Project: PolarXJ (M-TDI XJ)

[6_DoF]

oh yeah, new stance is way better. tires n wheels ftw, the 30s play nice with the gearing, 1" lower in the front to level things out from the lighter motor, realigned, much win.

also got the VNT vac on the turbo, motor responds faster than it has so more win there.

my only real concern is the temp sensor is ready crazy low! like 55deg in my shop and reading 0deg f output ... guess i got a bad one.

 

[PickleRick]

I'm not sure how your motor(in stock form) compares to a balance shaft deleted BHW PD motor but my idle vibes are a non factor. Unless you're gripping the steering wheel I notice no vibes worse than my Passat with OEM VW non leaky liquid mounts. My eBay replacement 22re engine mounts are far stiffer than OEM yota engine mounts. These old jeeps and Toyotas were not build to the luxury standard of the b5.5 Passat, essentially an Audi with a VW badge. Even the vibes I feel on the steering wheel are not bad, they just feel different on the little 86 Toyota steering wheel than they do on the much nicer VW Passat steering wheel.


The only time my BHW is rough is on shut down, she rattles like an old diesel with an pull to kill lever on the injection pump on shut down. My asv has been deleted and replaced with a race pipe so that's to be expected.

David at fast does great work. I need to send my ECU back to him so he can reprogram my ECU to get the gear ratios set in order for my cruise control to activate. I've been enjoying driving it so much that I really don't want to let it sit for 2 weeks or so to ship out the ECU. My 23-24 mpg is much better than I get in my 7.3 excursion.

 

[6_DoF]

with the idle turned up to 945, timing brought within spec, and IQ in range ... it's still a shaker. more annoying to sit in and idle than my 1st gen 12v Ram for sure. not enough that i won't drive it, but enough that the wife won't ride in this. would be nice to turn the idle up to like 1050, that would get rid of most of it. these mounts are quite hard but driving its smooth, only idle is different.

ya know, it actually starts hard too, wonder if that has anything to do with it. my tuned up golf would fire on like the 2nd cylinder to hit. this takes a 2-4sec spin to finally kick over. much shorter once warm, but my garage is mid 50s. 55deg cold start is longer than my golf would have been below freezing without using the plugs.

 

[6_DoF]

this thing is great to drive! it's the Golf i always wanted even with the 30" AT though, i NEED a limited slip rear end. the torque of this thing just lights a tire off with any hint of a cold or not dry road.

-the NVH at idle is still a bit much to be nice, i'll have to do better engine mounts at some point
-MPG isn't quite as good as i was hoping either, it seams to be closer to only 20. but this is almost entirely city driving.

 

[PickleRick]

I'm on 285 70's(almost 33") MT and have constantly squeaked out 23 to 24 mpg. Never more. Never less. 85 to 90% city driving.


I don't think our construction site dumpster aerodynamics will allow us much more fuel economy that that

 

[6_DoF]

in the city, the LEGO aerodynamics shouldn't affect too much, but I'm going to assume the jeep driveline itself is considerably more lossy than the VW setup.

small car trans-diff to ball bearing CVs ---> medium duty trans, t-case, 3 u-joint CV drive shaft, medium duty solid axle

not that low 20s in an old XJ is a bad thing ... it's just not the 2x better than the lifted 12V Cummins extended cab W250 truck i was hoping for. i get 15/18 in that. the XJ does fit places better though!

 

[Rob Mayercik]

Only 20s for mpg? John on BleepinJeep's ALH-converted 2001 is pulling low 30s running 33x9.50 tires on a 5-speed. Look for posts by "JeddaDeezl" to see what he might have posted here on the conversion, maybe it'll give you ideas on what might need fine-tuning on yours...

 

[cuban11182]

Nice build. Really good to see another XJ.

I helped a buddy install an ALH in his MJ. He went with the poly mounts and then switched to the anchor hydraulic ones. He's running an AW4 with a GTD1756, 260 injectors, and 35" tires. It works well.

I have the 1984 CJ7 that started life as an eTDI: GTD1756, 260 injectors, and fully built motor, I swapped to a 12MM mTDI (Navistar International pump) w/ 280 full flow injectors from Jarod March, and a Holset HE200WG. I just got it back to eTDI with the Holset and the 280 injectors and a tune update from Tekmektronics.

I'm swapping a 94 XJ now. Not sure why I stick with Jeeps, but at least they're old ones, and not Fiats. I have a rebuilt Hybrid motor (ARL and ALH), some Jarod March 280 injectors, and a rebuilt 11mm eTDI pump (built by Verlin Martin of PA). I have a GTC1549 enroute, but I've contemplated going back to another GTD1752/56 or Holset. I really like how it drives in the CJ7. Recently finished the Iron Rock Rocklink 3-link 3" (mouthful) in preparation of the swap.

Here are a few videos:

CJ7 the first time it was eTDI. 30 PSI NLT 1950-2000 when floored from 1500 RPM. It was too fast in my opinion. I fully rebuilt it (every is new/rebuilt, other than the Dana 300) and took it up to 95 MPH, stupid I know. Crazy thing is, it wanted to keep going.

mTDI setup

XJ motor prep

XJ motor first start after pump rebuild

XJ TDI motor start after pump rebuild

youtube.com

Great thread BTW. I'm glad things are working out. Get rid of that HANS pump!

 

[6_DoF]

man, I've done 95 in the crawler YJ before on bias tires ... a rebuilt CJ should have been money!

the eTDI is (choking on my words) better than the mTDI. i just don't like the VEs, they are just wrong. i just don't know what to do with the HANS pump now, i'd feel bad selling it but it's too spendy to have rebuilt to work well.

part of me wishes i had built a TDI '74 AMC Javelin instead of the XJ, but 4x4 was necessary at the jeep was already here.

 

[6_DoF]

sh!tbox update ... something has to be wrong with the mpg, i know heavier SUV's that were 4bt swapped getting better MPG. read around the forum some and found that a bad temp sensor can hurt mpg, makes sense. my new one is for sure bad, after being in the 55deg garage all night it's reading 5deg. has a similar offset the whole way it seams. it also cranks embarrassingly long to start ... could the pump be wore out?

 

[PickleRick]

My 4bd1t and 4bd2t swapped land cruisers (fj60 and fj40) combo of 31x10.5 to 33x12.5 mudd terrains got 23 to 25 mpg, the 3.9l 750lbs 4bd Isuzu motor is very similar to the 4bt, slightly smoother at idle. I heard of guys dropping a 4bt into a scout 2 and getting 30mpg on 35s but I'd have to see it to believe it. Maybe all the rust provides better aerodynamics?



I've yet to figure out how to get trash dumpster aerodynamic rigs weighing in 2+ tons with 4+ inches of lift to get 30 mpg. I've been trying for nearly 20 years now.

 

[6_DoF]

this XJ weighs basically the same as my old Golf. this motor is way lighter than the original, they are within a passenger of each other. weight is not the issue.

brick shaped is a big thing at speed, but worse than towing? a buddy towed 2 motorcycles on an open trailer around the country for a trip and got mid 30s with a jetta. that's easily more weight than the XJ, and probably worse aero drag too. cruising around at 55 should also limit the aero issue. hell, i spent 4hours at over 100mph driving thru the mountains on the turnpike in my golf and only got down to 36mpg, my worst ever.

driveline will be a big part, way more components to spin and each built with less concern for drag. bigger clutch with more inertia too, but I'm only on a 30" tire.

2x the fuel consumption using the same driving style seams unlikely. a gas suburban can get low 20s, my 6" lifted 12v truck on 35's is only a few mpg back even.

 

[greengeeker]

Here are my data points:

• right around 50mpg with my ALH Jetta.
  • for the exact same driving, my ALH Ranger (Stock 2wd, Reg cab) delivered 39mpg.
• My stock 24v Eurovan couldn't crack 20mpg highway. Basically averaged 18mpg.
  • my ALH Eurovan (small lift) delivered 26mpg on a recent road trip over the Rockies. On flat ground, not fighting the wind, 31mpg.

 

[PickleRick]

My BHW sedan at 70mph could climb i40 to Gatlinburg or run a flat i26 to Murrell's inlet at 43mpg.


Toss a small kayak trailer behind her with 5 kayaks, half of them kids kayaks, and run the flat ground all the way to the beach I'd drop to 32mpg. I could get back up to 35mpg by dropping my speed to 65. Even loaded with fishing gear and kayaks my scrawny rear end could easily move the trailer around the yard.


Drag does does have a great impact on mileage.


Much like your situation, my 1st gen 4 runner doesn't weigh much more than a Passat wagon.

 

[6_DoF]

yeah ... i'd expect to at least fall somewhere between "the entire family, gear, and 5 kayaks on a trailer doing 70mph" and the "road trip loaded Eurovan in the Rockies" for MPG. that doesn't seam too much to ask for an empty little XJ going to work.

i've looked around for pump life-span and signs of issues, but actually not found much. the VE on a Cummins is very well known to only be good for about 150,000 miles depending on use n fuel. i know this little pump has way more than that and sat around quite a while on an engine on a shelf before i got it. i feel like my starting issue and MPG issue might be related.

 

[dieseldonato]

Had 265k on my first gen cummins factory ve pump, still running strong to this day. 232k on the alh as best I can tell its the original pump amd injectors. There's no reason it should be shot at 150k miles. I would also think you jeep should be getting better millage, have a friend with a 4bt swap in a ranger that gets a very consistent 30-32mpg driving like an idiot, 33" tires and a 3" body lift. Heck even my 79f350 w/13mm p pump 12 valve still manages 20mpg pushing 37" swampers with 3.50 gears. (Driving nice, real easy to pull thay down to 16mpg)
Aerodynamics don't really affect you till highway speeds, at least not enough to account for that mpg your seeing.

 

[6_DoF]

13mm p-pump ... yes plz!

 

[dieseldonato]

13mm p-pump ... yes plz!

Industrial injection sells them everyday lol. Tbh it's too much for a road driven truck.
Here's the truck. The black one is my 79. The red one is my cousins.

New item by S D

photos.app.goo.gl

 

[shakescreek]

For comparison I have a BHW swapped 2003 Blazer,5 spd manual, weighs about 4200 lbs, 215 75 15 tires. I do all my mileage calculations based on the imperial gal.
It averages right around 40 mpg (33.3 us mpg) on most of our trips, usually loaded pretty heavy on the return trip. Last year we did a 8500 mile round trip to Quebec and back and averaged 44(36.6 us) for the entire trip with a best tank of 47(39 us). That was all straight highway keeping the speed right around 105 kmh(65mph), 2050 rpm with my gearing and tire size. Every tank was hand calculated. I suspect the 2nd gen blazers have a little better aerodynamics than the Jeep though.

 

[6_DoF]

ITbh it's too much for a road driven truck.

you take that back!

i built a DIY 'afc live' from automation direct parts for 1/10 the price of PDD's. if not running anything like it yet, should be able to tame it a bit for grocery duty. bypass valve, needle orifice valve, psi regulator, psi gauge. just limits how fast your boost signal hits the pump, and the max PSI the pump sees.

 

[dieseldonato]

you take that back!

i built a DIY 'afc live' from automation direct parts for 1/10 the price of PDD's. if not running anything like it yet, should be able to tame it a bit for grocery duty. bypass valve, needle orifice valve, psi regulator, psi gauge. just limits how fast your boost signal hits the pump, and the max PSI the pump sees.

I have an afc live in it. It helps some. You can really only dial it back so far before your not able to spool the big turbo. Still pretty fun at 45psi 70psi is a giggle fest and hard in the tires lol.

 

[6_DoF]

is that a big single or compounds? With 70psi i would guess compounds. i'm able to get 60psi out of my pair, but the VE can't fuel the top end to save it's life. if i get close to fueling the top, the bottom is undriveable smokey. i have a 96 engine on the stand to strip for the p7100 conversion eventually. actually, it's way less smokey and more drivewable now that i have the nv5600 in it, i need to turn the fuel back up.

Project: Hank - '93 W250 Daily/tow

www.cumminsforum.com

 

[dieseldonato]

is that a big single or compounds? With 70psi i would guess compounds. i'm able to get 60psi out of my pair, but the VE can't fuel the top end to save it's life. if i get close to fueling the top, the bottom is undriveable smokey. i have a 96 engine on the stand to strip for the p7100 conversion eventually. actually, it's way less smokey and more drivewable now that i have the nv5600 in it, i need to turn the fuel back up.

Project: Hank - '93 W250 Daily/tow

www.cumminsforum.com

S300g with a s476 up top. I had a stainless s364 billet wheel on it before the twins, but it was a hot smokey mess in the bottom. Really bad when I was towing with it. I can push more boost, but have had so many drivetrain issues it's not worth it. Nv4500 are not as strong as some would have you think. Kinda at the point where a fully built auto would be the way to go.
Yeah, first gen ve are fun to play with. You'll be lucky to get 500hp out of them with the stock head and cam plate. Still makes for a ripping truck. They were pretty light weight compared ro newer trucks. The advantage of variable timing is emmense over the p7100, but the p7100 just flow way more fuel. Never pushed the first gen past 50psi. Actually 48 psi was about it for her. Good running truck, and very reliable, other then blowing the head gasket it never gave me any issues. The trans was a bowl of marbles a few times, but it held up pretty well. Didn't have the options we have today, 6 speeds were new at the time and nv4500 were dropping gears (5th mostly) like Flys.

New item by S D

photos.app.goo.gl

You truck turned out pretty nice from zipping over your thread. I wish to this day I never got rid of my 90. I know the kid that bought it, it's just sitting out back rotting away to nothing. Won't sell it back to me either.

 

[6_DoF]

I know the kid that bought it, it's just sitting out back rotting away to nothing. Won't sell it back to me either.

worst feeling ever, that suuuux.

i have a gearing calculator .xls that i built to compare transmissions, low range, axle gearing options, etc. normalizing all the transmission ratios really makes a great pictures, and really makes the 4500 look baaaddd. not horrible for gas, but basically the worst possible ratio selection available for diesel. ppl are still paying big money for them too. i'd gladly spend 2x what i did for my 5600 and you can make back a lot more with a good 4500 than i can with a blown up g360. i never expected it to be as different as it is.

the compounds on the 12v make me want compounds on the ALH way too much! i have an HX35 to swap onto the ram for a better spooling manifold turbo, then maybe the 60mm wh1c should make an appearance on the XJ

 

[dieseldonato]

worst feeling ever, that suuuux.

i have a gearing calculator .xls that i built to compare transmissions, low range, axle gearing options, etc. normalizing all the transmission ratios really makes a great pictures, and really makes the 4500 look baaaddd. not horrible for gas, but basically the worst possible ratio selection available for diesel. ppl are still paying big money for them too. i'd gladly spend 2x what i did for my 5600 and you can make back a lot more with a good 4500 than i can with a blown up g360. i never expected it to be as different as it is.

the compounds on the 12v make me want compounds on the ALH way too much! i have an HX35 to swap onto the ram for a better spooling manifold turbo, then maybe the 60mm wh1c should make an appearance on the XJ

I'd love to grab a 6 speed, but they are hard to grab up around here. till the kids are older, ie not in daycare, I won't be sinking much money into the truck.
Man there are some great options for singles now a days vs a wh1c. Anything bw s series in the 60-62mm range will stomp it, garret has some sweet ball bearing turbos too. What a lot of guys tend to forget, is they are still trucks that we load heavy and tow heavy with. Quick spooling turbo and good flowing exhaust housings are very important. Basically why I ditched the stainless diesel s364. Just didn't spool fast enough when towing. I could have had it reworked into their 62mm wheel, but that was supposedly only good for like 650hp. The 364 was rated for "over 700hp". So naturally not thinking I went with that. Yep $1600.00 mistake. Twins work great.

 

[6_DoF]

100% agreed! i have enough time to explained why i have lag ... after i stomp the throttle, during my lag. it's laughable bad, but the 6spd has actually taken care of most of that by keeping the R's up way better each shift. PDD is telling me the smaller 54mm hx35 should spool as much as 400 R's sooner, and that would be HUGE with a 10,000lb trailer.

for the ALH, would be fun to keep the little VNT-15 and see if something crazy like the 60mm WH1C would spool behind it

 

[dieseldonato]

100% agreed! i have enough time to explained why i have lag ... after i stomp the throttle, during my lag. it's laughable bad, but the 6spd has actually taken care of most of that by keeping the R's up way better each shift. PDD is telling me the smaller 54mm hx35 should spool as much as 400 R's sooner, and that would be HUGE with a 10,000lb trailer.

for the ALH, would be fun to keep the little VNT-15 and see if something crazy like the 60mm WH1C would spool behind it

As quick as the cnt 15 spools, I'd think it wouldn't take much to get the wh1c to spool with enough fuel and a good tune.

 

[6_DoF]

once i figure out why this jeep gets such bad fuel mileage ... I'll go back and make sure it has the ability to still use aaallll the fuel.

 

[6_DoF]

still not sure if the MPG is an issue or normal

the XJ drives great, but so many little things I'd like to tinker with and change. if i decided that i have too many other projects and don't really want to finish detailing this thing ... wonder if anyone would be interred to buy it? maybe i can't get the full investment back and someone wants to buy just the converted jeep without the 1.9/trans?

 

[Mozambiquer]

still not sure if the MPG is an issue or normal

the XJ drives great, but so many little things I'd like to tinker with and change. if i decided that i have too many other projects and don't really want to finish detailing this thing ... wonder if anyone would be interred to buy it? maybe i can't get the full investment back and someone wants to buy just the converted jeep without the 1.9/trans?

Where are you located?