Pulled my Motor out, what to do??

[GrapplingDMC]

I have a little experience with diesels working on my 2006 Duramax but am totally new to TDI's (I even posted this in the B5 section cuz I didn't realize where they changed). I pulled the motor out of my 97 Passat wagon the other day and started cleaning it up. I want to do this right especially since the motor is out and accessible. While it is out I figure I will:

Replace any gaskets except for the heads, main seal and injection pump (crank replaced and bottom end work done about 25k miles ago).

EGR delete and tune. More looking for economy and torque than horsepower. Where to buy? Brands? etc,..

Guessing I should clean intake and exhaust ports?? Best way to do that on these things??

Paint.

Anything wrong with this stuff or things to add to it please let me know

 

[ToddA1]

Sounds about right, but replacing the IP for what reason?

I’d also reconsider EGR delete.

-Todd

 

[Mongler98]

If you clean the intake manifold you must clean the intake runner ports on the head. is a must.
You can get them 100/ if you tip the engine on its side and fill it with solvent

If you want economy then leave the egr. It can be drastically improved with the tune.

Do all seals. I would even pull the head and have it redone. At that milage the valve guides do wear. Its supper easy to do out of the car. And very cheap if it's not warpped.
I didnt se anything about replacing the IP but I would definatly change all the seals on it.

 

[GrapplingDMC]

Sounds about right, but replacing the IP for what reason?

I’d also reconsider EGR delete.

-Todd

I was meaning replacing all the gaskets except the rear main and injection pump gasket

 

[GrapplingDMC]

If you clean the intake manifold you must clean the intake runner ports on the head. is a must.
You can get them 100/ if you tip the engine on its side and fill it with solvent

If you want economy then leave the egr. It can be drastically improved with the tune.

Do all seals. I would even pull the head and have it redone. At that milage the valve guides do wear. Its supper easy to do out of the car. And very cheap if it's not warpped.
I didnt se anything about replacing the IP but I would definatly change all the seals on it.

I think the heads were redone when the crank was replaced like 30k miles ago. Would I still want to have them done? Far as cleaning the intake, what solvent do I use? Is there a thread on here how to do it properly?

 

[garciapiano]

I think the heads were redone when the crank was replaced like 30k miles ago. Would I still want to have them done? Far as cleaning the intake, what solvent do I use? Is there a thread on here how to do it properly?

If the head was done recently and you've had your EGR intact, I'm going to guess there is only a bit of gunkiness in the intake and not the chunk of buildup we are used to seeing here on the forum that was caused by the higher sulfur fuel from years gone by. These days, I wouldn't worry about it.

I wouldn't even pull the intake manifold to save yourself from having to clean the runners.

The things I would definitely do with an engine-out service is a timing belt and the gasket set. The water pump housing to block o-ring is worth doing if you have it all apart... although mine was still good 25 years later...

 

[GrapplingDMC]

If the head was done recently and you've had your EGR intact, I'm going to guess there is only a bit of gunkiness in the intake and not the chunk of buildup we are used to seeing here on the forum that was caused by the higher sulfur fuel from years gone by. These days, I wouldn't worry about it.

I wouldn't even pull the intake manifold to save yourself from having to clean the runners.

The things I would definitely do with an engine-out service is a timing belt and the gasket set. The water pump housing to block o-ring is worth doing if you have it all apart... although mine was still good 25 years later...

Thanks for the info. I just found the service papers and the heads were not done. It was just the crankshaft, rod bearings, crankshaft gear, crank seals, and main bearings far as the motor goes so sounds like the fore mentioned head work is a good idea

 

[garciapiano]

All depends on the mileage and how the car was kept. My engine lasted over 400,000 miles before the turbo, bearings and piston rings all simultaneously started to let go at the same time. The engine specialist I spoke to told me that these engines usually go around 250k before needing a rebuild so I’m guessing I did pretty well.

 

[GrapplingDMC]

I started to pull the head off but need to buy a puller for the cam sprocket. This may sound like a stupid question but what tools or kit will I need to do this, make sure everything is lined up for the cam, pump etc. I did mark everything before I pulled the belt. I would like to order everything at once. Thanks for any info in advance

 

[turbodieseldyke]

There's a hole in the upper timing belt cover. Use a hammer and a punch, to knock the pulley off. Or a 60D nail with the tip cut off.

 

[garciapiano]

There is a set of timing tools specific to the TDI sold by many vendors. The main ones needed are the cam “locking” plate and the injection pump lock pin. There is also a tensioner wrench. I recommend using those as opposed to the “mark and pray” method since we are talking about fractions of a degree of timing and you need that precision when timing the engine.

 

[TDeanI]

Replace your valve stem seals.

Front and rear main seal you said were replaced but look to see if there is a groove on the crankshaft where the oil seal contacts. If so, sleeve it. Replacing the oil seal if there is a groove without sleeving it doesn't help much.

 

[ToddA1]

Grooves are pretty common and I’ve replaced many of these seals without sleeving anything... no leaks. The spring keeps the lip tight against the surface.

You could also install the seal slightly less deep in the carrier to get a smooth area or upgrade to the newer PTFE seal, to eliminate further grooving.

-Todd

 

[Houpty GT]

JaysinSpaceman mod for both bearings.
Intermediate Shaft Outer Bearing R&R | TDIClub Forums

 

[Rig]

This is bit off topic, but anyone know of a reputable VW TDI mechanic that can do a complete block rebuild including power mods such as ported head?

 

[Steve Addy]

This is bit off topic, but anyone know of a reputable VW TDI mechanic that can do a complete block rebuild including power mods such as ported head?

Frank06 can do the head work, maybe the block too but you'd have to ask. He's on the forum here.

As for what to do while you have the engine out I'm all for crank seals (front and rear) if they haven't been done and checking the intermediate shaft bearing too.

On the cylinder head as someone else mentioned valve stem seals but also if you're above 250k miles consider having the exhaust valve guides done too, just have a shop check the head over.

EDIT: is this going back into the Passat wagon or into the Sidekick?

Steve

 

[chrisgt]

definitely replace the IP seals. I did the IP head seal in-car. what a massive, horrible pain that was!

 

[GrapplingDMC]

Frank06 can do the head work, maybe the block too but you'd have to ask. He's on the forum here.

As for what to do while you have the engine out I'm all for crank seals (front and rear) if they haven't been done and checking the intermediate shaft bearing too.

On the cylinder head as someone else mentioned valve stem seals but also if you're above 250k miles consider having the exhaust valve guides done too, just have a shop check the head over.

EDIT: is this going back into the Passat wagon or into the Sidekick?

Steve

Going into a 95 4 dr Sidekick. Was an auto but putting a 5 speed behind it.
I pulled the head & have everything but the injection pump off but I'm taking it off to replace seals. I am going to make a list & do all the previous suggestions but now I have the turbo, intake etc off any other suggestions? What is safe to clean everything with?

 

[Steve Addy]

Going into a 95 4 dr Sidekick. Was an auto but putting a 5 speed behind it.
I pulled the head & have everything but the injection pump off but I'm taking it off to replace seals. I am going to make a list & do all the previous suggestions but now I have the turbo, intake etc off any other suggestions? What is safe to clean everything with?

Hey
I paid a machine shop to do my head work, they did a light skim to make sure it was true, then valve job where they replaced all he stem seals and the exhaust valve guides. That was at 242k miles, I think it was worth it.

Good idea to change the Sidekick to MT, this is one of the conversions I always wanted to do, I always like the 4dr Sidekick...

Steve

 

[Sleet]

Regarding putting it into a different car, have you giving any thought to how you'll be able to replace the timing belt in the future? While the car is attached to the transmission you have the timing belt mark that helps you get the crank lined up right.

The mark is on the flywheel and there's a small point cut in the transmission bell housing that lines up to that mark and you know the crank is at top dead center.

However if you change the flywheel or put the engine in a different transmission that doesn't have the point (or a combination of both), you loose that ability to know when your crank is lined up.

if you need to change the timing belt in the future you then are sort of stuck. In that case maybe hold onto the old flywheel and transmission, worst case you pull the engine out and put the old flywheel and transmission bell housing back on and change the belt. then put it back in the car to make the final pump adjustments.

Perhaps there are solutions to this problem that I'm unaware of and if so I'd be happy to hear the solutions as I have both an AHU engine and a couple projects I might want to put the engine in.

but that's just my $0.02

-J

 

[Steve Addy]

Regarding putting it into a different car, have you giving any thought to how you'll be able to replace the timing belt in the future? While the car is attached to the transmission you have the timing belt mark that helps you get the crank lined up right.

The mark is on the flywheel and there's a small point cut in the transmission bell housing that lines up to that mark and you know the crank is at top dead center.

However if you change the flywheel or put the engine in a different transmission that doesn't have the point (or a combination of both), you loose that ability to know when your crank is lined up.

if you need to change the timing belt in the future you then are sort of stuck. In that case maybe hold onto the old flywheel and transmission, worst case you pull the engine out and put the old flywheel and transmission bell housing back on and change the belt. then put it back in the car to make the final pump adjustments.

Perhaps there are solutions to this problem that I'm unaware of and if so I'd be happy to hear the solutions as I have both an AHU engine and a couple projects I might want to put the engine in.

but that's just my $0.02

-J

Ran into that same thing recently on an old Rabbit diesel. Someone at some point had replaced the flywheel with one that was either not diesel or if it was for diesel it needed to be marked they didn't do it...so it was more difficult to do the timing...but possible.

By removing the #1 injector and inserting a small rod you can watch until the rod stops moving as you turn the crank. That will be TDC and you can mark your flywheel at that point so you know for future reference.

It's crude...and I wouldn't really want to do it for TDI, but if you needed to you could. The problem is that there's always some slack at TDC where the piston doesn't move but the rod and crank can move just a bit...so it's not as precise as I like.

It will however get the job done if you need it running and moving...

Steve

 

[ToddA1]

However if you change the flywheel or put the engine in a different transmission that doesn't have the point (or a combination of both), you loose that ability to know when your crank is lined up.

Doesn’t the crank pulley/HB have a notch that lines up with an arrow on the lower belt cover?

Personally, I’ve never seen a VW FW that didn’t have TDC marked. I’ve seen mention of the gas FWs not having the dynamic timing mark, but have never seen it. I use gas 210mm FWs on all my early diesel VWs. I only care about the TDC mark.

-Todd

 

[Steve Addy]

Doesn’t the crank pulley/HB have a notch that lines up with an arrow on the lower belt cover?

Old Rabbit diesel....no HB, only a cast pulley down there and I've never seen an alignment mark to speak of...

Personally, I’ve never seen a VW FW that didn’t have TDC marked. I’ve seen mention of the gas FWs not having the dynamic timing mark, but have never seen it. I use gas 210mm FWs on all my early diesel VWs. I only care about the TDC mark.

-Todd

The one on the car has marks...but they aren't remotely close. It has an 0 and a series of dots, but they don't line up at all with where I determined TDC to be. I just assumed that it was a gasser flywheel of some sort, but honestly I don't know.

Car is running now after new TB and IP reseal...enough to move it along anyway.

Steve

 

[turbodieseldyke]

The problem is that there's always some slack at TDC where the piston doesn't move but the rod and crank can move just a bit...so it's not as precise as I like.

Maybe use a dial indicator instead of a rod. Pick a depth (0.100" for example), and mark the teeth at that depth, on both the upstroke and downstroke. Then your TDC will be exactly in the middle of those two teeth, and mark that tooth.

 

[GrapplingDMC]

Regarding putting it into a different car, have you giving any thought to how you'll be able to replace the timing belt in the future? While the car is attached to the transmission you have the timing belt mark that helps you get the crank lined up right.

The mark is on the flywheel and there's a small point cut in the transmission bell housing that lines up to that mark and you know the crank is at top dead center.

However if you change the flywheel or put the engine in a different transmission that doesn't have the point (or a combination of both), you loose that ability to know when your crank is lined up.

if you need to change the timing belt in the future you then are sort of stuck. In that case maybe hold onto the old flywheel and transmission, worst case you pull the engine out and put the old flywheel and transmission bell housing back on and change the belt. then put it back in the car to make the final pump adjustments.

Perhaps there are solutions to this problem that I'm unaware of and if so I'd be happy to hear the solutions as I have both an AHU engine and a couple projects I might want to put the engine in.

but that's just my $0.02

-J

2 options for timing in a different vehicle. 1: line up the timing mark on the transmission then make a mark on the timing belt cover in reference to the crank. Option 2: retime everything then make the mark on the cover.
There are multiple companies out there that make tdi conversion kits. Sidekicks are the most popular but Toyota pickups are up there too. What were you thinking about putting the AHU in?

 

[ToddA1]

Old Rabbit diesel....no HB, only a cast pulley down there and I've never seen an alignment mark to speak of...

I was referring to the TDI engine.

-Todd

 

[Steve Addy]

I was referring to the TDI engine.

-Todd

Yes...I thought you might be, but I don't think there's any alignment mark on the crankshaft HB or the seal housing in that area. At least I don't recall seeing one or seeing a mention of it in the Bentley manual.

Steve

 

[GrapplingDMC]

Hey
I paid a machine shop to do my head work, they did a light skim to make sure it was true, then valve job where they replaced all he stem seals and the exhaust valve guides. That was at 242k miles, I think it was worth it.

Good idea to change the Sidekick to MT, this is one of the conversions I always wanted to do, I always like the 4dr Sidekick...

Steve

I found 1 guy that did the conversion for his wife. He raised the gearing a little & did a couple things on the outside of the motor & she was getting 48mpg on the highway.
There are quite a few places that build conversion kits to do it. I bought everything conversion wise minus the wiring to put the TDI from the passat I bought into the sidekick for $1500. I have talked to guys that fabbed stuff themselves but that takes time that I do not have. The guy that is buying the passat body from me also sent me a link for a place that makes plug & play wiring harnesses for TDI conversions starting for about $500. I think I am going to go that way too, again to save time.

 

[ToddA1]

I don't think there's any alignment mark on the crankshaft HB or the seal housing in that area.

i stand corrected. I took a look at Rotbox’s engine and there isn’t any markings. I may have confused this engine with ABA.

-Todd

 

[GrapplingDMC]

Ok this may be a stupid question. Someone on here said to do the valve guides. I finally found a place that does diesels but they said they usually don't work on small engines & said the heads on the small diesels can't be sleeved or anything. Is this true? I want to do this right but I'm about to just throw it back together cuz not having this vehicle has cost me like 10k in lost jobs just in the last couple months