TDI in SCCA autox, etc.?

gearheadgrrrl

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2002
Location
Buffalo Ridge (southwest Minnesota)
TDI
'15 Golf DSG, '13 JSW DSG surrendered to VW, '03 Golf 2 door manual
Planning a restoration of a 60s Mini Cooper S and was consulting the SCCA rules to see what mods would be OK, that's a long term project that will take years to complete. Then I noticed that SCCA has put the 4 cylinder VW TDIs in the bottom class! Now that might make sense for the 90 HP A3s and A4s, but the 140 HP A6s and 150 HP A7s look to be competitive, especially given the efficient VW drivetrain that puts about 90% of that power to the wheels!

Anybody tried running a TDI in SCCA events?
 

Powder Hound

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 25, 1999
Location
Under a Bridge, New Hampshiyuh, USA
TDI
'00 Golf 4dr White 5sp, '02 Jettachero 5sp, Wife's '03 NB Platinum Gray auto(!)
Bottom class of what? They have a lot of different classes. Production class? H? They probably need a J or K for the ALH TDI to be competitive.What with the relatively low horsepower and a redline under 5k rpms, I'd wonder if they're going to be competitive even there. In a recent post, Oilhammer noted that he did his very best to set up a golf and yet a bone stock clapped out Miata on the cheapest crummiest tires available from K-Mart ran away laughing in the curves after he could barely keep up on the straight.

So race it if you will - hope you enjoy watching everyone else's taillights.

As far as the higher powered common rail engines - maybe there's a calculation that puts them in a higher class. Or maybe they're allowing them to have a chance so as to encourage diesel drivers. Or maybe nobody noticed that rule yet...

Cheers,

PH
 

gearheadgrrrl

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2002
Location
Buffalo Ridge (southwest Minnesota)
TDI
'15 Golf DSG, '13 JSW DSG surrendered to VW, '03 Golf 2 door manual
H is the slowest street class...

And SCCA has plopped all the 4 cylinder TDIs in it. Seems like the fast car is the Fiesta ST, otherwise I suspect a 2 liter TDI would be competitiive. Here's the list of cars in the class:

Street (HS) - Appendix A
Acura
CL (all)
ILX
Integra (all except Type R) (1986-
2001)
Legend
RSX
RSX Type S
TL
TSX
Vigor
Alfa Romeo
164 (non-S) (1991-93)
1300
1600
1750 & 1750 GTV
2000 (4-door sedan)
GTV V6
Milano
Sedan (NOC)
AMC
Gremlin (4-cyl & 6-cyl)
Spirit (4-cyl & 6-cyl)
Audi
80
90
100 (non-S4)
200 Turbo quattro
4000
5000 (non-turbo)
5000 Turbo
A3 (FWD) (2006-13)
Coupe quattro (non-turbo)
S4 (100 CS chassis) (1992-94)
Austin
Mini
Austin-Healey
(all)
BMW
1600
1800
2000 CS coupe
2002
318 (all)
320
7 Series (6-cyl)
i3 (2014-16)
Buick
Reatta
Verano (non-turbo) (2013-17)
Cadillac
Catera
Chevrolet
Aveo
Beretta (NOC)
Camaro (4-cyl & 6-cyl) (1967-
2002)
Chevette
Cobalt (2.2L, all) (2005-10)
Corvair (all)
Cruze
Nova (FWD) (1986-88)
Nova (RWD, 4-cyl & 6-cyl) (1962-
79)
Sonic (all) (2012-17)
Spectrum
Sprint
Vega & Cosworth Vega
Volt (2011-17)
Chrysler
200 (4-cyl) (2010-17)
300M (1999-2004)
Cirrus (V6)
Laser (all)
PT Cruiser (non-turbo) (2001-
2010)
Sebring (all)
Daewoo
(all)
Datsun
1200
1500 & 1600 Roadster
210 & B-210
310
510
610
710
810
F10
Dodge
024
Avenger (all)
Challenger (1978-83)
Charger (non-turbo, FWD)
(1981-87)
Colt (all)
Dart (FWD) (2013-17)
Daytona (all)
GLH (non-turbo)
Intrepid
Lancer Turbo
H Street class (HS)
2017 SCCA® National Solo® Rules — 153
Appendix A - (HS) Street
Neon (2000-05)
Omni
Rampage
Shadow (all)
Spirit (all)
Stealth (non-turbo)
Stratus (all)
Eagle
Summit (all)
Talon (all, FWD)
Fiat
500 Abarth (2012-17)
NOC
Ford
Aspire
Contour (all)
Cortina
Escort (non-ZX2 S/R)
EXP
Festiva
Fiesta (1976-80)
Fiesta ST (2014-17)
Five Hundred
Focus (except
ST 2013-17
and
RS
)
Fusion (4-cyl)
Mustang (4-cyl, 6-cyl, & 4-cyl
Turbo except SVO) (1964½-
93)
Pinto
Probe (all)
Taurus (non-SHO)
Tempo (all)
Thunderbird (V6, non-S/C)
(1989-97)
Thunderbird Turbo Coupe
ZX2 (non-S/R)
General Motors
FWD models (NOC)
RWD V6 models (NOC)
Geo
Metro
Prizm
Spectrum
Storm
Honda
600
800
Accord (all)
Civic (all, excluding Mugen 2008)
(1975-2015)
Civic (EX, LX, Sport, Touring)
(2016-17)
CRX (all)
CR-Z
del Sol & Civic del Sol (all)
Fit
Insight
Prelude (all)
Hyundai
Accent (1995-2017)
Elantra (1990-2017)
Scoupe
Tiburon
Veloster (non-turbo) (2012-17)
Veloster Turbo (non-Rally Edition)
(2012-17)
NOC
Infiniti
G20
M30
Isuzu
I-Mark
Impulse (non-turbo)
Stylus
Jaguar
120
140
150
X-Type (2.5L) (2002-05)
Kia
Forte & Forte Koup (2.0L)
Forte5 (2014-17)
Optima
Rio (2012-17)
Sephia
Spectra5
Lancia
Beta
Scorpion
Lexus
CT 200h (2011-17)
ES 250
ES 300
GS 300
Lincoln
LS (V6)
Lotus
Cortina
Mazda
323 (non-turbo)
626
HS (continued)
154 — 2017 SCCA® National Solo® Rules
Street (HS) - Appendix A
808
929
Cosmo
GLC
Mazda2 (2011-14)
Mazda3 (2004-17)
Mazda6 (all)
Millenia (all)
MX-3
MX-6 (all)
Protégé (non-Mazdaspeed)
R100
RX-2
RX-3
RX-4
Mercedes
280 (1995-2000)
NOC
Mercury
Bobcat
Capri (all except V8)
Cougar (4-cyl & V6 non-S/C)
LN-7
Lynx
Milan (all)
Montego
Mystique (all)
Sable
Scorpio
Topaz (all)
Tracer
MG
all
MINI
Clubman (non-S, non-JCW)
(2008-14)
Cooper Coupe (non-S, non-JCW)
(2012-15)
Cooper Hardtop (non-S, non-
JCW) (2002-13)
Cooper Roadster (non-S, non-
JCW) (2012-15)
Mitsubishi
3000 GT (non-turbo)
Cordia
Eclipse (all, FWD) (1989-2012)
Galant (4-cyl non-turbo)
Lancer (non-turbo)
Mirage
Precis
Premier
Starion (non-turbo)
Tredia
Nissan/Datsun
200SX (all)
240SX
300ZX (non-turbo) (1984-89)
Altima (all)
Leaf (2011-17)
Maxima (all)
NX1600
NX2000 (1991-93)
Pulsar
Sentra (all)
Stanza
Versa (2007-17)
Oldsmobile
Calais W41
Opel
1100
1900
GT
Isuzu
Manta
Peugeot
405 (all)
505 (1979-91)
Pininfarina
2000
Plymouth
Acclaim (all)
Arrow
Champ
Colt
Horizon
Laser (non-turbo)
Neon (2000-01)
Sapporo
Scamp
Sundance (all)
TC3
Turismo
Pontiac
Fiero (4-cyl)
Firebird (4-cyl & 6-cyl)
G5 (all)
G8 (V6) (2008-09)
LeMans (FWD) (1988-93)
Sunfire
T-1000
Vibe
HS (continued)
2017 SCCA® National Solo® Rules — 155
Appendix A - (HS) Street
Porsche
356 (non-Carrera)
912
924 (Audi engine, non-turbo)
Renault
NOC
Saab
900 (V6) (1994-97)
NOC
Saturn
8v
Astra (2008-09)
DOHC model (NOC)
Ion (non-turbo)
L series (all)
Scion
iA (2016)
iM (2016)
tC (incl. Release Series 5.0 2009)
(2005-16)
xA (2004-06)
xB (2008-12)
Shelby
Charger (non-turbo)
Subaru
Impreza 2.0i
Impreza (NOC)
Legacy (NOC)
SVX
Sedan Turbo (NOC)
NOC
Sunbeam
Alpine
Suzuki
Esteem GL
Forenza
Kizashi (2010-13)
Swift
SX4 sedan (2007-13)
Toyota
Camry (all)
Celica (FWD; NOC)
Celica (all, non-AWD) (1971-99)
Corolla
Cressida
Echo
Matrix
Paseo
Prius (all)
Starlet
Supra (non-turbo) (1979-92)
Tercel
Yaris
Triumph
all except Stag & TR-8
Volkswagen
air-cooled engine (all)
diesel engine (non-turbo) (all)
Beetle (2.0L)
Dasher
Eos (2.0T) (2007-16)
Fox
Golf, GTI & Jetta (16v
non-turbo
)
Golf, GTI & Jetta (8v, all)
Golf TDI
Jetta (2.5L) (2005-14)
Jetta TDI (2005-06, 2009-16)
New Beetle (NOC)
Passat (4-cyl non-turbo & V6)
Quantum
Rabbit & Rabbit GTI (all, NOC)
Rabbit (2007-09)
Scirocco (all)
VR6 (FWD, NOC)
Volvo
C30
NOC
Yugo
all
“Catch-all”:
RWD pickup trucks (NOC)
 

shepner

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2006
Location
Milwaukee, WI
TDI
2015 Golf TDI
Ive been racing my 2015 Golf TDI in SCCA Solo for the last couple years. The car is in HS. The Fiesta STs are (unfortunately) slightly faster so Im always chasing their times but my (lack of) skill is also a factor there. Most of them are simply better drivers. Regardless, Im running in the upper end of the class. For reference, the guy in Pro running a 2015 GTI in GS with much the same setup is generally around 6-10s faster then me.

Note that in HSAX, the Fiesta ST and the mk7 TDI are completely different classes. Tho I noticed that their times on the track still werent much better then mine :)
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
, Oilhammer noted that he did his very best to set up a golf and yet a bone stock clapped out Miata on the cheapest crummiest tires available from K-Mart ran away laughing in the curves after he could barely keep up on the straight.
Actually that was with my '95 ABA powered Golf Sport (what the GTIs were called here that year, for some reason). And I would have eventually passed the Miata on the straight... if they were long enough, LOL.

A mildly modded ALH Golf would handily spank the dickens out of any ABA Golf, especially if you graced it with LSD so you could get its torque to the ground. The ABA Golf has no issue with wheelspin... the 2.slo just doesn't have it in it. :eek:

I think this type of thing is just for fun, and not really something to be taken too seriously. I never did.

I ran my Upsoluted '98 Jetta TDI a few times.... it wasn't very fast, but between the diesel smoke and tire smoke, it was at least entertaining for the rest of the crowd. :D
 

gearheadgrrrl

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2002
Location
Buffalo Ridge (southwest Minnesota)
TDI
'15 Golf DSG, '13 JSW DSG surrendered to VW, '03 Golf 2 door manual
I'm in it for the fun...

The Cooper S with maybe 60 net HP and 1500 pounds would be competitive only on a very tight narrow course, I want to autox and rallyx it because that's what Cooper Ss were built for. As for TDIs, the Focus ST with nearly 200 HP and a bit less weight than a TDI really should be in a higher class, but SCCA's tendency to misclassify cars is legendary. None the less, would be fun to run either my A4 or A7 Golf TDIs, especially with the fuel cranked up to "smoke" levels!
 

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
Stock or nearly stock TDIs aren't very fast and don't handle very well. They understeer a ton, spin inside wheels exiting turns, and don't get a lot of speed on the straights. Suspension mods make a big difference in driving fun, but without fueling and turbo upgrades they still aren't fast.
 

CNGVW

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Location
Bob Mann Auto, 111 High St, Pembroke MA 02359
TDI
Many TDI Jettas and a Beetle Race car fitted with CNG dual fuel conversion.
As a true roadrace TDI yes the fastest Beetle TDI in the USA 2 years running !! They can kill most cars off the turn.

If you follow some of my posts you can find some of my setups that work.
A good tune is a must big tires and rims
 

vwztips

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Location
Greenville, SC
TDI
2005 Passat GLS Wagon TDI 5 spd manual w/BSM delete 2012 Tiguan TDI/DSG 2004 Audi TT R-line Conv 2011 BMW X5 35d
Many years ago I used to autocross my 1973 914 2.0.

Reading this post has rekindled that desire and thinking about running my 2012 Tiguan with a CJAA and 6 speed manual, tuned and lowered. It is very quick. Handling isn't bad either.
 

vwztips

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Location
Greenville, SC
TDI
2005 Passat GLS Wagon TDI 5 spd manual w/BSM delete 2012 Tiguan TDI/DSG 2004 Audi TT R-line Conv 2011 BMW X5 35d
Yeah, I know. Hopefully they will allow a few fun runs at the end
 

gearheadgrrrl

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2002
Location
Buffalo Ridge (southwest Minnesota)
TDI
'15 Golf DSG, '13 JSW DSG surrendered to VW, '03 Golf 2 door manual
I suspect it's an insurance mandated requirement. IIRC the classic Mini runs afoul of their formula, but it looks like they allow participation if the CG can be proven to be low enough. Wonder how hard it is to find the vertical CG of a Tiguan?
 
Joined
Mar 30, 2018
Location
Texas
TDI
None yet
What modifications are allowed in your class? Secondly, are the modifications a blanket rule book for the whole class, or are they specific to each vehicle?

Not knowing what the modifications allowed are, it would be logical to me to have an AWD 6 speed transmission PD or CR TDI vehicle that is model and year allowed. LSD the front and rear, upgraded nozzles, EGR shut off in the ECU, a class organ 3 inch straight pipe turbo back exhaust, class legal after cooling upgrades (FMIC or side mount), extrude honed the head, fire ring the block and head, head studs and main studs, class legal intake manifold that’s been extrude honed, upgraded VNT turbo with extrude honed manifold and the manifold being thermal wrapped and a turbo blanket, thermal barrier on the intake manifold and some sort of cold air intake tube that has a thermal barrier, class legal suspension modifications and brake modifications, legal “light weight” modifications, and a custom tune would make the car competitive in the class. But the tipping point is would the expense of these modifications be worth it/worth the reward? That last question is one that only you can answer. I’ve seen and learned from the tractor/truck pulling arena that once you filling under stand the guidelines and rules of the class your running in, you then can figure out how to operate at the very edge of the rules.
 

bobbiemartin

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2012
Location
Jacksonville, FL
TDI
2013 Touareg TDI, 2012 Tiguan TDI
Are you considering building a dedicated autocross car? If so, I would just build what you want and have fun in whatever class they put you in. You are building a 60's Cooper S? Sliding window shells are not cheap and finding the proper S components are not cheap either. For autocross, I would source a later shell and build up a nice 1275 (or bigger) A+. But even that will not be cheap. A MKIV TDI would not be terribly expensive and with a few reasonably cheap mods could be a fun car. But for the cost, a Miata is hard to beat. Building a car to a class winner is expensive and more complex than just going out and having fun. If you find later you want to try to and have a class winner, you will have a better idea what it may take. A stripped down well running TDI would be a lot of fun and would probably beat some gas powered cars, but a well sorted Mini would run rings around it!:D
 

dieselherb1

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Location
Va.
TDI
06 MK5,09 Mk5 CR,03 Mk4,96,2-97 B4s,98 A3,2000 A4,4 Caddies( 2-1.6TD,1.6,TDI) Chevys 6.2,6.5,6.5TD
I hope to have a competitive MK5 TDI. Lowered, 250HP, Wavetrac etc.
 

travis45

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2009
Location
Wisconsin
TDI
14 Sportwagen, 96 Passat TDI Sedan
Herb, me too! Have a Wavetrac on the bench ready for install and some KW V3'S on the way!
 

dieselherb1

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Location
Va.
TDI
06 MK5,09 Mk5 CR,03 Mk4,96,2-97 B4s,98 A3,2000 A4,4 Caddies( 2-1.6TD,1.6,TDI) Chevys 6.2,6.5,6.5TD
Do you think the Fluidamper is worth the money?
 

GTiTDi

TDIClub Enthusiast, Macht Schnell! Vendor , w/Busi
Joined
Oct 18, 2010
Location
3 Spruce st Wareham, gateway to Cape Cod Massachus
TDI
91 GTDI,'02 Jetta wagon ALH swap, '99 Eurovan, '79 Audi Fox 1.6TD, '03 GTI 1.8T rally car
Power to weight ratio is everything. That includes the driver. ABA powered VWs are nothing to sneeze at these days. Very common to see mk3 Golfs competing in Rally/Rally cross. Also ABA swapped mk1 and mk2 chassis cars. There is an ABA powered mk2 Jetta that is making around 654hp.
 
Last edited:

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
Do you think the Fluidamper is worth the money?
I bought one for both of my TDIs, so I think they're worth it. I haven't installed one of them yet, so I'll be able to say 100% in the coming weeks when I get it installed.

Just throwing this out there for anyone that might be interested in driving my built RTDI at either some high speed Auto X(sometimes known as Time Attack/Time Trials) or a HPDE is to shoot me a pm to work out the details.
The one catch is that I get to sit shotgun, since I'm unable to drive due to a diving accident. This is my way of fulfilling my need for speed and that adrenaline rush that I used to get when I was behind the wheel.

I'm located near Green Bay, WI, so some of the tracks in the area are Road America, Blackhawk Farms, Autobahn Country Club, and Gingerman.
 

SuzukiDan7

New member
Joined
Apr 22, 2017
Location
Buffalo
TDI
2015 Jetta TDi S and 2015 Jetta TDi SE
I'm joining the discussion late, but I'm interested in the possiblity of autocrossing my 2015 Jetta TDI SE. It's certainly not very fast , as im coming from a 2013 wrx.

I was curious if the Jetta would be competitive, with the right rims and tires? It's bone stock and must stay that way.

What rims and tires have folks found to be optimal, and is it even worth my time? I don't expect to win but it would be nice to at least be somewhat competitive without having to spend a lot or make the car not suitable for DD.
 
Last edited:

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
You'd probably have fun but I wouldn't expect the car will be competitive. Suspension is pretty primitive, and even with good tires you can't get any camber adjusted into the front with stock components. And the gearing is a big disadvantage: most courses will require a 1-2 shift which costs time.
 

vwztips

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Location
Greenville, SC
TDI
2005 Passat GLS Wagon TDI 5 spd manual w/BSM delete 2012 Tiguan TDI/DSG 2004 Audi TT R-line Conv 2011 BMW X5 35d
I agree with Indigo, first thing to address is suspension. In stock form these cars are designed to understeer.

Maybe stick with fun runs after the autocross is over
 

SuzukiDan7

New member
Joined
Apr 22, 2017
Location
Buffalo
TDI
2015 Jetta TDi S and 2015 Jetta TDi SE
I can handle understeer if the car is still able to be quick with a good driver. I just get too frustrated when I bang out what I think was an amazing lap only to find out I barely beat the newbie in his rotted out Taurus with factory tires.
 

USMCFieldMP

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Location
Fort Worth, TX
TDI
2014 Jetta TDI
I can handle understeer if the car is still able to be quick with a good driver. I just get too frustrated when I bang out what I think was an amazing lap only to find out I barely beat the newbie in his rotted out Taurus with factory tires.
You can do well and beat plenty of other "quick" cars, but you won't be truly competitive in HS class (and certainly not in anything higher like STH) with the Fiesta ST's you'll be going against.

I ran my 2014 Jetta TDI today with Koni coilovers (corner balanced), Tyrolsport Caliper Stiffening Kit, HPS 5.0 pads, ECS Rotors, 17x8 RPF-1's w/ 225/45R17 Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetrical 3's... and 2 of the 3 ST's in HS class were still ~2-3 seconds faster (they also PAX'd in the top 10, FWIW). I did, however, run the 4th fastest time (out of 21) in the Novice class.
 

CNGVW

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Location
Bob Mann Auto, 111 High St, Pembroke MA 02359
TDI
Many TDI Jettas and a Beetle Race car fitted with CNG dual fuel conversion.
I have run the only TDI powered Beetle in the USA in Lemon and Champ racing for 5 years. done right they are supper fast after the suspension is set right .

As you cas see we are leading aver fast group real race cars.

this is our new car from last year soon to be TDI powered
 

SKI-R

Active member
Joined
Apr 20, 2008
Location
Canmore, Alberta
TDI
'03 Jetta GLS TDI, '02 Golf TDI
I hope to have a competitive MK5 TDI. Lowered, 250HP, Wavetrac etc.
I suspect at 250hp and Wavetrac that your mods put you in CSP (handicap of 0.843 IIRC) = you will not be competitive in PAX, maybe raw if you're a ridiculously skilled driver, but even that is doubtful.

ANYONE legitimately considering auto-x should start first with reading the SCCA rules - they are VERY specific about mods/classification. Then go do some ride-a-longs with the local fast guys, while there - talk to a bunch of folks about competitive cars. Then go buy a cheap older Base Cooper and learn to drive in HS. THEN decide if you really want to be competitive. Regardless of the path you choose - have FUN! It is an absolute blast :)
 

SuzukiDan7

New member
Joined
Apr 22, 2017
Location
Buffalo
TDI
2015 Jetta TDi S and 2015 Jetta TDi SE
You can do well and beat plenty of other "quick" cars, but you won't be truly competitive in HS class (and certainly not in anything higher like STH) with the Fiesta ST's you'll be going against.

I ran my 2014 Jetta TDI today with Koni coilovers (corner balanced), Tyrolsport Caliper Stiffening Kit, HPS 5.0 pads, ECS Rotors, 17x8 RPF-1's w/ 225/45R17 Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetrical 3's... and 2 of the 3 ST's in HS class were still ~2-3 seconds faster (they also PAX'd in the top 10, FWIW). I did, however, run the 4th fastest time (out of 21) in the Novice class.
I'm trying to remember, doesn't pax time take into account the fact that my Jetta has zero chance against something like a fiesta ST in raw times? Or was it just based on class?
The last autox I went to they focused more on pax times than raw, which made sense to me, that way everyone should theoretically be competitive regardless of your car.
 

SKI-R

Active member
Joined
Apr 20, 2008
Location
Canmore, Alberta
TDI
'03 Jetta GLS TDI, '02 Golf TDI
PAX is indeed a handicap system to try to create a level playing field, BUT....it tries to deal with CLASS differences, not car differences. Your '15 TDI Jetta and the FiST are both in H Street (as long as modifications are limited to rule allowances for the class), so there is no actual handicap difference between the two. You're still gonna have fun though!

Probably not explained particularly well, sorry.
 

shepner

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2006
Location
Milwaukee, WI
TDI
2015 Golf TDI
ANYONE legitimately considering auto-x should start first with reading the SCCA rules - they are VERY specific about mods/classification.
That is an incredible understatement. Just changing the pedal caps (ie if you want the GTI look) will bump you out of HS. When I was going through the SCCA rules and classes, I quickly came to the conclusion that I could spend a smallish amount of money and be in the higher end of HS OR I could spend a ton of money to go up a class and do poorly. Needless to say I chose to have fun with the car in HS.

If (when) I choose to race something that is more competitive, then Ill goto a car dedicated for the purpose but that is a whole 'nother conversation.


SKI-R said:
PAX is indeed a handicap system to try to create a level playing field, BUT....it tries to deal with CLASS differences, not car differences. Your '15 TDI Jetta and the FiST are both in H Street (as long as modifications are limited to rule allowances for the class), so there is no actual handicap difference between the two. You're still gonna have fun though!
The PAX system kinda annoyed me and I also wanted a better way to see how well I was improving so a couple years ago I put together a spreadsheet which would ingest the the full per-race data for the whole season from AXWare. The goal was to factor out the car from the equation and compare the drivers themselves. Essentially, working toward the same goal as PAX but from the opposite direction. This actually worked fairly well but after 2 years of data the spreadsheet was at its limits. An interesting side effect of this method was that I could also pull in and use the HSAX data as well.

I also have an older one I created for go-karts. It doesnt go into nearly as much detail but it has data going back to 2015. In both cases they have the added benefit(?) of being able to estimate who will win.*

Id love to have the time/effort/funding to work with the all of the historic AXWare data (ie like they do for PAX) and provide a service for everyone to use. I.e. I think it would be fun for the guy just starting out to be able to reasonably compare himself to his buddy who was racing a completely different car 5yrs ago. Or in our case, just how well am I doing compared to that Fiesta ST who consistently gets better times. Or more specifically, am I actually catching up to that guy racing, and often winning with, a stock 2015 GTI in Pro?

...If such a service existed, *would* anyone else find something like that useful?


*to preempt the naysayers, I am well aware that there is a bit of "fuzziness" inherent to this in that there are a number of caveats, assumptions, etc that cant be avoided. Just like with your bathroom scale, there is a certain level of accuracy and so consistency throughout is key in order to have anything meaningful.
 
Top