mud. LOL, Col.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Let's see now, made in China, shipped to Mexico, box made in Brazil, packaged in Italy and has the VW logo on box. Shipped from VW factory in Germany. OE , OEM, compatible, fits like a OJ Simpson glove. That makes it all just as clear as mud. LOL, Col.

True, but I doubt you'd be willing to pay what it would cost to get OE parts like they were a generation ago. It's like people complaining about how air travel has deteriorated, but the same people would freak out if they had to pay $2,000 for a transcontinental round trip, which is what it cost 20 years ago. Long story short, you can't have it both ways.

 

[Steve Addy]

True, but I doubt you'd be willing to pay what it would cost to get OE parts like they were a generation ago. It's like people complaining about how air travel has deteriorated, but the same people would freak out if they had to pay $2,000 for a transcontinental round trip, which is what it cost 20 years ago. Long story short, you can't have it both ways.

It's not the price we should be concerned about, it's the value of the money we use to pay for those products that should be the concern.

Steve

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

I don't understand that comment. What I know is that when we drop a price on a product sales increase immediately. Although people want good quality, purchase decisions are overwhelmingly driven by pricing. And manufacturers have responded by creatively finding ways to drive costs down, which includes manufacturing outside the US and Western Europe.

 

[Yblocker]

Thought I would check timing since my overhaul 4,000 miles ago now. Car is running great. Wondering about the timing graph and fuel temp though. The temp seems high. Or at least indicating high. If the fuel temp really is that high, I would wonder what causes that. If it is just reading high, what is the downside there? I'll check it again after the car cools, but wanted to run this past you guys. And by the way- what are the x and y axes on the graph anyway?

 

[Digital Corpus]

X axis is fuel temp, Y axis is injection timing. Your fuel temp is a bit high.

 

[TonyJetta]

First thing in the morning, without starting the engine, check fuek temp against coolant temp and intake air temp. They should all be within a 5C window of wach other.

Tony
Sent from my e-diesel fleet

 

[Yblocker]

Fuel temp indicated in lower left box (156) does not match x axis value (193)?
If it were cooler on the graph would the timing be retarded? Car starts like a bomb and doesn't smoke (using HPR fuel). It does smoke a bit at WOT on D2.

 

[mrbrefast]

Having successfully rebuilt the Subaru enough this past week to carry me down to the Dayton ham radio convention (or "Hamvention"), where at I got my amateur radio license at the Technician level...

... I got home last night and decided I had cooled down enough over my anger and frustration as the Passat electrical system dying to try my hand at working it again:

(The Subaru might get the remainder of an automatic transmission cooler installed if I have the time today, so it is open and cooling after errands)

Currently I playing a rousing game of "where the hell did the battery - securing bolt fall to a week ago in the engine." One of my least favorite games.

Additional updates and/or pleas for help to follow....

 

[Digital Corpus]

It's a standard M8 flange bolt about 25 mm long. I'm blessed with a local shop selling M3-M24 bolts that's less than 10 min from my place. They know me over there

 

[mrbrefast]

It's a standard M8 flange bolt about 25 mm long. I'm blessed with a local shop selling M3-M24 bolts that's less than 10 min from my place. They know me over there

Ha, similarly the McMaster-Carr will call is a 2 minute walk from my desk, and we sell everything... so replacing the bolt isn't the worry. I am more concerned about the bolt hitting a moving part, or falling out and puncturing a tire.

When I turn the key to the accessory position, all lights on the cluster come on and the door open chime goes off. I turn the key to start the car and 1) there is a loud single click, possibly from the engine bay; and 2) the entire cluster goes out including the odometer. The cluster clicks a bunch and then pops the odometer back on after 40 seconds or so.

My trip to every auto parts store in town was fruitless, so no replacement relay 109 tonight. The 20 and terms fuse in front of the battery tests good. No burned, melted, or otherwise inoperable wiring I can see.

Any ideas or suggestions for what to test and how?

 

[tdidieselbobny]

Did you ever take the battery out and have it tested? Maybe something shorted inside the battery. I wouldn't try turning key anymore-I'd hate to see the cluster go kaput,which is common in these cars if you try to start with a low battery. Update to my exhaust fix from last week....I basically have it cobbled together from before the axle beam to the bumper. Two 2" 90 degree pieces attached to the straight pipe coming back from turbo in front of axle beam,a short piece w/ slight bend salvaged from the original pipe I cut off over winter attached to second 90 degree pipe(w/2" coupler) to get me over axle beam, the tailpipe attached to that salvaged piece w/ another 2" coupler,and then the finisher, another 2" 90 degree to get me past the bumper,angled about 45 degrees o the driver side,topped w/ a 2" raincap.After a week of driving around with it,I'm going to leave it on. I've gotten a few " that's pretty cool" ,from young kids to an older guy that was walking past me on the way into Walmart-said he used to have a TDI until some "thugs" that were running from cops totalled it (on East coast somewhere).I've also seen quite a few smiles from drivers behind me at red lights-hey,it's a conversation starter. I have a pic uploaded in my gallery,I'll try to post it. Go ahead and flame away....

 

[Campbellonh]

I have a spare 109 relay but I am too far away to get it to you in a hurry. I could drop it in the mail tomorrow if you want. (PM me) I kind of recall similar symptoms in my car several years, which was being caused by the little ground strap on the starter being broken. It's been a while so I may be misremembering symptoms and problems.

 

[Steve Addy]

I don't understand that comment. What I know is that when we drop a price on a product sales increase immediately. Although people want good quality, purchase decisions are overwhelmingly driven by pricing. And manufacturers have responded by creatively finding ways to drive costs down, which includes manufacturing outside the US and Western Europe.

When prices are reduced in order to sell product it's really doing nothing but pulling demand that would have naturally occurred in the future. Eventually there will be a significant weak period of sales (some call it the 'hangover') where those sales would have taken place if subsidy hadn't been employed. If the subsidy is big enough it can take a long time to work through the weak portion of the cycle. Typically the subsidy will have to be maintained in order to avoid the downturn, in perpetuity.

What I'm really referring to in my comment though is the value of the monetary unit...and what it will buy. And that is more important than the price.

You mentioned the cost of parts like those from a generation ago. The expense to purchase those being significantly higher isn't entirely due to the costs involved, it's in part due to the what the dollar today will buy compared to the dollar in 1980 or even 1990...and it's much less.

You have to recognize that what we use as a store of value isn't necessarily 1) good for that and 2) stable. And that's a big piece of why we can't afford the products from 1990 made in the places we would like them made in.

And yes, people are price sensitive, then again wages peaked in the US in 1998 in real terms, so there is a reason for that sensitivity.

Steve

 

[Digital Corpus]

I mean to cross post because I want to know what people want
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=440398

 

[goodmonkey]

I banged my head on why the car will not start after replacing the IP rotor head seal. Insured pump was primed, but no fuel flowing to the injectors. I'm suspecting the fuel cutoff solenoid, though I've not had any issues with it before. Running the output tests with VCDS I did not hear it click, but didn't read any voltage either. It is late for me, so I'll try jumpering it tomorrow to see what happens.

No faults found with VCDS either.

 

[Abacus]

Yesterday I planned on working on the sedan all day, but the wagon had other ideas.

I felt a grinding noise that was new to the car, so I pulled off the right front caliper to check. I knew the pads were in great shape from swapping to the summer tires a few weeks ago.

And they were in great shape, just too many pieces.

No problem I thought, I'll just go get a new set.

Yeah, not happening. I did some research inside to see what the pad number was, and even got [most of] the numbers off the back of the pads themselves, but no one I called could match them up. A few places told me to bring them in, which I did, and I even went armed with the year/make/model of the cars that use the G60 twin piston calipers.

People who work in auto parts stores around here are morons. They have been taught to read the computer and not think about what they're doing. Since my cars were down and the wife was at work, I enlisted the help of W386 to shuttle me around. He used to run a garage but back in the day, and even he was spouting obscenities when out of earshot. I use a NAPA local to my work and there are 4 people there who know what they're doing, but none were working that day and the rest working can be lumped with the other parts places.

At one parts place they looked up the cars by year and then told me they couldn't do anything until I came back with a VIN. Another told me there was one in the country (Cali) and it'd take a week to get there, AND I'd have to prepay the part and shipping, AND if it was the wrong part I couldn't return it. Yeah, thanks, but no thanks.

So we returned, I took the metal clip off one side, swapped pads, and put them back on. With so much meat left there is no danger of the pad coming out of the cradle and I knew I could have new pads on Tuesday at the latest. The brake honestly feels no different but I'm driving it gingerly.

So today I called the local NAPA back and talked to someone who knows something about how to look up a part and the new pads will be in this afternoon. I think the owner and I are going to sit down and have a chat about his people and their roles. They're only brake pads and not even that hard to find, I have a list comprised of about 94 different cross reference numbers from various manufacturers. I'll keep some spares on the shelf from now on, however.

 

[john.jackson9213]

mrbrefast, Check the battery voltage while someone else turns the key. Bet you have a bad cell in the battery and you will read less than 10 volts when the key is turned. Without turning the key, you may read 12.2 volts on the battery, but when you ask the battery to deliver a high load it will fail. That is my guess anyway.

Ha, similarly the McMaster-Carr will call is a 2 minute walk from my desk, and we sell everything... so replacing the bolt isn't the worry. I am more concerned about the bolt hitting a moving part, or falling out and puncturing a tire.

When I turn the key to the accessory position, all lights on the cluster come on and the door open chime goes off. I turn the key to start the car and 1) there is a loud single click, possibly from the engine bay; and 2) the entire cluster goes out including the odometer. The cluster clicks a bunch and then pops the odometer back on after 40 seconds or so.

My trip to every auto parts store in town was fruitless, so no replacement relay 109 tonight. The 20 and terms fuse in front of the battery tests good. No burned, melted, or otherwise inoperable wiring I can see.

Any ideas or suggestions for what to test and how?

 

[Windex]

Yesterday I planned on working on the sedan all day, but the wagon had other ideas...

...People who work in auto parts stores around here are morons.

Selectively quoting you down to the essence of the post.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...dual-piston-caliper-on-a-MK3-2.0-(93-early-99)

Has some part #'s, but I always called it as the car I pulled the calipers off of - a 1992 Audi 100 V6.

Sounds like you have a solution coming though... you could always put the smaller brakes back on...

 

[Abacus]

I thought about the smaller brakes, but between changing the caliper, rotor, and pads, I figured I'd just wait a day.

I hope the ones I'm picking up today fit, if not, at least I'll have what they came off. All the ones I have seen have the ABS sensor attached though, where did you find ones that didn't?