Spraying VHT on my tires for traction?

jetta-girl

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Joined
Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
TDI
06 Jetta TDI
What do you guys think of this idea? I've heard that VHT will eat up my tires, and I've heard it is really good for solving my traction problems.

They spray the track down pretty well with VHT before the races, do you think even more on my tires would make a big difference?
 

jetta-girl

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Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
TDI
06 Jetta TDI
It's the stuff sprayed on the tracks to make them sticky. I'm pretty sure it's called VHT.
 

jetta-girl

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Location
WA
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06 Jetta TDI
Why? Do you think it would be a bad idea?
I really don't know much about it, I've just heard of other people doing it and thought I might check it out.

Please, let me know your thoughts on it...
 

drkblujetta

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Jan 31, 2007
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Venus
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2011 Audi A4 ALH TDI
Why not buy some race slicks.......:confused:

If your car is under warranty maybe it would be a better choice (if you actually eat up your OEM tires etc.......)
 

johnboy00

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Joined
Jun 15, 2000
Location
Bridgewater,Ma.,USA
TDI
2005 Passat Wagon, 2004 Jetta, 2003 Jetta wagon
From what I read VHT is a rubber type coating sprayed on the road to improve traction and minimize wear of the road surface, such as starting lines (the rubber wears instead of the road).

If you put it on your tires you will still be driving on a rubber to road interface instead of rubber to rubber as in the case when it is put on a road. I would think that your tires would be a lot "stickier" than the VHT, although the VHT is "stickier" than the road surface and a good traction improver when put on the road.

My uneducated guess is that it would not work and could possibly be dangerous. I would stay away from it. People will try almost anything to try to gain a competitive advantage, this doesn't necessarily mean they are good ideas.
 

jetta-girl

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Location
WA
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06 Jetta TDI
drkblujetta said:
Why not buy some race slicks.......:confused:

If your car is under warranty maybe it would be a better choice (if you actually eat up your OEM tires etc.......)
Because I've used up my racing budget already. I only have enough left over for track fees, fuel and food. Unless I get more sponsorship money or the first perfect light purse again, it don't have the $ for it. Next season, the first thing on the list is drag radials. It seems so far away!:eek:
 

jetta-girl

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Location
WA
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06 Jetta TDI
johnboy00 said:
From what I read VHT is a rubber type coating sprayed on the road to improve traction and minimize wear of the road surface, such as starting lines (the rubber wears instead of the road).

If you put it on your tires you will still be driving on a rubber to road interface instead of rubber to rubber as in the case when it is put on a road. I would think that your tires would be a lot "stickier" than the VHT, although the VHT is "stickier" than the road surface and a good traction improver when put on the road.

My uneducated guess is that it would not work and could possibly be dangerous. I would stay away from it. People will try almost anything to try to gain a competitive advantage, this doesn't necessarily mean they are good ideas.
Thanks for your input! That's sorta what I was thinking too, but was wondering if anyone here has actually done it.
 

mojogoes

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 1, 2003
Location
england
TDI
mk3 tdi golf
jetta-girl said:
Because I've used up my racing budget already. I only have enough left over for track fees, fuel and food. Unless I get more sponsorship money or the first perfect light purse again, it don't have the $ for it. Next season, the first thing on the list is drag radials. It seems so far away!:eek:
I know Demon Tweeks sell a substance that you can spray on your tyres you can use , but i'm not sure its vht.
 

jetta-girl

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WA
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06 Jetta TDI
Thanks, Mojo. I think I might be better off just leaving the tires alone until I do a bit more research. :)
 

jetta-girl

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Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
TDI
06 Jetta TDI
Really? Have you done it yourself? And was it on a track that has the first 330' or so saturated in VHT?

My tires are the ones my car came with, so they are hard as pucks. Do you think the VHT will soak in enough to make any difference, besides having the gravel and cigarette butts stick to my tires when I'm heading out of the pits?

Thanks!
 
Joined
Mar 22, 2007
Location
sonoma,ca
TDI
'03 golf, ran 14.62@93.13 on 3/21/07 on biodiesel
nhra

when nhra drag races come here I've run the week following, it makes a huge difference.. They soak the track with it for big numbers. It works.
as I said it wont hurt you to try it.
 

woofie2

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Location
Republic of Southern Illinois
TDI
Former TDI owner
a friend had a patented mixture of denatured alcohol, blueberry pancake syrup, molasses and water, which made his tires very sticky for a launch, but did not soften the rubber.

he put it on a rag so that someone could wipe the tires after a burnout and before takeoff.
 

jetta-girl

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Joined
Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
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06 Jetta TDI
Sticky, not slippery?
Are you trying to fool me???:confused:

Last weekend at Mission, I had pretty good traction. Well, at least better. The track was a bit warmer than the tracks were at my last two races. I did alright, good enough to tie for first place in overall points so far. :D
 

woofie2

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Location
Republic of Southern Illinois
TDI
Former TDI owner
jetta-girl said:
Last weekend at Mission, I had pretty good traction. Well, at least better. The track was a bit warmer than the tracks were at my last two races. I did alright, good enough to tie for first place in overall points so far. :D
hahah, I can here the ribbing in the pits already,

"Dude, you not only got beat by a Girl, but she was driving a Diesel.....":D
Sorry I hang out at Southern RedNeck Tracks, Where they thought I was crazy for wanting to get a Time sheet on my car to track my Mod progress.
 

jetta-girl

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Location
WA
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06 Jetta TDI
woofie2 said:
hahah, I can here the ribbing in the pits already,

"Dude, you not only got beat by a Girl, but she was driving a Diesel.....":D
Sorry I hang out at Southern RedNeck Tracks, Where they thought I was crazy for wanting to get a Time sheet on my car to track my Mod progress.
Yeah, they usually give each other a hard time over it. Even the announcers in the tower think it's funny when a VW takes out a big truck. Of course, I'm not necessarily faster than them, I bracket race.

I think time sheets are so much easier to track what your mods are doing for you. I've only dynoed my car once and can't understand how that is indicative of real life driving. Racing isn't real life either, but I understand it more than I understand dynoing.

I don't know what to think about putting molasses or syrup on my tires. I guess I'm hoping that with the warmer weather, my traction problems will get a bit better. We will see.

Thanks for your help, guys!!:D
 

222

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Joined
May 2, 2007
Location
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TDI
tba
Do you "air down" your tires to help traction? You can experiment with lowering your air pressure in the front tires, if you haven't already...

I had a friend try the VHT on his tires...didn't seem to make a difference...

What kind of 60' times do you get?
 

jetta-girl

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Joined
Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
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06 Jetta TDI
222 said:
Do you "air down" your tires to help traction? You can experiment with lowering your air pressure in the front tires, if you haven't already...

I had a friend try the VHT on his tires...didn't seem to make a difference...

What kind of 60' times do you get?
Airing down regular street tires will actually cause them to cup in. Leaving less contact area. I did try it, before I found out about the cupping in, and it didn't do much.

I'm glad to hear about someone spraying the VHT on the tires, it makes sense that it wouldn't make a difference since the tracks are so saturated with the stuff. But, I wanted to know from someone who has done it. Or, in this case, someone who knows someone who has done it.;)

My 60' times are usually 2.5 to 2.7 on a particularly slippery launch.

Sounds like I just need to get better/softer tires. Any suggestions?
 

222

New member
Joined
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Location
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TDI
tba
jetta-girl said:
Airing down regular street tires will actually cause them to cup in. Leaving less contact area. I did try it, before I found out about the cupping in, and it didn't do much.

I'm glad to hear about someone spraying the VHT on the tires, it makes sense that it wouldn't make a difference since the tracks are so saturated with the stuff. But, I wanted to know from someone who has done it. Or, in this case, someone who knows someone who has done it.;)

My 60' times are usually 2.5 to 2.7 on a particularly slippery launch.

Sounds like I just need to get better/softer tires. Any suggestions?
Regarding cupping...a good method of finding the right air pressure is to try airing them down in 1 psi increments and spinning the tires on dry pavement...look at the marks and you should be able to tell when you still have a decent contact patch...when you notice the inside of the tire not making contact anymore, go up to the previous psi when the contact patch was still good....

What size/profile are the tires? I'm a newbie here (thinking about getting a tdi...I had a 1980 diesel rabbit many, many, moons ago....)... I used to drag race a 5 litre Mustang.

If you used a "taller" profile tire, I think it wouldn't tend to "cup" as easily. The sidewall would wrinkle at a lower air pressure, instead of the tread face cupping. It takes a lot of testing to get the optimum air pressure in your tires.

Will a cheap pair of steel rims of a smaller diameter with a taller profile tire fit on your car?

You don't want to have overall tire diameter too much taller than stock, because then you would be changing the effective gear ratio...but then again, with a diesel and the torque it produces, this may not affect your times as bad as it would on a gasoline car, which would bog off the line easier....

When I ran at the track on regular radials I used BFG Radial TA's...On those regular non drag radials, my best 60' was in the 1.8's. Keep in mind, this was on a rear drive car, which transfers the weight to the back tires on launch. My ET was in the 12.5's back then.

I moved up to drag radials later and my best 60' was a 1.59. I eventually ran a best ET of 10.78 on the drag radials.

Drag radials would be your best bet, IMHO...but if you can't afford them yet, see if you could fit the steel rims/taller profile tires in your budget..perhaps look for a used set...Up here in Canada (eh!) some import racers even have used winter tires, as they're made with softer compound rubber.

Have you "pedalled" the car when you launch it? (ie, not just hammer the gas, but try to just give enough power not to spin the tires, then maybe tromp on it after you get into 2nd gear...)

The best advice is to practice, practice practice...especially when bracket racing..consistency is what wins...

(sorry for the length of my reply.....I get excited talking about drag racing....)
 

HO'OLAKO

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2006
Stay away from a dyno till you rebuild your motor. Spend this winter putting custom gearing in your car. I promise you, you will like it! Sounds like your enjoying the ride. You can talk about hp-tq no# all day. Your getting experience and that my friend will win everytime. Whatever you do don't post your times here. Let them come to the track to see your effort. Your racing now, what you do and how you set your car up is your business. I don't know what you have so if we ever meet you can bet I will have to be ready to beat you. Great job!
 

jetta-girl

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
TDI
06 Jetta TDI
222 said:
Regarding cupping...a good method of finding the right air pressure is to try airing them down in 1 psi increments and spinning the tires on dry pavement...look at the marks and you should be able to tell when you still have a decent contact patch...when you notice the inside of the tire not making contact anymore, go up to the previous psi when the contact patch was still good....

What size/profile are the tires? I'm a newbie here (thinking about getting a tdi...I had a 1980 diesel rabbit many, many, moons ago....)... I used to drag race a 5 litre Mustang.

If you used a "taller" profile tire, I think it wouldn't tend to "cup" as easily. The sidewall would wrinkle at a lower air pressure, instead of the tread face cupping. It takes a lot of testing to get the optimum air pressure in your tires.

Will a cheap pair of steel rims of a smaller diameter with a taller profile tire fit on your car?

You don't want to have overall tire diameter too much taller than stock, because then you would be changing the effective gear ratio...but then again, with a diesel and the torque it produces, this may not affect your times as bad as it would on a gasoline car, which would bog off the line easier....

When I ran at the track on regular radials I used BFG Radial TA's...On those regular non drag radials, my best 60' was in the 1.8's. Keep in mind, this was on a rear drive car, which transfers the weight to the back tires on launch. My ET was in the 12.5's back then.

I moved up to drag radials later and my best 60' was a 1.59. I eventually ran a best ET of 10.78 on the drag radials.

Drag radials would be your best bet, IMHO...but if you can't afford them yet, see if you could fit the steel rims/taller profile tires in your budget..perhaps look for a used set...Up here in Canada (eh!) some import racers even have used winter tires, as they're made with softer compound rubber.

Have you "pedalled" the car when you launch it? (ie, not just hammer the gas, but try to just give enough power not to spin the tires, then maybe tromp on it after you get into 2nd gear...)

The best advice is to practice, practice practice...especially when bracket racing..consistency is what wins...

(sorry for the length of my reply.....I get excited talking about drag racing....)
Thanks for the reply, I don't mind the length at all. This sort of knowledge is hard for me to find. Since I race the big trucks, they launch in 4WD and can't really advise me on launching in 2WD. The other car racers that are at the track don't really give me the time of day, since I'm with the trucks. Apparently a lot of racers don't like the soot left behind by the trucks, something about traction.
So, what I'm trying to say, is I really appreciate all the help I can get, I'll take what you have said into consideration.:)
 

jetta-girl

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Joined
Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
TDI
06 Jetta TDI
HO'OLAKO said:
Stay away from a dyno till you rebuild your motor. Spend this winter putting custom gearing in your car. I promise you, you will like it! Sounds like your enjoying the ride. You can talk about hp-tq no# all day. Your getting experience and that my friend will win everytime. Whatever you do don't post your times here. Let them come to the track to see your effort. Your racing now, what you do and how you set your car up is your business. I don't know what you have so if we ever meet you can bet I will have to be ready to beat you. Great job!
Thank you for the kind words of support! Reading your post really made my day. I am really enjoying my car, and seeing what I can do with it performance wise. And, it's working for me in the bracket racing world, anyways;) . I'm currently tied for first in my class and on May 12th I'll be in Medford, Oregon trying to hang on to that position.

Wish me luck! And, again, thanks for your kind words!:D
 

jetta-girl

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Feb 24, 2006
Location
WA
TDI
06 Jetta TDI
Where do you get the gears? Is there someone you would recommend?
And, one more question...Do you know if anyone makes a limited slip?

Thanks!
 

gtmotor

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Location
AZ
TDI
98 Beetle
Tires make the most difference (for the least amount of money) in any form of racing.

I highly suggest a pair of drag radials. If they are DOT approved you can drive to the track on them without getting in trouble (just go easy on them).

Make sure they are at the right pressures and a small burnout would probably help to put some heat in them. I've had pretty good luck with the BFGoodrich g-Force T/A drag radials in the past. I haven't been down the 1320 in years though... it's all autocross and road courses for me now ;)

Another tip is to increase the tire pressure of the REAR tires. This will reduce the rolling resistance of the car and let you get off the line a bit better.
 
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