Revised B4 MFA conversion article

Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Stafford Virginia 22556
TDI
96 glx variant tdi
Chris Bell said:
Did you forget to lock down all the relay panel connectors with the lock bar?
No, I'm quite sure it was secure. I really believe that I cut the oil pressure sensor wire and not the tach signal wire. When I reconnected that cut wire the oil pressure lamp went out as normal. I have no idea why that wire is not the tach signal as you said it should be. I guess I'll have to isolate that tach signal wire at the ecu and find the other end at the relay panel.
 
Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Stafford Virginia 22556
TDI
96 glx variant tdi
Another Glitch with U1/6 (Tach Signal) - Resolved

ninedee_golf_tdi said:
I spliced U1/6 into the Dakota Tach Adapter. When I started the engine I lost my oil pressure signal causing the dash red indicator light to flash continuously, and the tach did not work. .
Well.... the answer is both Chris Bell and myself are both correct. The tach signal is on U1/6 and cutting that wire will in fact turn on the oil pressure warning lamp. Why, I don't know why but it does. The solution was to putz with the Dakota Digital adapter and try different dip switch settings and the "up" and "dn" switches. Once the tach started to work correctly, the oil warning lamp did as well. Go figure.
 

dieseljunkie

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Location
New England USA
TDI
96 Passat TDI wagon
ninedee_golf_tdi said:
Well.... the answer is both Chris Bell and myself are both correct. The tach signal is on U1/6 and cutting that wire will in fact turn on the oil pressure warning lamp. Why, I don't know why but it does. The solution was to putz with the Dakota Digital adapter and try different dip switch settings and the "up" and "dn" switches. Once the tach started to work correctly, the oil warning lamp did as well. Go figure.
My guess is the tach signal is needed in the algorithm for the oil pressure (dynamic) warning system. IDI VW's has 2 oil pressure sensors (low & high) for its dynamic oil pressure warning system. Does TDI's also have 2?
 

TonyJetta

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 15, 2005
Location
Tucson, Az
TDI
'15 Jetta TDI SE / '06 Jetta TDI DSG Pkg0 / '96 Passat TDI
dieseljunkie said:
Does TDI's also have 2?
I can confirm that 1Z/AHU motors do...1 is monitored at <2k rpm the other is monitored >2k rpm. IIRC, low RPM is ~.3 bar and high RPM is ~1.5 bar.

Tony
 

RIP TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 16, 2000
Location
Santa Barbara, CA
TDI
'15 GSW SE 6MT, '01 Golf GLS 5MT, '96 Passat variant
The 1.0 bar sensor activates the buzzer and flashing warning light above 2K RPM. The 0.3 bar sensor activates only the flashing light at any RPM.

Removing the RPM signal from the cluster's oil logic circuit confuses the cluster since under normal conditions its "impossible" to have positive oil pressure @ 0 RPM. Whether this is an intended diagnostic warning for a failed tach signal @ the logic circuit or is just an unintended curiosity is anyone's guess.
 

k_harley

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 26, 2006
Location
Lowell, MA
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI, 2005 Audi S4, 1997 Audi A4 Race car, 2004 Passat TDI 6MT 4motion
Id like to clarify for others with what ninedee_golf_tdi was saying...

Put switches to 1- off 2- on 3- off 4- on
Use output #2

Worked for me!
 

dslg60

Veteran Member
Joined
May 6, 2009
Location
duluth,mn
TDI
92 1z corrado
Hi, I just skimmed through this briefly the other day so forgive me if this has been covered. I would like to do this at some point. Is a Corrado G60 MFA cluster useable? I have one left over from my swap. The Corrado was a 92 G60 with the electronic speedo. Looks exactly the same. Thanks, Jason.
 

87turboquattro

Veteran Member
Joined
May 30, 2006
Location
sw of boston
TDI
97 passat
i looked briefly in the junkyard at a passat glx.i couldn't see the air temp sensor,where is it located in the engine compartment?also,i couldn't loosen the stalks,am i missing some retaining screws?i pulled on the stalks but is didn't move.

btw,if someone is looking for an auto cluster,theres one there.i took the stick.theres some nice black leather interior.let me know,i may be able to get some stuff and ship to you.guys seems kinda reasonable.let me know what you want.i'll go w/ a list if need be.

bill
 

k_harley

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 26, 2006
Location
Lowell, MA
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI, 2005 Audi S4, 1997 Audi A4 Race car, 2004 Passat TDI 6MT 4motion
87turboquattro said:
i looked briefly in the junkyard at a passat glx.i couldn't see the air temp sensor,where is it located in the engine compartment?also,i couldn't loosen the stalks,am i missing some retaining screws?i pulled on the stalks but is didn't move.
87turboquattro said:
Thats becuase its not there ;-)

Look at the lower pass. side bumper hole

There are 3 flathead screws that hold the stalks into the steering column
 

dslg60

Veteran Member
Joined
May 6, 2009
Location
duluth,mn
TDI
92 1z corrado
quote=dslg60]Hi, I just skimmed through this briefly the other day so forgive me if this has been covered. I would like to do this at some point. Is a Corrado G60 MFA cluster useable? I have one left over from my swap. The Corrado was a 92 G60 with the electronic speedo. Looks exactly the same. Thanks, Jason.[/quote]

Anyone?
 

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Lost rear wiper/washer
So anyone with a wagon notice that they lose rear hatch wipers/washer?
New procedure to do that or is it gone? =(



Haven't completed the job yet, the parted out outside air temp sensor and wire seem to be much too short to make it to the fuse box =( I wonder how it made it to there originally.
 

k_harley

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 26, 2006
Location
Lowell, MA
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI, 2005 Audi S4, 1997 Audi A4 Race car, 2004 Passat TDI 6MT 4motion
Nah, just use the MFA switch from either a B4 GLX Wagon or GTI VR6. They both had MFA and a rear wiper. :)
 

87turboquattro

Veteran Member
Joined
May 30, 2006
Location
sw of boston
TDI
97 passat
i'll go look at my collection of stocks(i got a few extras),my stocks all came from wagons.also got 2 headlite switches w/ fogs and my original non fog switch.was a sad day when cash for clunkers.some beautiful leather passats hit the junkyard.

btw,the red/wht wire is for auto display.
 

dieseljunkie

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Location
New England USA
TDI
96 Passat TDI wagon
87turboquattro said:
i'll go look at my collection of stocks(i got a few extras),my stocks all came from wagons.also got 2 headlite switches w/ fogs and my original non fog switch.was a sad day when cash for clunkers.some beautiful leather passats hit the junkyard.

btw,the red/wht wire is for auto display.
Hi 87turboquattro, Do you have a extra MFA wiper stalk? I need one for my wagon.
 

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
What about adjusting MPG accuracy? Has anyone worked on this? DerekWhite said it's all about IQ adjustments in vagcom. But what if you need IQ to be specific due to my tune/mods? Is it small itty bitty adjustments that won't affect the true IQ just the numerical value on vagcom?

Here is something Chris said 10 years ago, WOW:eek:

Chris Bell said:
MFA MPG accuracy update:
I have finally reached my 3rd refuel since installing the MFA. The first 2 refuels were after 2 very similar driving patterns. The MFA read 8.5% optimistic for the 1st tank and 8.3% optimistic for the 2nd. While somewhat disappointed that the readings were not more accurate, I was pleased that they appeared to be consistent. I can easily mentally deduct about 4 MPG from the reading while driving to approximate the actual mileage, but the consistency of the reading is critical to using the MFA for relative readings under different driving conditions (i.e., different consumption rates).

On the 3rd tank, however, the MFA read 13.5% optimistic. This tank was after a very different driving pattern than the first 2. Needless to say, this non-linearity of the reading severely reduces the utility of the MFA.

All fillups were done at the same pump with the car oriented the same way, the same load in the car and the same vented filling procedure each time, so I am assuming that is not causing the discrepency.

The MFA's average MPH and distance readings were verified to be quite accurate on a speedometer dyno, so I don't think the problem is there. And I don't think there is an issue with the fact that this is a hybrid system; the MFA only calculates and displays the values supplied by the VSS and ECM fuel consumption signal, whether its a gas or diesel.

I assume that the ECM's fuel consumption signal is the culprit. I had a 1.8T gas Passat (B5) for awhile and its MFA read about 6% optimistic on a consistent basis, so I think my TDI's MFA accuracy (under some circumstances, at least) is probably within the range of normal, but I don't know if the signal's non-linearity is normal for a diesel ECM or there is a problem.

I'm guessing its normal and that the schema used to interpret fuel consumption values from the various inputs reaching the ECM on a diesel is not as robust as that for a gas engine. The fact that the first 2 readings showed linear integrity under similar dynamic conditions while the 3rd reading deviated under very different conditions gives weight to that argument.

Then again, maybe there is an erratic input signal used to generate the consumption output signal that isn't read by OBD; who knows? Very disappointing in either case.
 

psst1997

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Joined
Aug 14, 2006
Location
Kentucky
TDI
90 Corrado G60, 90 Corrado 3.6, 92 Corrado VR6, 97 Passat TDI, 2005 Jetta TDI, 2006 Touareg V10, 2011 Golf TDI
Yesterday I finally put my MFA cluster in. I had tested it on several occasions to see if everything works and I am pretty sure everything did except for outside temp and oil temp. When it cycled through the different screens it never went to outside temp and when it went to oil temp it just had lines. When I plugged it up yesterday it had the same issues. An hour later I go drive the car and for some reason I have none of them now. The MFA screen only displays the time and will not cycle through the different screens. None of the little indicators of which screen you are on are lit at all. Its like the MFA button decided to stop working when i finally put it in. Weird thing is the slider button to switch between 1 and 2 works and changes on the screen. Ideas?
 

G60ING

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 5, 2001
Location
MD
TDI
No TDIs Currently, I have an R36 Corrado. I've had an ALH Corrado swap, AHU Corrado swap and 2003 TDI Jetta
quote=dslg60]Hi, I just skimmed through this briefly the other day so forgive me if this has been covered. I would like to do this at some point. Is a Corrado G60 MFA cluster useable? I have one left over from my swap. The Corrado was a 92 G60 with the electronic speedo. Looks exactly the same. Thanks, Jason.
Anyone?[/QUOTE]


just track down a B4 obd2 Passat Vr6 cluster and then pay the $50-$60 to this guy: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=268798

Anybody have a broken 93 corrado cluster? I want the red needles for my TDI MFA cluster:



I'm excited to be getting my MFA function back and to have the mileage of the chassis correct.:beer:

I tested it yesterday and works great. I'm so happy that I prewired the mfa oil and air temps and built the cluster harness with the mfa in mind.
 

BKmetz

Administrator, Member #10
Staff member
Joined
Sep 25, 1997
Location
Illinois
TDI
2015 Passat, titanium beige, 6MT
I rebuilt the 1st post from the link G60ING posted.


:)
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
I just finished installing my MFA cluster yesterday.

If you have your MFA cluster converted by Dewhite2485@hotmail.com, the intallation and conversion process is much simplified.

Basically, you need an MFA cluster from a 96 or 97 car, the MFA wiper stalk, and you need to create a harness to go from the MFA stalk to the fuse block.

If you do that, you will have MPG, time, trip time, and trip length.

Note, for wagon owners, you can use the MFA stalk from a sedan (easier to find), its just that you will have to either transfer the arm over to your switch, or trim a little nub off the sedan switch that prevents the arm from closing the contacts for the rear wiper.

Installing the oil temp sensor was very straight forward, remove the plug with a 5mm hex, and install the temp sensor. The connector for the sensor is just sitting there waiting to install on the sonsor.

Also, the plastic connectors were not available at my local vw store (backordered), so I manufactured the MFA harness from a 4-wire connector I had lying around - the one that goes to the trunk release on sedan models. You have to trim off one of the retainer "arms", but after that it fits in the fuse block perfectly.
 
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G60ING

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 5, 2001
Location
MD
TDI
No TDIs Currently, I have an R36 Corrado. I've had an ALH Corrado swap, AHU Corrado swap and 2003 TDI Jetta
For those that want to try and order a European B4 TDI MFA UK cluster (140mph speedo) the part number is 3A0919910EX This will have an 18 gallon fuel tank and a Celsius water temp gauge. It costs 200 euro i'm mainly posting this part number so I don't look it again in the future.
 

Purple Tom

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 10, 2010
Location
Derbyshire, UK
TDI
Corrado TDi, Golf TDi
I have the European spec B4 TDi MFA cluster in my Corrado and I'm constantly keeping an eye out for the same cluster as I'm sure you guys over in the US would appreciate me finding them. If any turn up then I'll get in touch and let you know.

Also, G60ING - the Corrado red needles will NOT fit the Passat cluster. While they look the same externally it turns out that the internals are totally different. I know this because I tried to swap the needles when I did the TDi conversion on the Corrado and was disappointed to see that they weren't the same. I think I'm going to just paint my needles red and have some new clock faces made up with the 'Corrado' script on them, as per the Corrado clocks.

Cheers
Tom
 

VW-TDI

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Joined
Jun 29, 2010
Location
Vancouver WA - Portland OR.
TDI
'95 Winnebago Rialta TDI/5-speed conversion, '93 Eurovan Weekender 2.5TDI/5-speed conversion
MFA cluster

You can use MK4 needles in B4 cluster. Will need to shorten a little tach needle to fit there.
 
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Bravo19r

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2010
Location
Burnaby, British Columbia
TDI
Y2K4 Jetta Variant TDI (RIP), 1996 B4V 1.9 TDI (Re-Homed), 2010 Jetta TDI Highline
For those that want to try and order a European B4 TDI MFA UK cluster (140mph speedo) the part number is 3A0919910EX This will have an 18 gallon fuel tank and a Celsius water temp gauge. It costs 200 euro i'm mainly posting this part number so I don't look it again in the future.

So this would have a Celsius temp, 18 Gal fuel, MPH speedo?? Miles ODO???

Being in Canada I would like metric.
 

compu_85

Gadget Guy
Joined
Sep 29, 2003
Location
Springfield VA
TDI
... None :S
DerekWhite said it's all about IQ adjustments in vagcom. But what if you need IQ to be specific due to my tune/mods? Is it small itty bitty adjustments that won't affect the true IQ just the numerical value on vagcom?
Yes, small IQ adjustments in VCDS are the way to do this.

-J
 

RIP TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 16, 2000
Location
Santa Barbara, CA
TDI
'15 GSW SE 6MT, '01 Golf GLS 5MT, '96 Passat variant
They aren't necessarily small adjustments. Chips, nozzles, even different BD percentages can throw off MFA consumption accuracy a ton. If maintaining a narrow IQ range and accurate MFA consumption is important, you're better off with a Scangauge. Ditto if you plan to add mods or vary fuel type over time.
 
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