Spongy Break pedal...I used dot 3 break fluid would this make my reservoir start leaking

phawkins224

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2011
Location
Forest, Va
TDI
2003 Jetta
2003 Jetta TDI 210,000 replaces rear calipers, new break pads front and rear, replaced one break line on right rear....bled all lines pedal is tight until car is started up then seems spongy. Looks to be leaking at master cylinder where plastic reservoir....
 

Mongler98

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2011
Location
COLORADO (SE of Denver)
TDI
98 Jetta TDI AHU 1.9L (944 TDI swap in progress) I moved so now i got nothing but an AHU in a garage on a pallet.
No. Impossible for new fluid to cause issues.
It feels firm even though its leaking when off because no booster assistance. Good news is your booster is fine.
The problem is that you cant have soft pedal till issues past the resiviour. The plastic leaking is not the issue here. If the master is leaking replace or rebuild it.
Get a new master and use the old resiviour or buy a new one.
Their are 2 rubber seals that the nipples of the reservoir seat into. These are leaking.
Maybe you can rebuild it. I'm all for rebuilding them. Easy to do but I'm not sure if the rebuild kits come with those parts.
 

Tdijarhead

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Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Location
Lawrenceville PA
TDI
2003 TDI Jetta Daughters Car, 2001 TDI Beetle, Wife’s car, 2005 Golf TDI Mine, all 5 spds
You’ll need to flush the Dot 3 out and replace it with the proper Dot 4 and then see what you have. If the resivor is leaking you can get a used one from the junkyard.
 

Metal Man

Vendor
Joined
Sep 29, 2001
Location
Sunbury,PA 17801
TDI
1998 NB TDI, 2006 Jetta TDI, 2014 Tiguan gas, , 2019 E Golf X2
Yes, it should be DOT 4. Has anyone ever noticed a difference with using DOT 3? New pads can be spongy at first. As long as they appear to be functioning drive it for a week (cautiously at first) and report back.
 

Mongler98

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2011
Location
COLORADO (SE of Denver)
TDI
98 Jetta TDI AHU 1.9L (944 TDI swap in progress) I moved so now i got nothing but an AHU in a garage on a pallet.
The difference in dot# means only two things. Boiling point wet and dry and and how long it takes to get there.
Dot 3 is fine for now. Flush with the highest boiling point you can afford. Motul 5 is epic and only thing I use now that I'm down to 3 cans of blue ate.
 

CableJockey

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 20, 2019
Location
South Dakota
TDI
2002 Golf GLS
The difference in dot# means only two things.
Not quite true.
White there is a difference in boiling points it is not the only thing...

Brake fluid "wet" boiling points from an old textbook:
DOT3 140C (284F);
DOT4 155C (311F);
Super DOT4 195C (383F);
DOT5 185C (364F);
DOT 5.1 185C (365F).

The increase in DOT # is based on the order they were developed and approved for use in cars (ie US Dept. Of Transportation, and the "version", if you will)

DOT "1"& 2, I believe were forms of mineral oil blends with issues in braking systems, thus no longer used.
DOT 3 & 4 are glycol based, but DOT 4 includes the addition of elastomeric borate-esters, which changes the boiling point and lubricating properties, specifically developed for use with ESP and ABS systems in mind.
DOT 5 is silicone-based and is incompatible with prior fluids, as well as ABS/ESP systems and many types of rubber brake lines. It was developed as an alternative that would not absorb moisture, thus retaining the 'dry' boiling point. (typically used in power-sports or racing applications)
DOT 5.1 was developed due to DOT 5's shortcomings. It is considered the "non-silicone" version of DOT 5, despite the official definition requiring "less than 70% silicone" . It contains some portion of glycol base, which makes it much more compatible with ABS/ESP while maintaining many of the benefits of DOT 5.

The differing blends of chemicals in each type of fluid makes it a bad idea to mix them (especially DOT 5, which supposedly has a corrosive reaction with glycol based fluids) At the very least, mixing reduces the service life, but it can also dramatically swing boiling points depending on quantities involved.

Flushing the brake system completely of any old fluid and going up in DOT #, usually doesn't cause problems if the system is inspected for compatibility, but the benefits are usually quite low unless the use-case of the vehicle has skewed from what was intended (ie Racing) . However, going down can cause problems: from boiling fluid, to system damage (ABS/ESP), to metal and seal incompatibility (swelling and corrosion), etc....

The easiest method is to stick with what the manufacturer recommends: they spec'd the fluid for a reason. DOT 3 was industry standard until ~2006. So if a car deviated from the standard prior to then, it was likely for a good reason....

EDIT: From Wikipedia - DOT Standard for brake fluids
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 116 (FMVSS 116) regulates motor vehicle brake fluids in the United States. Like all other Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, FMVSS 116 is administered by the United States Department of Transportation's National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.

This standard specifies requirements for fluids for use in hydraulic brake systems of motor vehicles, containers for these fluids, and labeling of the containers. The purpose is to reduce failures in hydraulic braking systems of motor vehicles which may occur becuse of the manufacture or use of improper or contaminated fluid. The standard applies to all fluid use of passenger cars, multipurpose passenger vehicles, trucks, buses, trailers and motorcycles equipped with a hydraulic brake system.[1]
 
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Mongler98

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2011
Location
COLORADO (SE of Denver)
TDI
98 Jetta TDI AHU 1.9L (944 TDI swap in progress) I moved so now i got nothing but an AHU in a garage on a pallet.
Yes I know. I'm trying to talk with generalities for OP so he does not have to worry about mistakenly putting in dot 3 vs 4
Use shampoo like they do in Cuba, see if I care.
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
When I first got my 1st TDI in'99, I used DOT5, figuring it was just better, Wrong Answer. Dot4 is what goes in the VW, DOT3 is similar enough to not worry, plus you're supposed to do a full flush every 3 years anyway. My Honda (2011) uses 3, flush every 2 years.
This is not the cause of your soft pedal. Hopefully that cleared up after a few drives. If not, inspect the hardware, re-bleed.
 
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