BeetleGo
TDIClub Enthusiast, Pre-Forum Veteran Member
Yep, well said!
Standard transmissions are for losers - discuss...
- Thread starter Windex
- Start date
ROD-TDI
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2002
- Location
- Nothern Virginia
- TDI
- Mk7 Golf S TDI 6-speed, 2017 Tiguan Limited, 2015 Golf R DSG/DCC/NAV.
X2! And you can always tell who is the person from the U.S. at a European rental car office. They are the one who can't drive a car with a manual transmission! Our last vehicle with an auto trans was a new '73 Chevy Blazer, which only came with an auto box, everything before and since has been a manual and always will be.
Devil's advocate here:
The choices for manuals in here seem to center around a major theme: preference.
If it weren't for that preference, the reasoning of yore doesn't really hold as much water.
DSG's are as or more efficient (not really a slushbox any more)
they shift smoother (latest gen). For those that wish to argue this point - fine, but I would argue that to shift as smooth as a dsg, you need to delay the shift, and feather the clutch; losing efficiency as you do so.
Control? You have as much control in a DSG as you do in a manual - I can up/downshift to any gear and hold any gear just as one can in a manual.
Longevity? certain autoboxes are garbage no doubt - 01Ms are particularly notorious. There are certain manuals just as bad or worse than the auto option - 020's were not very reliable and chewed through reverse if not babied.
Google "mustang transmission problems" and take a gander at the manual vs auto reliability of a different marque.
Long term DSG performance? I have seen DSGs at 400k km up here with regular maintenance. Maintenance is key.
I am calling the kettle black here, I went through the grief of converting my My B5 to a 6spd, but I'm slowly being shaken out of my foggy manual-only mantra just a little bit.
I have a 2010 EOS DSG in the family, and I don't mind it. The take-up from a stop was a bit chunky, but malone takes care of that...
The choices for manuals in here seem to center around a major theme: preference.
If it weren't for that preference, the reasoning of yore doesn't really hold as much water.
DSG's are as or more efficient (not really a slushbox any more)
they shift smoother (latest gen). For those that wish to argue this point - fine, but I would argue that to shift as smooth as a dsg, you need to delay the shift, and feather the clutch; losing efficiency as you do so.
Control? You have as much control in a DSG as you do in a manual - I can up/downshift to any gear and hold any gear just as one can in a manual.
Longevity? certain autoboxes are garbage no doubt - 01Ms are particularly notorious. There are certain manuals just as bad or worse than the auto option - 020's were not very reliable and chewed through reverse if not babied.
Google "mustang transmission problems" and take a gander at the manual vs auto reliability of a different marque.
Long term DSG performance? I have seen DSGs at 400k km up here with regular maintenance. Maintenance is key.
I am calling the kettle black here, I went through the grief of converting my My B5 to a 6spd, but I'm slowly being shaken out of my foggy manual-only mantra just a little bit.
I have a 2010 EOS DSG in the family, and I don't mind it. The take-up from a stop was a bit chunky, but malone takes care of that...
You don't mention the clutch. It is the clutch that gives you the control that an auto cannot. Over on the 1st gen cummins forum, there are hundreds of "boy I wish I had a manual" threads, as well as converting to the NV4500 or Getrag G360. My Land Cruiser would have sucked if it had an auto. I cannot even imagine my 912 with an auto, probably because it was not an option on the 912. It is the clutch that determines whether you spin doughnuts or climb out of a bad spot, it is the control of which I speak. I know autos can last for many miles. they are just not my cup of tea. I am sure that part of it is that I am still looking through 21 year old eyes and hope to be doing the same when I die, it gives life meaning
..Markymz
Top Post Dawg
- Joined
- May 12, 2003
- Location
- Between Toronto & Montreal
- TDI
- 2003 Jetta TDI Wagon, 2003 Jetta TDI Wagon
You little devil, you...
How much was the transmission maintenance for those 400k km cars? For those who drive a lot, that works out to a DSG service every 3 - 4 oil changes... more often than once a year... And when the DSG does break down, how much is the repair? I don't have to remind you that one can get a reliable used 5 speed manual transmission for not much more than the cost of a few DSG fluid changes... how much would a repair or replacement for that DSG cost? Would you trust a junkyard DSG?
Some people can definitely live with an automatic... others really have little choice.
Yuri.
PS: many, many years ago, we were given a huge Buick that needed a transmission... in those days, it cost around $400 to "rebuild" the automatic... things have changed a bit...
JDSwan87
Black Swamp Thing
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2014
- Location
- Michigan near Toledo
- TDI
- 2001 Jetta TDI, 5 speed Lagoon Blue Metallic(sold); 2005 Jetta TDI Wagon auto
I still prefer a clutch for winter driving. Nothing compares to being able to dictate how much power goes to the wheels when starting from a stop on a snowy road or getting un-stuck in my driveway. I swear they don't plow the roads by me on purpose like its some sort of evil game... Its like they wait just down the road for you to get done with your driveway, put all your stuff away, get warm and then they plow a 3ft tall mountain at the end!!
thecause17
Veteran Member
I went back and forth with myself over whether to get the manual or DSG when I bought my TDi. I've trusted automatics in all of my trucks over the years, and they were always fine, as I also maintained them. With cars on the other hand I tend to buy manual transmissions because the experience of my own as well as friends/relatives has shown a lower reliability in the cars. Our Pilot has been good up to date currently at 67k miles. I believe the fluid has been changed 3 times now following the maintenance minder. The DSG I was unsure of. It didn't fit in the definition of automatic transmission that I was used to, so I really ended up doing my homework to find out what these things were made of. Since the mileage was similar and it would also be nice to have a car my wife could also drive I went with the DSG. It can be a little quirky (mostly before it warms up) but it's really grown on me to the point that if I buy another VAG product I would prefer that it be a DSG. I've had two VW rentals that were conventional autos(2.5 Jetta and 2.5 Passat) and hated them both after having my TDi in DSG. If considering a car that wasn't a daily driver and was more for enjoyment I would still prefer a manual transmission though.
whitedog
Veteran Member
Our 6.0L bus came new with a built transmission. At 450,000 miles, we have done nothing with it other than fluid and filter changes.
Two of our Duramax/Allison buses are at 650,000 miles and one at 420,000 miles with nothing but fluid and filter changes. The first two head out on the highway and do very little shifting for most of the day. The other one is also highway, but it's mountain passes so it's shifting more in the higher gears. I know the City has three Duramax/Allison buses running around the city and they may have transmission problems, but I don't know.
The boss has a 2012 Powerstroke (that is in the shop for Exhaust valves under warranty) and that transmission is built on Allison technology from what I have heard and apparently the shop has seen zero problems with them.
I guess if I have a point it's that transmissions can be built to last in heavy use, so the future (in my opinion) is that manual transmission cars and trucks will become niche vehicles.
Actually you bring up a good point in the comparison.
Those manuals that are clicking away trouble-free miles are usually in the hands of road warrior high mileage drivers.
The autos cited as unreliable are usually doing more than their fair share of city miles.
No doubt that in an apples-to-apple comparison, equally abused manuals and automatics would come close in terms of long term repair costs.
Mk5 jettas/golfs - still going to need a DMF even though standard.
High miler standard transmissions - gonna need syncros at some point, likely on 2nd...
Starting off in a higher gear in the snow - DSGs can do that...
If I were driving a DSG, and the miles were all highway, I would certainly extend the interval for fluid changes to bring maintenance costs more in line with a standard.
That gap is narrowing Yuri...
Those manuals that are clicking away trouble-free miles are usually in the hands of road warrior high mileage drivers.
The autos cited as unreliable are usually doing more than their fair share of city miles.
No doubt that in an apples-to-apple comparison, equally abused manuals and automatics would come close in terms of long term repair costs.
Mk5 jettas/golfs - still going to need a DMF even though standard.
High miler standard transmissions - gonna need syncros at some point, likely on 2nd...
Starting off in a higher gear in the snow - DSGs can do that...
If I were driving a DSG, and the miles were all highway, I would certainly extend the interval for fluid changes to bring maintenance costs more in line with a standard.
That gap is narrowing Yuri...
Genesis
Top Post Dawg
Automatics have one major problem that nobody has yet solved in a resounding way -- the friction material for the clutch(es) is in the wetted (lubricated) area.
This means the unit intentionally contaminates its lubricating fluid. This in turn means you need good filtration to keep that contamination from destroying the bearings and other precision surfaces inside, and most ATs lack anything approaching "good filtration."
But even with attention to filtration the AT operates at a handicap the manual does not, and it has a cost penalty associated with it that is quite severe, both initially and down the road in maintenance and repairs.
I've driven a few credible automatics over the years. But I still prefer a manual transmission; the (very) minor convenience factor of an automatic is outweighed by the control I have of the vehicle's drivetrain with a manual. No automatic will ever be able to determine a few seconds in advance of a corner entry exactly what I intend when I enter that corner, or as I take and exit it. My brain knows this but an automatic transmission does not -- and cannot.
I don't like nannies in general. ABS I tolerate even though I can out-stop it because while I can outstop it then difference in performance between a skilled driver and ABS is relatively small in absolute terms. Of course if that extra 5' is the difference between a collision and not some day for me I'm going to be pissed off, but for the UNSKILLED driver ABS materially shortens THEIR stopping distances -- so there you have it.
This means the unit intentionally contaminates its lubricating fluid. This in turn means you need good filtration to keep that contamination from destroying the bearings and other precision surfaces inside, and most ATs lack anything approaching "good filtration."
But even with attention to filtration the AT operates at a handicap the manual does not, and it has a cost penalty associated with it that is quite severe, both initially and down the road in maintenance and repairs.
I've driven a few credible automatics over the years. But I still prefer a manual transmission; the (very) minor convenience factor of an automatic is outweighed by the control I have of the vehicle's drivetrain with a manual. No automatic will ever be able to determine a few seconds in advance of a corner entry exactly what I intend when I enter that corner, or as I take and exit it. My brain knows this but an automatic transmission does not -- and cannot.
I don't like nannies in general. ABS I tolerate even though I can out-stop it because while I can outstop it then difference in performance between a skilled driver and ABS is relatively small in absolute terms. Of course if that extra 5' is the difference between a collision and not some day for me I'm going to be pissed off, but for the UNSKILLED driver ABS materially shortens THEIR stopping distances -- so there you have it.
What autos I do own, I treat the gearbox components equally as my engine block and components.
I change the fluid and filter every 7k. Even says so right on the filter box. Every 7k. We know, and it's proven, what good is a clogged filter? Why are we so determined to spin on new engine filters, but never a transmission filter? I added a spin on for my 4l60, hangs right up front, just before the Trans cooler.
I think 90% of the public forgets there's fluid elsewhere to maintain. You see hundreds of gallons of motor oil on shelves, but not as common as hydraulic fluid for transmissions.
Go used car shopping. I bet 9 out of 10 dipsticks you'll have to double take and make sure you didn't pull the engine dipstick....
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tadawson
Veteran Member
In the 35 years I have owned vehicles (9 total, 3 trucks, 5 cars, 1 motorhome, with 3 manuals 5 autos, 1 DSG) the only trans failures I have had were in the manuals. One had a clutch cable break, one wore out a clutch, and one grenaded a enough stuff inside so as to refuse to stay in 1st or second, needing a full rebuild. The clutch, granted is a wear item, which is a given at some point, but the others were outright failures. Zero issues with any of the autos, and mileage driven was similar. Both have thier place, and I have driven both in heavy snow areas, and have very little preference, having never been stuck in either. In snow, hitting neutral in the auto gives the same benefits as the manual in downhill, and I can't honestly say that I have found a clutch to be anything more than an annoyance in snow under power. The right pedal always seemed to manage power for me just fine . . .
I like manuals for fun and performance. If the car is capable of neither, I really can't say I have much of a preference, towing included . . .
Also consider that a poorly driven manual has great potential for far *lower* mileage if rhe driver cannot select the correct gear. It would be interesting to track real world mileage manual vs DSG vs traditional auto for random drivers too see what really happens, as opposed to tests that are always tweaked to be best. To the Cummins references, there are guys who claim to never get more than 8 mpg, but I regularly average 14 to 15 and 20 on the open road. They call be a liar, but theevidence is there . . . some just won't accept that poor driving technique is far more detrimental to MPG than the trans, at (at least for the unwashed masses) the auto makes it a bit harder to let ones stupidity shoot them in the face.
- Tim
I like manuals for fun and performance. If the car is capable of neither, I really can't say I have much of a preference, towing included . . .
Also consider that a poorly driven manual has great potential for far *lower* mileage if rhe driver cannot select the correct gear. It would be interesting to track real world mileage manual vs DSG vs traditional auto for random drivers too see what really happens, as opposed to tests that are always tweaked to be best. To the Cummins references, there are guys who claim to never get more than 8 mpg, but I regularly average 14 to 15 and 20 on the open road. They call be a liar, but theevidence is there . . . some just won't accept that poor driving technique is far more detrimental to MPG than the trans, at (at least for the unwashed masses) the auto makes it a bit harder to let ones stupidity shoot them in the face.
- Tim
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Serra
Well-known member
1. I think everyone should know how to drive a manual. My wife and I both do. I can drive a stick and an on the column shift and know how to shift a motorcycle with many years experience on each. My son has not had a chance to learn yet, as we don't currently have any manuals.
2. My personal preference is to drive an automatic. I don't find any additional fun from shifting gears. I hate shifting gears in stop and go traffic. I agree that manually shifting gets better gas mileage and better power can control, but not enough to make me want to do it.
3. The DSG seems fine to me. I have no problem with it. Yes it costs more to maintain, but that isn't a huge concern. I like my DSG, but I can feel it shifting more than I do when I drive my Jeep, and much more than my wife's Insight.
One of the things that surprised me about the TDI world is the overall hatred of automatics. Everywhere I go on the net to read about TDIs, the posters all act like automatics are hell-spawn to be avoided. That seems to stink more of elitism than true concern about driving pleasure.
2. My personal preference is to drive an automatic. I don't find any additional fun from shifting gears. I hate shifting gears in stop and go traffic. I agree that manually shifting gets better gas mileage and better power can control, but not enough to make me want to do it.
3. The DSG seems fine to me. I have no problem with it. Yes it costs more to maintain, but that isn't a huge concern. I like my DSG, but I can feel it shifting more than I do when I drive my Jeep, and much more than my wife's Insight.
One of the things that surprised me about the TDI world is the overall hatred of automatics. Everywhere I go on the net to read about TDIs, the posters all act like automatics are hell-spawn to be avoided. That seems to stink more of elitism than true concern about driving pleasure.
Bah! Drive a gearbox without synchronizers, and straight cut gears!! Ford flat heads anyone?
i drove a 3sp non synced aux behind a non synced 5sp main in a '61 T850. Thought I could throw the main in neutral and quick shift the aux, got completely lost with the center driveshaft, as it was now disconnected from both gearboxes. Had to come to a stop and start all over again, several times. (hehe, me, oops)
Eventually I got the hang of it.
Sent from my rooted HTC Supersonic using Tapatalk 2 Pro
i drove a 3sp non synced aux behind a non synced 5sp main in a '61 T850. Thought I could throw the main in neutral and quick shift the aux, got completely lost with the center driveshaft, as it was now disconnected from both gearboxes. Had to come to a stop and start all over again, several times. (hehe, me, oops)
Eventually I got the hang of it.
Sent from my rooted HTC Supersonic using Tapatalk 2 Pro
I used to drive 900 series American LaFrance fire engines that had 5 speed fully NON synchronized crash boxes. When I finally got good at it, I only needed the clutch to get going, all rev matching after that. It was 1 thing driving normally, but add the emergency, the traffic, going against traffic control and a screaming Captain and it was a real accomplishment
...MarkSame thing with all the manuals on the trucks where I work - 10, 13, 18 spd eatons.
Once you get proficient, you use the clutch to start, then match revs after, 1-4 hit the splitter, do it all over again, and with hi/lo if your driving the 18 spd:
Trucking has been a stalwart about retaining standards, but autos are starting to gain some serious traction in the last couple of years.
Once you get proficient, you use the clutch to start, then match revs after, 1-4 hit the splitter, do it all over again, and with hi/lo if your driving the 18 spd:
Trucking has been a stalwart about retaining standards, but autos are starting to gain some serious traction in the last couple of years.
thecause17
Veteran Member
This technology currently exists. Rolls-Royce, among other manufacturers have available GPS based technology that in fact does anticipate shifts needed taking into account the road/terrain and driving style. While what the car does may NOT be exactly what you intend (I'd be willing to be in some cases it's better) it's pretty good. Never say never.
http://www.velocity.com/tv-shows/fifth-gear/videos/rolls-royce-wraith.htm
I'm not saying I would necessarily want it, I like to drive myself, but it is out there...
GCBUG00
Veteran Member
Make mine a manual please.
I enjoy the control, interaction and simplicity of the manual trans.
Bought my 1st one in 1975 ordered a Camaro 350CID, 4V, 4 spd sight unseen never even drove one first, then a 1979 C10 350 again with the 4 speed granny gear. Took a turn and got married traded the '79 for a '65 Ford Econoline P/U then a '62 F100 both 3 on the tree. In between a Willy's 1952 M38, then a Dodge Caravan 5 speed. Daughter ran a Neon for years used a modular clutch. Current is an '05 Dodge Ram 5.9L CTD NV5600, my Son has a 1997 Dodge Ram 3500 5.9L CTD NV4500 and the TDI for over a year.
Lots of side stories about manuals, the D-Max handshaker I think you'll find only about 20,000 or so were ever built and they used a DMF and self adjusting clutch that had an issue or two. The first Ford 7.3L's up to '97 were all equipped with a different version of the DMF that IMHO created the DMF reputation for us. Dodge picked up a DMF in mid '05 in the G56.
I use the '05 Dodge CTD to tow my Airstream and that NV5600 does the job. Period.
My A/T experience is kinda limited but a real turn off hit my Daughter when her Hyundai needed a new complete A/T because the old one could not be economically repaired even though you could barely detect the delayed shift issue.
I enjoy the control, interaction and simplicity of the manual trans.
Bought my 1st one in 1975 ordered a Camaro 350CID, 4V, 4 spd sight unseen never even drove one first, then a 1979 C10 350 again with the 4 speed granny gear. Took a turn and got married traded the '79 for a '65 Ford Econoline P/U then a '62 F100 both 3 on the tree. In between a Willy's 1952 M38, then a Dodge Caravan 5 speed. Daughter ran a Neon for years used a modular clutch. Current is an '05 Dodge Ram 5.9L CTD NV5600, my Son has a 1997 Dodge Ram 3500 5.9L CTD NV4500 and the TDI for over a year.
Lots of side stories about manuals, the D-Max handshaker I think you'll find only about 20,000 or so were ever built and they used a DMF and self adjusting clutch that had an issue or two. The first Ford 7.3L's up to '97 were all equipped with a different version of the DMF that IMHO created the DMF reputation for us. Dodge picked up a DMF in mid '05 in the G56.
I use the '05 Dodge CTD to tow my Airstream and that NV5600 does the job. Period.
My A/T experience is kinda limited but a real turn off hit my Daughter when her Hyundai needed a new complete A/T because the old one could not be economically repaired even though you could barely detect the delayed shift issue.
Perfectreign
Veteran Member
Since learning to drive in 1985, I'd managed to only drive a manual on a few occasions. (one of them beiing in Germany in my friend's Audi 5000.) I then bought the Jetta as a manual because I wanted something completely reliable and cheaper to repair than an auto tranny.
I've no desire to drive a manual. I fail to see the slight edge of control I have over when driving an automatic. My FIL refuses to buy a new car/suv with an auto trans, so his last purchase was a 2010 Jeep Liberty 4x4 with a five-speed. (He's English and 78 years old, so I forgive him.) That was the ONLY midsize truck/suv he could find with a manual at the time. (He used to tow a trailer, but not anymore.) Of course, I had to chuckle when I drove my Avalanche up to the Sierras to meet him once for camping. H'd blown his clutch trying to maneuver the trailer into position. I pulled his Jeep out of the way, and proceeded to put the trailer in the right spot with my Avalanche.
Every once in awhile, I'll come across someone who's done a 4L60 to manual swap on the Avalanche forums. I still shake my head.
To each his own, I guess.
I've no desire to drive a manual. I fail to see the slight edge of control I have over when driving an automatic. My FIL refuses to buy a new car/suv with an auto trans, so his last purchase was a 2010 Jeep Liberty 4x4 with a five-speed. (He's English and 78 years old, so I forgive him.) That was the ONLY midsize truck/suv he could find with a manual at the time. (He used to tow a trailer, but not anymore.) Of course, I had to chuckle when I drove my Avalanche up to the Sierras to meet him once for camping. H'd blown his clutch trying to maneuver the trailer into position. I pulled his Jeep out of the way, and proceeded to put the trailer in the right spot with my Avalanche.
Every once in awhile, I'll come across someone who's done a 4L60 to manual swap on the Avalanche forums. I still shake my head.
To each his own, I guess.
Perfectreign
Veteran Member
I fail to see what driving a stick has to do with the above. I eat breakfast, check my email, and often shave while driving the Jetta (which is a manual.)
nicklockard
Torque Dorque
Yes!!! Why in heck are these not available? I find most cars younger than 2008/2009 vintage are soooooo under geared. My car is running 3500 rpm's at 75mph in 5th. It has the power to propel to 75mph by 2800 rpm's. If I could gear it to run 700 rpm's lower, the FE would be a ton better.Speaking of manual transmissions...
Ya''ll know that song...."Tell me what you want....what you really, really want" ?
A dual range differential
I would love to have this in a (manual) dual range version
I can almost see a smaller (2nd Gear Handle) that says "Hi & Lo"...
Can you imagine it ???
A 10 speed 02J transmission in an A-4
nicklockard
Torque Dorque
2 benefits to driving manuals:
1. Manual drivers are better drivers. Yes, Virginia, I said better. And I absolutely will stand by that. Without fail, automatic drivers are more lazy, less attentive, and brake at the last possible second, always racing from one light to the next like idiots. Automatic drivers are like space cadets, barely mentally engaged in piloting their dangerous vehicles. Manual drivers HAVE to pay attention and keep the brain engaged in the tasks of piloting. I would be interested to find data on this.
2. Driving a stick (in America) makes your car less likely to get stolen, as there are far fewer folks who can even drive one. There was a story lately about some teens that tried and failed, and had to leave the car half a block away from where they tried to carjack it.
1. Manual drivers are better drivers. Yes, Virginia, I said better. And I absolutely will stand by that. Without fail, automatic drivers are more lazy, less attentive, and brake at the last possible second, always racing from one light to the next like idiots. Automatic drivers are like space cadets, barely mentally engaged in piloting their dangerous vehicles. Manual drivers HAVE to pay attention and keep the brain engaged in the tasks of piloting. I would be interested to find data on this.
2. Driving a stick (in America) makes your car less likely to get stolen, as there are far fewer folks who can even drive one. There was a story lately about some teens that tried and failed, and had to leave the car half a block away from where they tried to carjack it.
ezshift5
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 2, 2003
- Location
- West Coast
- TDI
- 2013 JSW TDI (Enroute BB).......2017 Jetta 1.4 turbo 5M ....................
......doing all those tasks while underway, you must fit right in with the southern California lifestyle.
I wish you the best (but have some reservations about multi-tasking while operating a motor vehicle)..............
ez
kpenner
Veteran Member
loser?
I had a '08 Focus with a manual transmission and took it to an oil change shop for service. The 20-something Millennial employee jumped into the car to drive it in and then jumped right out, walked up to the owner and said "manual transmission". Seemed that the owner was the only guy who could drive a stick shift. That millennial was the loser and a pathetic one at that! My wife can drive a stick shift and I taught my daughter to shift on my beetle.
I had a '08 Focus with a manual transmission and took it to an oil change shop for service. The 20-something Millennial employee jumped into the car to drive it in and then jumped right out, walked up to the owner and said "manual transmission". Seemed that the owner was the only guy who could drive a stick shift. That millennial was the loser and a pathetic one at that!
My wife can drive a stick shift and I taught my daughter to shift on my beetle.
BeetleGo
TDIClub Enthusiast, Pre-Forum Veteran Member
I thought you were talking about New England. Same thing! Got snow?
PakProtector
Veteran Member
The only DSG I have driven are the Ford implementations.You don't mention the clutch. It is the clutch that gives you the control that an auto cannot. Over on the 1st gen cummins forum, there are hundreds of "boy I wish I had a manual" threads, as well as converting to the NV4500 or Getrag G360. My Land Cruiser would have sucked if it had an auto. I cannot even imagine my 912 with an auto, probably because it was not an option on the 912. It is the clutch that determines whether you spin doughnuts or climb out of a bad spot, it is the control of which I speak. I know autos can last for many miles. they are just not my cup of tea. I am sure that part of it is that I am still looking through 21 year old eyes and hope to be doing the same when I die, it gives life meaning
They market them as autos, and so drag the clutch to simulate torque converters. Tell me that is good for friction material life. I dare you...double-dog-dare you...
The manuals are also geared short. As in need another gear to reach top gear ratio parity. Take the 2012 Focus or Fiesta for example...or the Fusion. 3k+ rpm in top gear at 70 is *RIDICULOUS*.
My truck is a 12V Cummins with an NV5600 and a 3.08 FDR...you can read the Gates label on the serpentine belt at highway speed. One firing stroke per telegraph pole...LOL That beast will do 25+ MPG average on a 35 mi, one way commute to work that is mostly highway. Stop-n-go is no issue, stick it in first and crawl right along.
Max fuel efficiency is at max cylinder pressure. This is concurrent with the torque peak at full throttle. Show me an auto shifter that will show full throttle on the torque peak in more than one gear( the first one ). Bet youse can't...
cheers,
Douglas
murphyslaw
Veteran Member
If driving a stick makes me a looser, then sign me up and mail me by bumper sticker.
Not a concern, I drive my cars like I stole them. I replaced the original clutch on my Cummins when I bought it, just because it had over 200k on it. I still have it as a spare, because it still looks new...Mark