Show 'n' Shine results

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Stealth TDI

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That's what the "People's Choice" award accomplishes. The judges use a checksheet with specific criteria. Perhaps "the people" can do the same. But I doubt most would take the time to actually JUDGE each car beyond a simple look and first impression... and they certainly wouldn't consider the car's odometer. The garage queens would rule. Perhaps "People's Choice" can have three places instead of just one. Hell, make it five places and toss out the rest of the judging! ;) I'm fully capable of going home emptyhanded without whining about it. :rolleyes:
 

Rob Mayercik

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Hamsterdiesel said:
We could do what they do at the BIG car shows - take a photo of the car as it enters the show area. Make the person stop, get their registration#, take the pic. That way we'd have it for our records.
I don't know, I think the entries into the show area are a little ad-hoc for that to work (and I think quarters would have been a little tight to get a good shot without background clutter this year).

Maybe an easier solution would be to have a designated photographer roam around and get the shots during the show proper. He/she/they could either follow the judges around or run independently.

As for matching registration # to photo, I just had an idea that would draw from the Lug Nut's pint glass idea - how about a plastic replica of a Euro Plate, emblazoned with the Fest Logo for the year, the registration number, and the screen name? It could be set up on a cardboard "easel" like a desktop business card holder, right in front of/below the front bumper of the car, so it'd be in the picture for IDing winner's cars. You could even omit the screen name, and put the registration number in bigger font. You get a commemerative(sp?) item -wouldn't a TDIFest Euro Plate make a neat wall hanging for the cubicle wall? - and something that helps to ID the vehicle for award purposes. Make the "plate number" a hyphenated combo of the year and the reg. number, and you're all set. For example, my reg. number was 469 this year. My show-and-shine "euro plate" number could have been 2009-469.

They could be simple thin plastic, like the dummy plates dealers stick on unsold cars in the lot to fill up the plate locations -it'd only have to look like a Euro plate.

The plates should be supplied with only the Fest logo and the "2009-" (substitute appropriate year) and the registraton numbers provided as stick-ons (make it part of the "goody bag" - participants must assemble their plate as well as fill out the traditional sheet). Could it work?

(Edit) I should clarify which logo I was referring to - I was thinking the one from the circular part of the Fest pin, wth the U.S. Capitol on it. Nothing against the official logo, but I think the pin's design would look better on the "plate".
 
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kromicacid

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petea4 said:
I guess you didn't notice the 4x4 stance with the funky tailights of the 1st place Golf, or the 2nd placed interior which was highlighted with pink neon tubes? Or where to start on that blue MK5 Jetta? :eek: All owned by "mature" people. So in your opinion, where was the rice?
That Graphite Blue MK5 was mine, and I am only 28 years old... All of my mods are 'factory' available, just not available from the 'factory' in the US... (other than RC1+, Frostheater, Tint, and smoked turn signals).

Keeping the car clean means alot to me, and it seems the judges also. I think that is more of the reason of winning, and the simplicity of things.

I have felt that all of my mods are tasteful and not rice-y. Please start about my car... i would like to hear...
 
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Lug_Nut

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Rob Mayercik said:
I just had an idea that would draw from the Lug Nut's pint glass idea -
That was SunRG in post 51, but I'll take credit if it is adopted for next 'fest and is a big hit. If it's a flop, I had nothing to do with it.


and now my rant:
There are apparently a lot of disgruntled exhibitors with "not complaining, but..." suggestions and advice to offer (force on) the judges. I hope next year's organizers keep this in mind as they consider events to incorporate in their version of TDIFest.
I'd be of the opinion, after reading through this thread, that an un-judged car display area would have some merit. Anonymous 'People's choice' ballots can be passed out to spectators, but no individual judges that can be singled out for wrathful venting and whining about "mine is better than his/hers!"
Your car should please YOU. If the judges don't like the rust holes you accepted in return for a dirt cheap purchase price, TOUGH! If the judges can't color co-ordinate when they get dressed in the morning without matching up little animals embroidered on their shirts and pants, Don't expect them to appreciate the contrasting harmony of the hand stitched leather door panel inserts you paid dearly to get.
If you want a trophy that badly, build the car the JUDGE wants.


(or just put an HHR SS sticker on the back for another 10 points:D )
 
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tomo366

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VeeDubTDI said:
Riced out from the factory! Classic! ;)
By the way this discussion is supposed to be about the TDICLUB Show and Shine.......Not about my "Factory HHR SS"" which is for sale by the way........
The TDI Club Show and Shine is Fred's baby and he decides how the Cars are Judged the Check list is the guide.......and the calculated points decide the the winners.........
 

Lug_Nut

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If it didn't bother you so much we'd soon tire of no response to our HHR trolling and would fixate on something and someone else.
But as long is it works, or until your next TDI is in,....
 

tomo366

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By the way it doesn't bother me........I could care less! Want to race?
And you won't have to worry about me judging next year........I will be showing the winning A5 Jetta Sportwagen.
Tastefully modded of course ;)

By the way my VW Vortex comment does not necessarily apply to most here........There were some very nice cars!!
not everybody can win.
 

GTDI4

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petea4 said:
I guess you didn't notice the 4x4 stance with the funky tailights of the 1st place Golf, or the 2nd placed interior which was highlighted with pink neon tubes? Or where to start on that blue MK5 Jetta? :eek: All owned by "mature" people. So in your opinion, where was the rice?

Pete
"4x4 stance" The car has the stock springs, The tires are not. I had lower the car (mid-life crisis), but I became tired of the car bottoming out. It was the worst in Vt. about every mile sparks flying every where. Hey if you like to lower yours I will more than happy to sale the the springs to you.
As for the funky tail lights (another mid-life crisis), after putting them on I agree with you (got a lot of flak at work to). But I was to lazy take them back off. Was going to go with smoked but I want cars to see me at night when they come flying down the Highway( dark lights on black car no-go).
 
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Stealth TDI

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Acid,

kromicacid said:
That Graphite Blue MK5 was mine... Please start about my car... i would like to hear...
The problem with your car is it's BLUE and CLEAN... and, uh, BLUE. ;) Actually, I thought it was a sharp car... as was the other MKV. I'm not sure why anyone's tossing stones. :confused: Perhaps you can post pictures or a link that shows your mods? I'll bet the score came down to a matter of points.

Take Care,

Scott
 

GTDI4

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The rules were posted for the show and shine, so what's with the complains? They are diff from other shows. You should read them or ask if you don't understand them.
 

tomo366

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People complain about the S&S results every year.........it is inevitable!! as are the complaints about location and how the Fest is run.....
I for one had a great time as I always do! Just wish my primary car was a TDI and I wouldn't have to listen to any more BS about my CAR.
 

GTDI4

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tomo366 said:
People complain about the S&S results every year.........it is inevitable!! as are the complaints about location and how the Fest is run.....
I for one had a great time as I always do! Just wish my primary car was a TDI and I wouldn't have to listen to any more BS about my CAR.
Just having fun with you :D .
 

G60ING

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I love how the HHRs look. If they had VW engineering and a VW engine I'd buy one in a heartbeat.

People that have issues with the Judging should volunteer to judge at a large car show and see how difficult it is. I judged at Waterfest a couple years back and it was very tough to judge the various MK3 classes I had. There were many well modded cars. The key is to use the score sheets with judged catagories and let the stats speak. There was one Jetta there that was not done in the euro/vortex theme/style but rather a more japanese flavor. The car was done very well with a lot of attention to detail and quality work. The car placed well (3rd) in a class of 10+ cars.
 

VeeDubTDI

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The issue here is not with the judges, but with the criteria that they are judging with. I don't understand exactly how Fred has the S&S laid out, but from the way it was explained to me, it seems like they are only judging based on condition and cleanliness... the shinier, the better. There is also the mileage category to make it fair for the older cars.

With the current arrangement, the 337/20th will get zero extra points for the very unique OEM+ mods that are done to it. If it's not gleaming, you're not winning.

It's always good to change things up from time to time. Perhaps it's time to consider some alternative scoring options. Kindly offer some suggestions on how you would score the Show & Shine if you were in charge of it. Fred will look at the suggestions, and may or may not implement some or all of them. It's his deal... and I'll leave it at that. :)
 

Rob Mayercik

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Lug_Nut said:
That was SunRG in post 51, but I'll take credit if it is adopted for next 'fest and is a big hit. If it's a flop, I had nothing to do with it.
Whoops - must have missed SunRG's post. (sorry 'bout that, Chief!)

As far as your rant, I hope I didn't come across as one of the "disgruntled exhibitors" - I was just tossing an observation of mine into the ring for discussion as a possible reason why more folks don't participate.
 

VeeDubTDI

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I think we had a good number of participants this year. You have to remember that a lot of people don't want to spend time polishing every square inch of their cars... also, quite a few people went into town to sightsee on Sunday. Overall, I think the S&S turnout was pretty good, when compared to previous years and keeping in mind that a lot of people wanted to go sightseeing.
 

petea4

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kromicacid said:
That Graphite Blue MK5 was mine, and I am only 28 years old... All of my mods are 'factory' available,............

I have felt that all of my mods are tasteful and not rice-y. Please start about my car... i would like to hear...



Not yours, the other one. I'm sure everone saw the Jetta with the Chicken wire grill. :eek:
I think it's time to clear the air. I started posting my comments after people starting pointing fingers to the younger "vortex" guys, for the rice'd out cars. I stated what i saw, which shows those statements were FALSE! Examples stated(which i didn't want to do) show the opposite! :p

I don't care that i didn't get anything for showing. Car is looking its age with stone chips, and rust. Didn't expect anything. What bothered me was the lessons learned from last years fest, were not implemented into this years show. ex. Judge interaction with exhibitor.

Nobody knows where they stand within their class. They don't know where they can improve, where the issues were, as the judges didnt point out the problem areas, or the great points. Why walk around the car clipboard in hand, mute? I don't understand this.

Which explains this comment earlier:

Rob Mayercik said:
Is it possible to request a copy of the scoring sheets on one's own vehicle? I'd like to see where I was lacking compared to the rest of my division. I'll likely never be able to compete with the guys sporting fancy rims/tires, lots of performance mods, and 5-clay-bar-a-week habits, but that didn't stop me from showing anyway this year or back in '06 (and, likely, won't stop me the next time I get to a 'Fest, whenever that happens to be).

The other thing I'd like to know for my own edification would be where I ranked overall in the class (6th out of 12, 15th out of 15, etc.). Even if it was, as I suspect, dead last or nearly so, I'd still like to know. Back channel, of course; I'm not THAT much of a glutton for punishment that I want to take my lumps in public.

One has to know what one's weaknesses are in order to maximize improvement for next time, you know.
Pete

Sorry, hit edit instead of quote. -Lawson
 
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VeeDubTDI

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petea4 said:
I don't care that i didn't get anything for showing. Car is looking its age with stone chips, and rust. Didn't expect anything. What bothered me was the lessons learned from last years fest, were not implemented into this years show. ex. Judge interaction with exhibitor.

Nobody knows where they stand within their class. They don't know where they can improve, where the issues were, as the judges didnt point out the problem areas, or the great points. Why walk around the car clipboard in hand, mute? I don't understand this.
I agree with this 100%. Some judge interaction and post-S&S feedback would be really nice. That would allow people to make improvements based on this particular set of criteria.

Unfortunately, the S&S is run independently from the Fest, and the Fest planners have very little say in how it is operated. I tried, but didn't make it very far. Perhaps if more people express interest in having a particular portion of the S&S revamped, it will happen.
 

GTDI4

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VeeDubTDI said:
I think we had a good number of participants this year. You have to remember that a lot of people don't want to spend time polishing every square inch of their cars... also, quite a few people went into town to sightsee on Sunday. Overall, I think the S&S turnout was pretty good, when compared to previous years and keeping in mind that a lot of people wanted to go sightseeing.
Remember other shows a big part is how clean the car is. Some take as far as to check under mats and seats, cars jacked up with mirrors to show how clean the underside is. At those shows I see alot of cars trailer to the shows.
TDI club really want to go there?
 
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GTDI4

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VeeDubTDI said:
The issue here is not with the judges, but with the criteria that they are judging with. I don't understand exactly how Fred has the S&S laid out, but from the way it was explained to me, it seems like they are only judging based on condition and cleanliness... the shinier, the better. There is also the mileage category to make it fair for the older carsWith the current arrangement, the 337/20th will get zero extra points for the very unique OEM+ mods that are done to it. If it's not gleaming, you're not winning.

Again any show if it is not gleaming your'e not winning.
 

Lug_Nut

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They are judges, not coaches.
This is a final exam, and you should have done your homework, not waited until you walked into the test site and asked the proctor for the answers.
You are competing against other exhibitors, ask THEM what they like or don't about your car. Don't trust the reply from the guy in your class? Ask someone from a different class. Ask a former judge if you know one.
DO NOT HASSLE THE JUDGES DURING JUDGING!

Score sheets are sometimes available for view after the awards, and I agree with that practice, but these score sheets are not subject to editing, or re-count, or do-over. The results are final.
There's next show to make improvement.
 

petea4

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^^^^Didn’t realize this was the TDIclub’s version of Peble Beach. :p

I’ve been to shows in LA, Vegas, Florida, Indy, Atl, Mich, MD, Ontario, and Germany. Never before have I met mute judges. The aircooled world has it’s fair share of trailer queens too. If you ever get a chance to be in Cali during the month of June, check out THE CLASSIC. Unbelievable show.


So, I think we have come to the conclusion, the Mature/Older crowd brought the ricer mods to TDIFEST2009. :eek: :D

The younger vwvortexer's were A-OK........ :cool:

VeeDubTDI said:
I agree with this 100%. Some judge interaction and post-S&S feedback would be really nice. That would allow people to make improvements based on this particular set of criteria.
Preach on Lawson! :D

This has turned into a lively thread. :)

Pete
 
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Lug_Nut

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At the judges briefings for the shows I've judged I've been told to remain impartial, to not comment on the cars I was judging so as to not appear to be impartial, to not touch the car, to not discuss the relative merit I put on any one car over another, to, as it was put, be mute. And no smirking, no tsk-tsk-ing, no facial or visual cues either to indicate opinion.
At some malt-shoppe impromptu gathering it might be fine for the judges to offer their opinion, but that was not permitted at the level of the shows I was asked to judge. No, not Pebble Beach level, but the entrants and the staff were taking just as seriously. Once I witnessed too seriously when a judge muttered, loud enough that I also heard, "Now that's just stupid" and the car's owner took offense and then took offensive action.
That comment that day went far beyond constructive criticism, but at what point does criticism become a "dope slap"? Easy enough to avoid that entirely with silent, emotionless judges.


And the judges, as well as entrants, always knew who trailered in, who trailered to within 5 miles to pretend that they drove, and who had the daily drivers that almost invariably won over the queens.
 
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Hamsterdiesel

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petea4 said:
I guess you didn't notice the 4x4 stance with the funky tailights of the 1st place Golf, or the 2nd placed interior which was highlighted with pink neon tubes? ...

Pete
I'm sure you are familiar with the pitiful excuse for a trunk light that the Golf came with from the factory. So I added some lights so I could see into my trunk at night. They worked so well, I decided to have fun and added the second row which is colored instead of white. I hardly think that qualifies as 'riced'. :rolleyes:

Now if I had the cold cathodes underneath the car for everyone to see, serving no purpose other than to draw attention to myself, well then that's rice...

...and just who are you calling mature?!:p
 
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Hamsterdiesel

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GTDI4 said:
And you won't have to worry about me judging next year........I will be showing the winning A5 Jetta Sportwagen.
Tastefully modded of course ;)
Yeah! Woo- hoo!
...
...
..
.
D'oh!:D
 

Hamsterdiesel

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Well, I think it's time for you to get another car... you've riced this one beyond repair...better start over...LOL...:D ;)
 
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