Roll-your-own controller for Bosch VE pumps?

nicklockard

Torque Dorque
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
Location
Arizona
TDI
SOLD 2010 Touareg Tdi w/factory Tow PCKG
Nice work Rolt. So it seems as if you've basically created and applied a transform by your ratiometric approach. Seems logical. Possible the ECU uses mathematical transforms on both input (reading position) and output (commanding)? And they might be different transforms.
 

Rolt

Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2021
Location
Tennessee
TDI
1.9
486--I haven't been able to find fuel maps, so I've been doing all this work blind. Nevertheless, the behavior of the pump on my workbench is repeatable. If we turn off the PID control and set the PWM to certain fixed values, I can manually nudge the IQ shaft under power and then watch it stay in that position anywhere from, say, 65% to 90% IQ. In other words, the PWM (or equivalent DC voltage) isn't deterministic for IQ position in that range. I guess the IQ motor torque increases at about the same rate as the return spring force, and a little bit of friction in the pivot makes up the difference.

Nick--The system only divides the IQ position sensor output voltage by the sensor coil excitation voltage. Since the sensor output voltage is approximately proportional to the excitation voltage, this makes the IQ position sensor less sensitive to the voltage fluctuations. Otherwise, every time we flipped on the fan or high-beams, the electrical load would drop the voltage and it would blip the throttle. My approach isn't perfect but better than nothing.

The command to the IQ servomotor comes from the PID, which actively changes the width of the power pulses to the motor. This drives the difference between the commanded IQ position and the IQ sensor measurement to zero. It's fun to run the system through a series of commanded positions and watch the controller figure out how to make it happen. Last week, I wasn't able to control the IQ position manually above ~50% with a knob on the PWM, but the closed-loop control reacts way faster than I can and it has no trouble getting the position to the commanded value.
 

Rolt

Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2021
Location
Tennessee
TDI
1.9
The electronics are coming together. I transferred the circuit design from the solderless breadboards to these handy little protoboards and cleaned up the routing to make a reasonably compact package for driving and reading the IQ position sensor. The LH board produces a sinewave and the RH board amplifies it and measures the RMS amplitudes. Note: The 2nd stage of the amplifier isn't shown since it's on a separate heat-sink.

 

Rolt

Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2021
Location
Tennessee
TDI
1.9
Next on the list: I need to figure out how to control the turbo and the injection advance.

***Turbo***
I'm not sure that I even have the part that controls the vacuum actuator for the VNT. II's looking likely that I'll need to relocate the turbo because it interferes with the passenger-side wheel-well in this swap. I'd be open to using an AHU turbo or something else that has a flange instead of trying to surgically extract the ALH turbo from the manifold. I'm not searching after big power on this project, but I'm open to ideas about how to control the turbo and also would happily take recommendations for turbos to consider.

***Advance***
Any ideas about what the input to the advance is supposed to look like? After doing some tests to understand the pinout of the pump connector, this is what I found so far:

Pin Description
1 IQ sensor coil excitation
2. IQ sensor output
3 IQ sensor coil excitation
4 Fuel temp sensor
5 Power or ground to injection quantity motor
6 Power or ground to injection quantity motor
7 Fuel temp sensor
8 Fuel shut-off solenoid valve
9 Injection advance (??)
10 Injection advance (??)

The polarity on pins 1/2 make no difference to the operation that I can discern. I'm not sure if the 3/4 pins have anything to do with the advance, maybe a sensor?. The 9/10 wires do appear to head to the bottom of the pump to do something related to the advance. It'd be great to get some insights about what's going on at pins 4, 7, 9, and 10.
 
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Fix_Until_Broke

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 8, 2004
Location
Menomonee Falls, Wisconsin, USA
TDI
03 Jetta, 03 TT TDI
There's an N75 valve that modulates vacuum to the diaphragm that moves variable vanes on the turbo. The EGR valve is practically the same thing from my understanding. More current = more vacuum = vanes closed more = higher exhaust pressures.

What is the application you're going in and what are your goals for the engine/powertrain. There are lots of turbo options. An AHU turbo doesn't have variable geometry so much less to control/less complicated controls there.

Regarding the pinout - here's the diagram from the Bentley manual and a functional description below


 

Rolt

Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2021
Location
Tennessee
TDI
1.9
Thanks for the diagram. I checked pins 4 and 7. Relative to the pump diagram, they do connect to the top and bottom ends of the temp sensor, respectively. I've gone back and updated the pinout in the previous post to reflect that. This leaves pins 9 and 10 as the control of the injection advance. Are there any clues about that in the diagram?

Regarding the turbo: This is going into a 2nd gen 4wd 4runner. After heading down this weird path, I'd be happy to get the stock 90 hp at this point, but if things work out, it'd be nice to have enough turbo later on to see if we could bump that up by 25% or so. There are enough complicating issues in this project that I'd be glad to consider turbos with pressure-actuated wastegates. On the other hand, I do have plenty of PWM outputs to play with, so there's nothing preventing the use of a more sophisticated turbo.
 

BL Perf

New member
Joined
Feb 14, 2023
Location
France
TDI
1.9 TDI

Hi,

I am very interested in this development that I would like to resume or continue.

Only, the site http://dmn.kuulalaakeri.org/dmn-edc/ does not respond.

Does anyone have a solution for contacting the developer, someone who worked on the project, or even recovering data?

Thank you
 

markdave

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 13, 2023
Location
amesterdam
TDI
tdi 1.6
do you think VW/Bosch are using a Fast Fourier Transform Nox Vidmate VLC to pluck the appropriate signals from apparent noise? Ignore if side-tracking.
 
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BL Perf

New member
Joined
Feb 14, 2023
Location
France
TDI
1.9 TDI
do you think VW/Bosch are using a Fast Fourier Transform Nox Vidmate VLC to pluck the appropriate signals from apparent noise? Ignore if side-tracking.
Good morning,

I apologize if my understanding of English is not perfect, but even using Google Trad I can't understand what you want to talk about.
 
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