Stop solenoid testing

Abacus

That helpful B4 guy
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Relocated from Maine to Dewey, AZ
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Only the B4V left
Where did you get the new front mount?

Thanks for your post about the CPS, something to keep in mind.

Do you now have fuel with the replacement and the no-start condition?
 

ToddA1

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Aug 3, 2011
Location
NJ 08002
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'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
I bought a set of OE mounts from Bora Parts. Still need to install 2 more.

I don't follow the last part..... The car runs as it did.

-Todd
 

Abacus

That helpful B4 guy
Joined
Nov 10, 2007
Location
Relocated from Maine to Dewey, AZ
TDI
Only the B4V left
Are they non-Chinese mounts? I am in need of a new set but everyone seems to stock the Chinese ones, and I'd rather grab some less worn-out used ones from a junkyard than use new Chinese. I replaced mine 6 or 7 years ago (and over 200K) with the 2 rear being hydraulic and they have been great, but are NLA.

For the last part, I was going by this section in your post just above mine:

Car drives like it did a week ago; I notice nothing different. From what I've read, when these things start going bad, the idle is erratic and will stumble when driving. I don't really recall anything out of the ordinary happening. Drove the car to work, parked it, wouldn't start 14 hours later.... bizarre.
But as I'm re-reading it, did you mean that was the condition to lead you to the CPS, rather than when they get intermittent. I may have mis-interpreted it as you having a current no-start condition.
 
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ToddA1

Top Post Dawg
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Aug 3, 2011
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NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
OE is OE... 100% VAG mounts. These mounts aren't listed on Aaron's site and will be about triple what the standard mount set costs. I wanted a set before all the German sets disappeared.

Honestly, I'm sure I pulled a Chinese mount out of the car. The new German mount doesn't stand out as being amazingly better. I'll have to sit in the car and really pay attention. That being said, China mounts may not be as bad as you think.

What you have in bold happened a week ago (03/06). The CPS was the fix, last night (03/13).

-Todd
 

greenskeeper

Top Post Dawg
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Mar 10, 2003
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USA
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1998 Jetta TDI
Interested to see your mpgs with a correctly working CPS, and incorrect signal although still working could be what was killing your mileage.....well at least I'm optimistic!
 

ToddA1

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Aug 3, 2011
Location
NJ 08002
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'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Thanks for your optimism!

Like I said, I had no tell tale tells of the CPS slowly dieing. It was if it had a massive coronary and went out.

If I get anything, I'd be happy. I still need to lower my IQ to 3.0 and do the VCDS timing change. I've been waiting for work to slow down and weather to get a bit warmer.

-Todd
 

ToddA1

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NJ 08002
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'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
That is correct.

Bora Parts may be able to get the part to you faster, since you're in AZ.

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
I ran a jumper to my stop solenoid and the clicking began - it fired up but idle was very erratic - any guesses as to where I need to look for the break in the system?\

I found the CPS and expect it monday - I figured I might as well change it since I'm going to be replacing all 3 engine mounts (I guess I need to source a few bolts at the stealer)
 

ToddA1

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Location
NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Did you test the speed sensor? Pretty simple to do. The erratic idle is a definite symptom, although I wouldn't condemn it. Since you're doing mounts, why not though.

Did you scan the car?

If you saw my codes, the G28 (CPS or ESS) was definitely showing a code. Now my research told me that this code shouldn't show unless you're OBD-1, when the car is not running. If you're showing any G28 code, it's definitely a sign something may be amiss.

My G28 code also changed from "implausible" to "no signal", overnight.

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

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TDI
Passat, 97, white
Hey, thanks for the response (again!) - I did see your codes the other nite when I found this thread. I'm going to see if a local TDIer can bring his cable. Time for me to bite the bullet and get my own
I should see the Crankshaft Position Sensor about 2pm on Monday - got it for $54 from AZ auto. - I guess I can work on the the other 2 mounts and save the front mount for when part arrives. I'm also wondering if I need another relay 109 since I don't have a GP lite on dash. Plug'n in VCDS is definitely next to help answer the questions of things that go bad overnight!!! I'll post my findings.
 

ToddA1

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'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Not sure what to say about the no GP light. Are you able to start it without the 12v jumper to the stop solenoid? If not, it's very possible that you could have a bad 109.

What color is your 109? Black is the original. Gray is the update and "109" will be upside down.

Did you test the G28? I see no mention of any readings. All you need is a multimeter.

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

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Location
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TDI
Passat, 97, white
Car will not fire without jumper to the stop solenoid.
Found 1.2k ohms on my G28
I replaced my relay 109 a few years ago, but I'm not going to rule it out. Was looking for my old one since it never failed so I could swap. Now I'm just feeling around and moving wires, checking connections with key on to see it the clicking returns
 

Truckeratlarge

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Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
Now I don't have any gauges, but the GP blinks when the jumper is presentand key on. If the trunk is open but the ignition is off, the trunk lite blinks in a faded manner, but it stays liight 100 percent if the key is on.
 

ToddA1

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Joined
Aug 3, 2011
Location
NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
The G28 is within spec.

Try removing the jumper at the stop solenoid and pulling your 109 relay. I dont have a relay in front of me, but I think you'll need to jump pins 30 and 87 at the panel.

Try starting the car.

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

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Jun 16, 2005
Location
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TDI
Passat, 97, white
I connected the pins on the relay and plugged it in - nothing. I'm on to sanding and filing grounds. Last time I had no start issue 2008, I found the problem under the battery tray - I don't remember how many wires had melded together. I will keep ya posted on results of cleaning grounds
 

ToddA1

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Joined
Aug 3, 2011
Location
NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Have you gone through your wiring looking for breaks? It wasn't my issue, but many have had it be their problem.

Is the car drivable? Even a generic scan at Autozone, Advance, etc. may be better than nothing...

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

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Location
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Passat, 97, white
Not driveable. Ordered Ross-Tech last nite, so should have cables by Thursday.
The mess I had in '08 under the battery tray was broken/chafed wires, I am familiar with that mess. - It was bitter sweet to find that. But repairing those 10 or so wires fixed it back then. I'm looking all over wires for connections, grounds (clean and file).
I'm off to library to make copies of needed pages from the Bentley manual so I can have better understanding of the wiring
 

ToddA1

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Location
NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Thursday isn't too bad, although I find it surprising that you don't own a cable and you've been around almost 8 years.

Autozone, Advance, etc. may have a scanner in their tool lending program, if the curiosity is getting the better of you.

-Todd
 

Abacus

That helpful B4 guy
Joined
Nov 10, 2007
Location
Relocated from Maine to Dewey, AZ
TDI
Only the B4V left
I have found several breaks in the IP harness before, one near the battery and several right by the IP where the 3 wires come out of the loom, near the connector. It's a popular spot for chafing.
 

Truckeratlarge

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Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
Hey, thank you Abacus - I will double check that.

Todd, the car came with a ten year warranty. I've not had problems to justify the purchase until recently
 

Truckeratlarge

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Jun 16, 2005
Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
It currently seems I may have wiring issue between battery tray and the cannon plug. My instrument cluster is awake after feeling thru the wire harness; all gauges, clock, odo and warning lights are working.

I will post with results when I'm able to get need the hood, again.
Dave
 

ToddA1

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Location
NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Always start with the easy stuff....

You may not have needed the VCDS cable for another several years. At least youll be able to clear the codes that you've recently acquired.

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

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Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
Thanks to all who did their best to pitch in on another loved TDi!
Got new relay 109 today (plus a spare). Im hoping it did the trick ... It didnt make a difference until after starting car with jump wire to stop soloid, bring up to temp, cleared DTCs. shut everything down. After undo jump wire, I turned key, and there was the comforting click I have known for 16 years (N75)... now it seems fine and starts the way it should. No codes an hour later..Yippee Ka yeah!!
I guess I didn't jump the relay just right when I tried to test it awhile back.
Now on to front and right engine mounts (save the left one for when I change LCA bushings).

I cant find thread on changing EGR values with VCDS to minimize soot in intake - everything seems always right there till I go to look for it.
 

ToddA1

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Location
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'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
Wait.... So the entire issue was the 109 relay? What about the broken wires under he battery?

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

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Jun 16, 2005
Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
Wait.... So the entire issue was the 109 relay? What about the broken wires under he battery?

-Todd
I tested the continuity of the wires I had repaired in the past that are between the battery tray and the cannon plug; they each toned out (good). Since the GP relay and light kept failing, and I used a stethoscope on the 109 and it was silent when turning the key resolved the no start prob by ordering 2 relays (now I have a spare). Getting the 2 of 3 engine mounts sure makes an improvement. I've got the timing belt on good, IP timing is smack dab between blue & green lines. IQ is 3 to 3.2 without tweaking it with VCDS;)

Went half mile down the street to p/u some dinner, all the dash gauges were all intermittently trying to read zero. :eek:
Now on test runs at full operating temp, I have these codes after WOT. :confused:

6 Faults Found:
65535 - Internal Control Module Memory Error
37-00 - Faulty
00527 - Intake Manifold Temperature Sensor (G72)
30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent
00539 - Fuel Temperature Sensor (G81)
30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent
00522 - Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor (G62)
30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent
00777 - Accelerator Position Sensor (G79)
27-00 - Implausible Signal
00553 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70)
28-00 - Short to Plus

I can clear these out and everything is fine until I road test

I'm going to start with the little hose in the ECU.
Any other ideas on places to check for ground wires or just wires that are notorious for breaking?
 
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ToddA1

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Aug 3, 2011
Location
NJ 08002
TDI
'96 B4V, '97 B4 (sold), '97 Jetta (scrapped)
I think I've read that the cluster grounds are at the rear of the head. I think they're at the coolant flange... it's been a while.

I was getting a bunch of odd codes when I had my issue. Start by clearing them and see what comes back. The key just needs to be in the "run" position; the engine doesn't need to run... just a FYI. From your earlier post, I'm not sure you're aware of that.

-Todd
 

Truckeratlarge

Veteran Member
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Jun 16, 2005
Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
Cleaned up the 3 wires (grounds) on the cannon plug, checked wires again for any nicks, chaffing, etc and found no probs. Replaced the 3mm hose in the ECM. I was able to pull the hose off the metal nipple without removing the tiny spring clamp! I used a razor blade to slice hose to remove from plastic nipple. So far as I can tell I don't have any issues with engine cutting out. No more DTC's... but I haven't been able to really drive the car any distance.

Now I need to find a thread on freight train smoke and only moderate power at WOT ...but it starts like new and idles nicely.
 

Truckeratlarge

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Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Location
Kansas City, MO
TDI
Passat, 97, white
Sorry for not having updated - been busy. Other than going thru and checking grounds, double checking and fine tuning with VCDS, things have straightened up. Emissions testing was a pass at 16% opacity, but I think there device wasn't correct - I don't notice any more smoke than before. I still need to install my new voltage regulator. - just busy moving myself ontop of taking care of my customers.
 
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