Project Kill Da Auto Wabbit!, Or how I learned to love the Manual Swap

Nuje

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Location
Island near Vancouver
TDI
2015 Sportwagen; Golf GLS 2002 (swap from 2L gas); 2016 A3 e-tron
There's only one way the flywheel bolts on - no way to mount it "wrong" (unless you only use one flywheel bolt :D).
 

Gray223

Member
Joined
May 25, 2020
Location
Missouri
TDI
2002 Jetta ALH
I did a manual swap and everything went great but after driving the car for 2 weeks it sat for a couple days and wont fire.....I was just curious is this has anything to do with the TCU still being plugged in??? Is it necessary to unplugged it?

I'm not getting any fuel, shut-off solenoid is working, no codes besides all the auto trans ones. Just trying to rule things out.
 

cantelonjeff

Active member
Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Location
shedden ontario
TDI
2002 jetta 2003 jetta 2002 jetta
I'm curious too; once you figure this out, please be sure to post back here - very interested in what would/could cause such bizarre behaviour.
Well I took a break to work on a couple other projects for a couple of months and put it back in the shop . Turns out when I installed relay 53 it had pushed the terminal out the back causing the no start problem . Also the blue clutch switch appears to have been bad causing it to keep running after I turned off the key . (unplugged and it turned off and ohmed out defective )
 

Ventobomb

New member
Joined
Apr 7, 2019
Location
Newark DE
TDI
B4V Passat Wagon
Holy crap! Im pretty overwhelmed by reading all of this. It’s starting to make sense. My electrical expertise are as far as “go wire that panel” or “go run that line” haha. I have everything done except for wiring everything and mounting the clutch pedal :l
I’m cross referencing the wiring in the Bentley between my 2003 ALH Wagon and a DQY 5 speed out of a wrecked diesel NB.. I changed the tower out and put on the sigma. Yay.

Am I going overboard on changing out these connectors and re-pinning them??

Thanks for all of the helpful info everyone.
This is great!
 

boertje

Veteran Member
Joined
May 24, 2002
Location
Coeur d'Alene, ID
TDI
'01, '01, '03, ‘06 NB - TDIs all.
Holy crap! Im pretty overwhelmed by reading all of this. It’s starting to make sense. My electrical expertise are as far as “go wire that panel” or “go run that line” haha. I have everything done except for wiring everything and mounting the clutch pedal :l
I’m cross referencing the wiring in the Bentley between my 2003 ALH Wagon and a DQY 5 speed out of a wrecked diesel NB.. I changed the tower out and put on the sigma. Yay.

Am I going overboard on changing out these connectors and re-pinning them??

Thanks for all of the helpful info everyone.
This is great!
Have a look at the how to in my sig. it might help.
 

Ventobomb

New member
Joined
Apr 7, 2019
Location
Newark DE
TDI
B4V Passat Wagon
Have a look at the how to in my sig. it might help.
Hey boertje! Thanks for that. I already have your PDF from instuctables haha
I didn’t realize you had instructions for your wagon In there as well as many more pages. I’ll update my old pdf for less headaches and compare with the blue text
 

Alhjetta00

Active member
Joined
Mar 8, 2021
Location
Bristol, Ct
TDI
2000 Black Jetta ALH
Quick question.. the plastic piece attached to the shifter boot from my donor beetle appears to be square whereas the hole in my previously auto jetta's trim piece is an odd not so square shape. I bought a new shift boot for a jetta, will that fit in the hole or do I need a new trim piece altogether from a manual jetta?
 

Nuje

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Location
Island near Vancouver
TDI
2015 Sportwagen; Golf GLS 2002 (swap from 2L gas); 2016 A3 e-tron
Don't have a Beetle handy, but from my recollection, the cut-out is completely different on the Beetle; I'd be planning to scrounge a trim piece out of a Jetta / Golf (those two are interchangeable).
 

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
Have a look at the how to in my sig. it might help.
Hi Boertje,
Question regarding your wiring diagram you have in your sig: you edited GDB's original document. How do I know if his or your colors are correct for wiring in the cruise control, reverse lights etc for my 2003 mk4 golf. Are the pin locations and functions always the same between the different Golf/Jettas? Or can the pins vary as well as the color of the wires at the pins.
Cody
 

boertje

Veteran Member
Joined
May 24, 2002
Location
Coeur d'Alene, ID
TDI
'01, '01, '03, ‘06 NB - TDIs all.
Hi Boertje,
Question regarding your wiring diagram you have in your sig: you edited GDB's original document. How do I know if his or your colors are correct for wiring in the cruise control, reverse lights etc for my 2003 mk4 golf. Are the pin locations and functions always the same between the different Golf/Jettas? Or can the pins vary as well as the color of the wires at the pins.
Cody
That’s what i found on my 2002 Jetta wagon and my 2000 golf and also on my 2003 bug iirc. I had found pin locations to be consistent.
 

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
Just wanted to say thanks to
Alphasenior for this thread
boertje for his summary doc
GdB for his summary doc
And the rest of you for your troubleshooting.
Swapped mine a few weeks ago and runs like a champ. Only issue is the cruise not working, so I will have to look into that but I suspect the human factor is the fault.
Cody
 

csstevej

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 12, 2004
Location
north nj
TDI
2001 golf tdi 4 door auto now a manual, mine, 2000 golf 2 door M/T son's,daughters 98 NB non-TDI 2.0, 2003 TDI NB for next daughter, head repaired and on road,gluten for punishment got another tdi 2001NB,another yellow tdi NB
Did you swap the pin that’s required at the ecu to , I believe , pin # 66, it’s just a relocation to that spot from another spot.
 

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
Did you swap the pin that’s required at the ecu to , I believe , pin # 66, it’s just a relocation to that spot from another spot.
I believe it was the right pin. I will pull the ecu connection and check again but I went through it in my head like 5 times while I was doing it. Either wrong pin, not secured, or I have a loose connection somewhere along the way but should not be a hard fix I'm thinking. I'll post what happened when I get to it and figure it out!
 

BenT

Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2021
Location
East Anglia, UK
TDI
Caddy 1.6 CR, Octavia ALH 01M -> 02M
Have a look at the how to in my sig. it might help.
My first ever post on a forum and I've probably done this wrong... But thanks very much to boertje (and other contributors) for the excellent guide! I've just converted mine from an 01M to a 6-speed manual and wouldn't have been able to do it otherwise. Just in case there's anyone else out there without proper facilities whose afraid of tackling this... I did this on my driveway without assistance - it took a long time and I nearly gave up a few times but I got there in the end! The only time I had to go underneath was to remove the catalyst, but I did this with the car on the ground. The rest was achievable from the side/above. Thanks again!
 

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
I believe it was the right pin. I will pull the ecu connection and check again but I went through it in my head like 5 times while I was doing it. Either wrong pin, not secured, or I have a loose connection somewhere along the way but should not be a hard fix I'm thinking. I'll post what happened when I get to it and figure it out!
Followup:

It was the human factor lol. Don't know what kinda powerful fumes were in the garage when I was pinning the ECU but I definitely didn't hit #66 with the cruise wire.
Everythink works now as it should!
I am not a mechanic by any means and have only recently started working on cars within the last 2-3 years but this was a piece of cake with this forumn. Took my time and worked through it methodically and everything went smoothly.
This forumn definitely made my life easy, thanks again!
 

csstevej

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 12, 2004
Location
north nj
TDI
2001 golf tdi 4 door auto now a manual, mine, 2000 golf 2 door M/T son's,daughters 98 NB non-TDI 2.0, 2003 TDI NB for next daughter, head repaired and on road,gluten for punishment got another tdi 2001NB,another yellow tdi NB
Congrats ! Glad you were able to find it.
 

PakProtector

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Location
AnnArbor, MI
TDI
Mk.4 and the Cummins-es
First and foremost, thanks to the contributors. This makes it possible. Can't say thanks enough.

A question: for initial fire, assuming that *NOTHING is done but the mechanicals( no reverse lights, no clutch interlock, no cruise switch/wiring and likely a missing 175 relay...can this be fired up by turning the key on and then using a bump switch on the starter solenoid? I assume I will get a handful of codes, but that is quite fine as long as I can make it run quickly. Part of this is I want to avoid having it sitting not running for too long, and the other is I want to know if the switch to manual coding has any effect on its running( like IQ ).

Car in question is an '02 Jetta.

A follow-up; is there any other re-code needed but the 00001 to 0002. Trans is an EGR-code 5sp. Is the CAN Gateway stuff applicable 7 to 6? I suspect that is a 'maybe, but check and re-enter 6' if need be.
cheers,
Douglas
 

alphaseinor

TDI Innovator Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Jul 30, 2006
Location
Denton, TX
TDI
'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
You can go into can gateway, then open coding, then save coding. it will automatically update, clear codes in autoscan after cycling key

you should be able to key on, hit the starter with a bump switch. the 53 relay is what usually does this for you.
 

BenT

Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2021
Location
East Anglia, UK
TDI
Caddy 1.6 CR, Octavia ALH 01M -> 02M
First and foremost, thanks to the contributors. This makes it possible. Can't say thanks enough.

A question: for initial fire, assuming that *NOTHING is done but the mechanicals( no reverse lights, no clutch interlock, no cruise switch/wiring and likely a missing 175 relay...can this be fired up by turning the key on and then using a bump switch on the starter solenoid? I assume I will get a handful of codes, but that is quite fine as long as I can make it run quickly. Part of this is I want to avoid having it sitting not running for too long, and the other is I want to know if the switch to manual coding has any effect on its running( like IQ ).

Car in question is an '02 Jetta.

A follow-up; is there any other re-code needed but the 00001 to 0002. Trans is an EGR-code 5sp. Is the CAN Gateway stuff applicable 7 to 6? I suspect that is a 'maybe, but check and re-enter 6' if need be.
cheers,
Douglas
I don't know if this helps, but while I still had the plastic trim off from under the steering wheel I managed to start the car by cutting the brown wire going to the 175 relay (as per Boertje's instructions), removing the plastic cover from the relay and then manually pushing the contacts together. Probably best not to drive it like this because of the lack of reversing lights and the fiddliness of starting it if you should stall!

I adjusted my IQ calibration value as far as possible with VCDS but the car was still VERY hard to start and I didn't want to hammer-mod my 11 mm pump. It was quite "stubborn" to drive, too, changing gear smoothly was very difficult. It ran a little rough at idle, too.

I've since put a 10 mm pump on it with "auto" injectors and although it's now pretty slow, it starts well, runs very smoothly and quietly and doesn't smoke at all. Fuel economy isn't great - 51 US mpg at very best. I tried stock ALH injectors with the 10 mm pump but that resulted in (black) smokey starts and again slightly rough running... A remap with the 11 mm pump's probably the best all around but not something I can do! I've decided to live with the lack of power (75 ish BHP by the feel of it) for now because it runs so well, but I will get fed up with it eventually.

Congratulations btw.!
 

PakProtector

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Location
AnnArbor, MI
TDI
Mk.4 and the Cummins-es
I have an extry starter connector/wire...rigging up a push button start for an exam of how it works before and after re-coding the 1/2 thing is what I am after.

cheers,
Douglas
 

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
I drove my car for a while only switching from auto to manual coding and it drove fine but I noticed slow down shutter, almost like a hiccup. Then it started idling funny a few weeks later like it couldn't settle on a good rpm. I checked the IQ and it was 0.8. I'm not fully sure how but it seems doing the swap lowered my IQ I'm thinking likely by switching the coding from 0001 to 0002. I adjusted with vcds and it's at 2.6 now and running like a top. I get around 43ish mpg at 130 (125km/h corrected) which is pretty good imo. I assume I could easily be over 50mpg if I drove 100km/h but I'd rather get to my destination than penny pinch over a couple bucks. My two cents
 

Nuje

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Location
Island near Vancouver
TDI
2015 Sportwagen; Golf GLS 2002 (swap from 2L gas); 2016 A3 e-tron
Doing the hammer mod and upping the IQ to somewhere around 4-5 will probably improve fuel economy and not have any adverse impact on performance.
 

csstevej

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 12, 2004
Location
north nj
TDI
2001 golf tdi 4 door auto now a manual, mine, 2000 golf 2 door M/T son's,daughters 98 NB non-TDI 2.0, 2003 TDI NB for next daughter, head repaired and on road,gluten for punishment got another tdi 2001NB,another yellow tdi NB
Yeah do like Nuje suggests….4-5.
I believe the fueling changes is because the auto’s have a11MM IP with small nozzles…..the manuals have a 10 MM IP with larger nozzles , so now your telling the “ECU hey I’m a manual now” but you have a bigger pump….. just my thought.
 

PakProtector

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Location
AnnArbor, MI
TDI
Mk.4 and the Cummins-es
Yeah do like Nuje suggests….4-5.
I believe the fueling changes is because the auto’s have a11MM IP with small nozzles…..the manuals have a 10 MM IP with larger nozzles , so now your telling the “ECU hey I’m a manual now” but you have a bigger pump….. just my thought.
I wish I could know exactly what is going on with manual injection coding. I expect to shift the beast with a hammer. I have a set of manual injectors to slip in first( freeing the auto's for a trip to the noozle shop ). We shall see. Making sure my IDP list is Right, then work on the wiring whilst I wait for it to arrive. I'll probably confirm clutch centering by mating up the gearbox... :)
cheers,
Douglas
 

PakProtector

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Location
AnnArbor, MI
TDI
Mk.4 and the Cummins-es
ALright some inconsistencies found. The schematic( the 'Before' and 'After' ones) have grey/red and yellow/blue wires mislabeled between pins 3 and 9, and the schematic picture shows blue/yellow wire for reverse and red/gray for cruise but the instructions call out the relay pins and colors correctly for their colors, they don't match the schematic.

So, I rang out the blue yellow for reverse at the 8-pin( the TR plug), and used the proper 12V supply...and of course joined the blue/yellow wire to the relay#4 black/blue wire inside. The white starter interlock was fine, right pins and colours called out. The red-gray I have left for the cruise/blue switch...I have a feeling this is where the trouble is going to start...but I think I can ring out the red/gray and put it to my ECU pin 66 properly...

Soooo...I re-built the connections based on their pin numbers from the text of Boertje's text instructions. His wire colours matched mine, and the schematic is slightly off on its colours. I have the TCM/ECM work to do and install the clutch pedal bits. More as proof it works, when it works... :)
cheers,
Douglas
 
Last edited:

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
ALright some inconsistencies found. The schematic( the 'Before' and 'After' ones) have grey/red and yellow/blue wires mislabeled between pins 3 and 9, and the schematic picture shows blue/yellow wire for reverse and red/gray for cruise but the instructions call out the relay pins and colors correctly for their colors, they don't match the schematic.

So, I rang out the blue yellow for reverse at the 8-pin( the TR plug), and used the proper 12V supply...and of course joined the blue/yellow wire to the relay#4 black/blue wire inside. The white starter interlock was fine, right pins and colours called out. The red-gray I have left for the cruise/blue switch...I have a feeling this is where the trouble is going to start...but I think I can ring out the red/gray and put it to my ECU pin 66 properly...

Soooo...I re-built the connections based on their pin numbers from the text of Boertje's text instructions. His wire colours matched mine, and the schematic is slightly off on its colours. I have the TCM/ECM work to do and install the clutch pedal bits. More as proof it works, when it works... :)
cheers,
Douglas
From what I remember, the original schematic (Gdb) is wrong on some colors. But there was a later edit, from boertje, which fixed the colors and highlighted the original and new fixed colors.
Cody
 

PakProtector

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Location
AnnArbor, MI
TDI
Mk.4 and the Cummins-es
Alright, the GdB wiring diagram colours are not consistent with the written instructions provided by boertje. I followed the written, and it worked perfectly. The IQ was small( number) and the engine loped like a gassser with a big cam. Took up the hammer mod whilst watching VCDS...and put it to 5. Then the tops did not re-seal...so scribed a line, and replaced the seals and re-set to 5. Next up are the manual injectors.
cheers,
Douglas
 

codeweiler

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Location
saskatoon
TDI
2003 golf tdi
Yes, follow boertjes written instructions on his pdf. He writes over gdbs original document and highlights the things he's changed. I used his and it was very accurate.
 

Grashopr303

New member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Location
Kansas
TDI
2003 and 2004
Thank you all for the great writeup!! My 03 Manual had a heavy incident with a retaining wall and my 03 Auto refused to start.. trans was good when it DID start, but it took an act of congress to get it to light. Over the past week, with intermittent help from friends, we re-homed the 390k motor and manual trans into the 200k auto jetta, (mostly) followed the instructions here, and it started right up! The Auto car was not a trip-tronic, just a regular 4-speed auto. I didn't change any wiring other than swapping the 53 fuse into the 173 fuse holder. Haven't done VCDS to change the ECU to manual, haven't hooked up reverse lights to the trans (they aren't coming on), and it starts, runs, doesn't seem to be in limp mode... shows all the gear selections in the dash and has a CEL (pulled codes.. obviously the TCU is having a heyday... other than htat it says the VCC is not found, but speedo works.. weird.

Pulled the manual power steering line from the old car, as well as the shifter, half shafts... that was about it. Anyways; thank you for all for the writeups! Made the swap much less stressful!
 

Grashopr303

New member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Location
Kansas
TDI
2003 and 2004
2nd day after swap update: Turbo isn't spooling up nearly like it did in the Manual ECU car.. but I still haven't been able to get VCDS to connect to the engine module to swap it over to a manual load. Fuel mileage is definitely off, I assume it's pouring a ton more fuel in than what the Manual fuel pump and injectors are set up for. The auto is assuming smaller injectors and a larger pump... right now the pump is small and the injectors are big. However; weird note: haven't hooked up reverse lights or done ANY electrical wiring other than putting the 53 Relay into the 173 hole... but cruise control works. The new shell that I put the manual motor and trans into has steering wheel controls for cruise, heated seats, and a bunch of stuff the old shell didn't have. Everything still works. As it is going right now; speedometer works, but I am assuming that the ECU has zero idea how fast it's going. Checked pins in the TCU connector and the larger ECU connector, but from the writeup; none of the colors are even close to right on the wires. It seems that I should be able to find the signal from the VSS connector to the dash and run it into the ECU pretty easily.. but haven't been able to find the VSS feed after it enters the main harness, and haven't been able to verify which pin to tie it into on the ECU. How it's managing cruise control is beyond me, unless Cruise is handled by the gauges.. but even then that wouldn't make much sense. Anyways, day 2 down. Nothing blew up, clutch seems like it is adjusted correctly. Shift pattern seems more firm than in the old shell (may have needed the clutch cable alignment done years ago in that shell). Definitely has a lack of power compared to the old shell. Can't hear the turbo spooling, nor 'feel' the turbo spool up. I am assuming that THAT should be fixed when I change the ECU to manual mode? Brand new turbo was bolted onto the engine before I installed the unit in the new shell... verified the adjuster arm moved... seems like the vacuum valve isn't operating the vanes.
 
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