TDIFaq badly out of date for performance mods

[ibanix]

The performance section of the TDI FAQ seems to be way behind the times.

Things which need update:

1) Chipping - this section does not mention the two most popular chips on the forums: RocketChip and Aligator. Mention of the new Q-Loader for "least downtime" chipping would be good.

5) Air Intake Modifications - People have upgraded the airbox with R32 DSG parts and/or CAI systems sucessfully.

7) Intercooler Modifications - I would disagree with "Only worth doing on a highly tuned vehicle" as a few people have demonstrated improvements with a Eurojet or Tyrolsport with mostly stock machines. Also, "need to have the vehicle out of service for some time during the installation" doesn't seem right - should be hours, not days. Maybe the FMIC install is longer.

9) Turbo Upgrades - This whole section seems to be biased against upgrading the turbo. First of all, I haven't read of anyone here reducing compression in their engine with a larger turbo. Second, no mention of any of the turbo upgrades (VNT-17, -20, the hybrids). The turbo upgrades seem to be the gateway to the really large power gains and I think the TDI FAQ needs to reflect this.

Others:

* No mention of removing the EGR for a few more HP?


Comments?

 

[johnnloki]

Fully agreed that the TDI Faq needs to be updated to reflect current technology- most websites when someone asks a relatively rudimentary question you can point them in the direction of the Faq- here you can't with a clear conscience.

EGR removal is typically for maintaining performance, not increasing it, and stopping the neccessity of intake cleaning- I'd guess that info ought to be included as well, eh?

So, how about it to the experienced clubbers? (and for that matter, even the vendors) Any interest in a larger scale update of the Faqs? It'd be awesome to have current info based on current technology. It might seem daunting right now, but an update to the suspension, a timing belt change, oil change, clean out the intake, and maybe update the injectors and that TDI FAQ could be good as new...

Any takers with a wealth of info and a few spare hours?

 

[Gothmolly]

Is the intake clogging part relevant with ULSD ?

I think that the "chipping" section should be vendor agnostic.

 

[40X40]

Congratulations!
You've been elected to write the new version. Have fun, and be prepared for everyone to disagree with anything you write.
Don't forget to divide the sticky into different sections for the different chassis and engine combos.
For instance, the A5 type can get by nicely with just a chip. A clutch is not always needed nor is anything else. This may change.... a bigger turbo is in the wings, I think.

Good luck, this should keep you out of the bar(s) for quite a while!

Bill

 

[LurkerMike]

In a few more weeks there will be more exhaust options and charge air plumbing options to add...

 

[johnnloki]

If you are starting with an A4 5-speed manual with Upsolute or Wetterauer chip, don't even think about 0.216 injectors unless you're prepared for internal engine work to lower compression, a slightly larger turbo (but not too much!) such as a VNT17, custom intercooler, upgraded clutch, upgraded final drive, better oil cooling, custom ECU programming to deal with all the issues that will occur. This will cost thousands of dollars to get right. Long term durability under high load conditions is not likely to be very good.

Ugh... just lost a few hundred words to what I guess was a wrong keystroke....

Upsolute and Wetterauer are the chips mentioned in the faq. The VNT17 aparently pushes your car to the limits that it can handle before it's a rolling timebomb.... The TDI Faq no longer serves the purpose that it was likely to have envisioned to serve. "How do I firm up my suspension without a drop??" "Where can I actually buy a downpipe for my PD online?" "What are the weights of OEM _____________ rims, and what aftermarket options are lighter?" There are plenty of questions asked all the time that ought to be able to be answered with "Check the FAQ"...

It's gotten to the point that even "How can I get more power for my stock TDI?" is only partially answered the FAQ... that's no good.

 

[ibanix]

Actually, I think it just needs some face-lifting. I'd be happy to do those changes tho.

Congratulations!
You've been elected to write the new version. Have fun, and be prepared for everyone to disagree with anything you write.
Don't forget to divide the sticky into different sections for the different chassis and engine combos.
For instance, the A5 type can get by nicely with just a chip. A clutch is not always needed nor is anything else. This may change.... a bigger turbo is in the wings, I think.

Good luck, this should keep you out of the bar(s) for quite a while!

Bill

 

[vwmikel]

There are so many things wrong with that FAQ I'm not even sure where to start. We obviously can't blame the authors though as it was all true to the best of their knowledge at the time. Times have changed and so has our collective knowledge base.

 

[GoFaster]

Congratulations!
You've been elected to write the new version. Have fun, and be prepared for everyone to disagree with anything you write.

Therein lies the problem.

I wrote most of what's in the FAQ in conjunction with input from several other long-time (at that time) forum members ... about 5 or 6 years ago. I am NOT doing it again. Quite a few times it has been suggested to update it. My response has been "get in touch with Fred, and go right ahead". When writing a document like this, it has to be a consensus, technically as accurate as possible, NOT commercially biased, and particularly with regards to performance modifications, it has to be a "conservative" approach with warnings where relevant about legal matters. (It's better to tell someone not to do something even if it can be "gotten away with", than it is to tell someone they can do it, they F up the job, blow something up, and blame you.)

Good luck!

 

[LurkerMike]

Just like science, nothing is permanent in human understanding.

It was scientists that insisted the world was flat and it is "scientists" that give us theories like the very unscientific "Theory of Evolution" that fails the scientific method of observation every time anyone tries to reproduce it...

TDI FAQ's are no different. They begin as an idea that is developed into a hypothesis and later into theory. Just as in science, few of these theories will ever become "laws" as the rate of theories being discredited or accepted is over a 99.9% failure rate.

But without a base of theories to work from, we could never hope to define the true "laws" that define the subject.

One theory that I believe has passed muster and all of the reproducible observed testing needed to confirm its status as a "law" is this:

TDI Law number 1, "The Gas Law"
Refueling your TDI with gasoline can be harmful to your car.

 

[MCR]

There are so many things wrong with that FAQ I'm not even sure where to start. We obviously can't blame the authors though as it was all true to the best of their knowledge at the time. Times have changed and so has our collective knowledge base.

Has anyone proposed transitioning the FAQ into a wiki? For those who don't know, a wiki allows anyone to edit (subject to various amounts of moderation).

 

[LNXGUY]

New members on this site don't read, they just post up their questions.. Am I the only one that has noticed this phenomena as of late? I doubt half the newbs on this site have even read the FAQ.

A 5 min lesson on the 'search' function should be a prerequisite.

 

[T-Y]

New members on this site don't read, they just post up their questions.. Am I the only one that has noticed this phenomena as of late? I doubt half the newbs on this site have even read the FAQ.

A 5 min lesson on the 'search' function should be a prerequisite.

As a fairly new member, I take exception to this. I'll grant you that I should have used the 'search' function more when I got started, but I did try to use the FAQ. It didn't have the information for which I was looking so I posted the question. If the FAQ was more up-to-date, I may not have had to have posted all of the questions I did. Just my $0.02. Thanks!

 

[LNXGUY]

Tyler, this wasn't directed at anyone inparticular. I am sure you have noticed the same questions asked over and over and over again.

 

[Frankencar]

FAQ = Good place to start

i am quite new to TDIclub myself & have found the FAQ to be the singe most helpful tool here to begin the TDI adventure. it is a bit outdated, but i agree that it is also an huge pain in the ... yeah to fix it. I also find the search function quite helpful. i have yet to post a question on the site. & have had no trouble at all building my 1986 Golf Diesel with a 1998 AHU TDI, k03k04 hybrid, pp764's, Upsolute chip (to be replaced by alligetor later), FMIC, 2.75" turbo back pipe - no cat - no muffler, power steering delete, A/C delete.... 2" lift, doubled spring rate, 3.76" oversize offroad tires, EGT Gauge......... & i would like to thank all of the members of this site for making this information available to a first time TDI owner like myself.... in fact the first time i ever drove a TDI was 4 months ago when i drove the donor car (perfectly good 1998 Jetta TDI) home to gut it fo it's better parts (engine, transmission) - sorry mk3 owners... couldn't justify the 700lbs to keep the mk3. & through this great site & R-E-A-D-I-N-G i have found great peace maybe we should put the reading part in caps like that so we don't get 10,000 repeats of the same questions. if i can build what i have woth no TDI know-how upon starting & simply come here, read, order & build... without posting 10,000 questions - i believe anyone can, but laziness may prevent some from doing so. & in turn ruin everyone elses day by making them sift through 50 tons of junk - like using google or yahoo. well - enough of that. i suppose someone with alot of TIME could update the FAQ but who in the world has that? especially when they are working 50 hours a week so they can make enough $$$ to spend on the 50 hour a week TDI build?

 

[T-Y]

LNXGUY, no offense taken. Just trying to make the point that an updated FAQ could be useful. However, I suspect that even it were updated you'd see questions posted regarding topics discussed in the FAQ (Not by everyone, but some. Those who struggle with the 'search' function now...). The only change would be that the questions would be answered with "Check the FAQ" rather than "Do a search". You don't know if you don't try though, right? It's worth a shot.

 

[GoFaster]

Another thing - memories from the last go-round.

Half the people will complain because the TDIFAQ is "too complex", "too much information", "can't find what I want (because it's buried in a ton of other stuff)". The other half will complain that it "isn't detailed enough", and still "can't find what I want (because it isn't there)". Guess what, you can't have it both ways.

The Wiki idea has been discussed before. I think there might even be the beginnings of one somewhere out there. I've not bothered to look for it myself...

 

[Honeydew]

The Wiki idea has been discussed before. I think there might even be the beginnings of one somewhere out there. I've not bothered to look for it myself...

It is here. Seems like whoever is working this is on the right track.

 

[johnnloki]

It is here. Seems like whoever is working this is on the right track.

Good find- that's exactly what we need. Broken down by model and engine means well organized- cures the "too much info" problem of the faq, and it can be editted by a few people with information specific to your model/year, curing the "too little info" problem of the faq. A link to this "Live wiki style TDIFaq" ought to be stickied here at the top and we ought to infuse it with all the conventional wisdom that we can. Very cool.

 

[ibanix]

It is here. Seems like whoever is working this is on the right track.

It is being over-run with spammers, however. It needs to require registration.

 

[chittychittybangbang]

I realize that this is coming off as spam-like, but whatever. Organization of everything that I've come across is what I have been doing. I made a diesel FAQ organized by general info, then model info and how tos. I even organize each "how to" into: introduction, parts/tools, and procedure so that each "how to" is consistent. I also require pics to be clear and show context instead of a close up of a bolt that you won't recognize until you are in there anyways. I don't turn them into PDFs because once the file is out there, you can't add edits and tips.

Unlike a forum where you have to search through 10 pages to read the 5 posts that answer your question, and unlike a wiki, where people get into edit wars or spam, anyone who wants to suggest additions can just tell me because I don't know 1/8 of what's out there and I only have so much spare time to work on this. And I credit write ups and photos credit to whoever adds worthwhile contributions.

Link in my sig.

 

[ibanix]

I like your pages a lot, they have great info; it could use some layout improvement. Any interest in letting me redesign it for you?

I realize that this is coming off as spam-like, but whatever. Organization of everything that I've come across is what I have been doing. I made a diesel FAQ organized by general info, then model info and how tos. I even organize each "how to" into: introduction, parts/tools, and procedure so that each "how to" is consistent. I also require pics to be clear and show context instead of a close up of a bolt that you won't recognize until you are in there anyways. I don't turn them into PDFs because once the file is out there, you can't add edits and tips.

Unlike a forum where you have to search through 10 pages to read the 5 posts that answer your question, and unlike a wiki, where people get into edit wars or spam, anyone who wants to suggest additions can just tell me because I don't know 1/8 of what's out there and I only have so much spare time to work on this. And I credit write ups and photos credit to whoever adds worthwhile contributions.

Link in my sig.

 

[Matthew_S]

Why not have a contest to rewrite the FAQ? Members could send donations to Fred to be used for prize money that the winner would get. Anyone who wants to could write a new FAQ (or edit the existing one) and submit it to Fred for review. People might complain about the new one but so what, they complain about the current one.

 

[WW_VRS]

If you use the search, you get sooooooo many results it's frankly not much use either - if I only check out the new posts every few days it takes ages to go through them as it is - it's because the site is so big, just the way it is

It often makes sense to ask the same question again as things do move on, opinions change, and results always get pushed further

 

[vwmikel]

If you use the search, you get sooooooo many results it's frankly not much use either - if I only check out the new posts every few days it takes ages to go through them as it is - it's because the site is so big, just the way it is

It often makes sense to ask the same question again as things do move on, opinions change, and results always get pushed further

Not to mention your new post likely catches a new set of eyes and a different answer might be the outcome. However, this usually only happens with more complex questions....the simple questions usually fetch the same answers each time.

 

[deezay]

why not break up sections of the faq to people who know more or would like to know more. it'd be alot easier if alot of people worked on the project all together instead of throwing it all onto one person.

thats my suggestion. i'd be willing to work on a chunk if this idea sounds like a winner. late!

 

[mrchill]

Why not simplify the faq's. UUse only info which is linear and basic. the complicated and ever changing stuff should be a search or an open question. I have never read the faq, so I'll check it out, but most folks who are just starting will find thier most basic needs there when properly laid out. Chips? new car problems...a forum issue. No need for faq's there.

If someone writs a new faq, no matter if its seems "perfect" or not, it will be an improvement over outdated info.

 

[madman91]

I didn't read ^^^ .. well the first post but nothing else... Anyways, I think we should make it into a wiki... This way it can only grow.

 

[doonboggle]

'Newbie' sez

Well, as a newbie myself, I know I'll probably get flamed; but here goes.

I agree 100% with the thread content. In fact, several more areas at the top of the forum can afford to be updated; articles, links, etc.. As a newbie, I HAVE checked the sections prior to asking; and have been unsuccessfull in the vast majority of times. One of my biggest personal gripes, and have posted soliciting help, is the abbreviations that are used heavily.

A major 'article' or 'FAQ' addressing this is solely needed. Many of us 'newbies' are not in tune with the slang abbreviations being used; thus needing some assistance so that we don't in fact post what often comes across as a dumb post. Case in point was a posting I made just today in which the responder advised, in a somewhat insulting manner, to search for 'Smoke Map'. Had never before come across the phrase, so had asked for clarification. I realize that this will happen, but the updated stuff would prevent much of this type of flippant responses; I feel.

Next is that there are excellent postings I have come across wherein others have also enjoyed it, and then posted a suggestion that it be made into a 'sticky' ... which in themselves ... certain ones that is ... need updating. But here again, many of these much needed postings, that should be stickys and requested to be so, have not been responded to, and the material lies buried in an outdated session.

Rules and regulations are apparently not being monitored in a sound manner. Here again have personally requested how to address this and have been advised that moderators police this; and to post it to their attention using the supplied link. Done. Result ... nada; indicating that the moderators are not fulfilling their pledge, or whatever it is they take to become a moderator.

All in all though, I feel this forum is irreplaceable; and highly support it. But as a newbie who is not versed in the subject material, while I would like to assist, common sense dictates that I cannot.

I enjoy the layout and would like to see the models breakdown be utilized more than the general breakdowns. In other words, if a post is about a 2001 Jetta, then instead of TDI 101, put it into the 2001 catagory. 95% of this newbie's reading has been in non specific sections ... and most of that has been wasted due to the post not being applicable to my car. So they, IMO, should be monitored more and/or rephrased to signify applicable content within the section.

This represents a huge task, and honestly, I doubt that any of this will get addressed. I was advised in a response post that the originator of these forums is not that involved anymore, or only occassionally, which appears to be much of the problem. There needs to be, IMO, some secondary folks that can fill in for him who have the authority to change or address things as needed.

This includes the reputation that this wonderful group of folks have. When I first started looking for information, I signed into the VWVortex site ... and one of the first postings I read was a criticism discussion about the rudeness and insolence of this forum. That should not be the case because we are all adults, at least I hope so. However, at the same time, I also read many postings of other forums in which they recommend our group as the best to check out.

So I for one, would like to see that capitalized on more.

I'll get off my soapbox now.

 

[PapaBare]

It is here. Seems like whoever is working this, is on the right track.

I have updated the OIL section to remove the spam info.

Enjoy and add relevant information that you know of.