pro and con's of EGR removal

kraftwerkturbo

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2014
Location
Brighton, MI
TDI
2005 Golf 1.9 TDI auto
Installing new used BEW engine in my 2005 Golf auto. Debating if I should 'clean up' and delete the EGR (and other stuff) as I normally do on my gas engines? First TDI, so no experience. What are the benefits (obviously declutter, access, space, one less thing to fail. Else?) And disadvantages (slower warm up? Other?).
 

kraftwerkturbo

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2014
Location
Brighton, MI
TDI
2005 Golf 1.9 TDI auto
Only disadvantage is a code without a tune.
Engine will be custome tune, so no issue.
I assumed the warm up (already bad on my TDI) will take even longer, since the coolant going through the EGR cooler does not 'pick up' the head from the exhaust gas? Not so?
 

ScottySK

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Location
Beaumont, AB (CA)
TDI
03 Jetta GLS
EGR removal affecting warm up times is debatable. Maybe if the EGR cooler is clean without soot buildup you'd see a difference in warm up time removing it. My ALH; I see no distinguishable change. Winter warm up time is improved greatly by blocking the rad. I go as far as blocking off my intercooler as well to keep intake temperatures a little warmer & completely blocking the lower valence & centre grille.
 
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Wankel7

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2012
Location
Indiana
TDI
2003 Jetta Wagon
Mine is fully deleted with a race pipe. I have noted longer warm up times but I have my radiator fully blocked and pipe insulation on the grills.

My ASV finally failed and the EGR was leaking oil so it seemed like a good time to remove it all. I get a CEL about every 3000 miles.

I drained my intercooler and only a little oil came out so I am not too worried about an oil fueled runaway.
 

kraftwerkturbo

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2014
Location
Brighton, MI
TDI
2005 Golf 1.9 TDI auto
Ok, EGR comes off. Looks like 3 block off plates needed (2 at the valve, 1 at the manifold).
Any good DIY how to plug up those holes?
DIY for fabbing the plugs or block off plates?
Or at least good source for the kit?
 

Edstarnes

Active member
Joined
Jul 20, 2010
Location
FL/GA
TDI
2011 Jetta TDI
I went with Darkside Developments kit. Quick shipping. The coolant hose I had to modify. Check twice when purchasing. I got the wrong one. All worked out ok.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Wankel7

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2012
Location
Indiana
TDI
2003 Jetta Wagon
I went with Darkside Developments kit. Quick shipping. The coolant hose I had to modify. Check twice when purchasing. I got the wrong one. All worked out ok.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I got the coolant hose for my ALH from Darkside...pretty slick and cheaper than anybody in the US.
 

Powder Hound

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 25, 1999
Location
Under a Bridge, Crestview, FL, USA
TDI
'00 Golf 4dr White 5sp, '02 Jettachero 5sp, Wife's '03 NB Platinum Gray auto(!)
Many many moons ago, I saw some emissions data that showed a very narrow band where using EGR actually improved fuel economy in diesels. I am of the opinion that the improvement would get lost in background noise if you were charting it. So for me, there's no downside to the elimination of EGR. In addition, we're close to the east coast. Any excess NOx generated here has a very long time to be converted to plankton fertilizer before it could spoil anyone's day across the pond.

Cheers,

PH
 

Grussing

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Location
Mn
TDI
99.5 06 Jetta 14Cummins
A very slight amount of EGR at light cruise, will simulate a smaller displacement engine, because of the inert gas taking up space in the cylinder, any mileage increase would be hard to chart because the lowering of the cylinder temp by EGR also takes away from the engines thermal efficiency.
 

TDI_G

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2011
Location
Sugar Hill, Georgia
TDI
None Currently- 2008 BMW 335I
I have noticed that my ALH takes longer to heat up with the EGR cooler removed. With that said, the other benefits already mentioned outweigh the longer warm-up.
 

kraftwerkturbo

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2014
Location
Brighton, MI
TDI
2005 Golf 1.9 TDI auto
A very slight amount of EGR at light cruise, will simulate a smaller displacement engine, because of the inert gas taking up space in the cylinder, any mileage increase would be hard to chart because the lowering of the cylinder temp by EGR also takes away from the engines thermal efficiency.
Just out of curiosity:

- why does a slight amount of exhaust gas (instead of the same amount of fresh air) simulate a smaller displacement engine? Aside from the lower oxygen content in the cylinder with recirculated exhaust gas.

- why would inert gas increase the gas mileage. Unless the ECU knows (which it might, assuming MAF sensor signal and EGR signal allow an accurate enough oxygen balance calculation) that less oxygen is available and reduces the amount of injected fuel (and power, so not comparing apples with apples) for a fuel savings at reduced power

In this context a really diesel newbie question:

Is the diesel ECU determining (from driver input) the amount of fuel needed, and then calls up (turbo) the required air?

Or the other way around, determines the air requirement (boost, MAF) and then injects the fuel (like on gas engine)?
 

Grussing

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Location
Mn
TDI
99.5 06 Jetta 14Cummins
Under light load the engine dose not need all of its displacement to power the vehicle, so the EGR fills part of the cylinder with inert gas this gas is not metered by the mass air sensor so the computer will add less fuel, this in theory making it a smaller displacement engine. This is what a ford diesel engineer told me so it's probably wrong!!
 
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e84

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2014
Location
Windsor
TDI
blue 2002 ALH 5spd Jetta
So the only benefits are to declutter the engine compartment? Do you gain any power? Doesn't really seem worth it to me... the engineers must of put it there for a reason.
 

Grussing

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Location
Mn
TDI
99.5 06 Jetta 14Cummins
So the only benefits are to declutter the engine compartment? Do you gain any power? Doesn't really seem worth it to me... the engineers must of put it there for a reason.
You will gain power, have cleaner oil, and probably gain MPG, the primary goal of the EGR program is to lower NOX, so as I posted earlier you will likely gain thermal efficacy, I'm just saying if the egr was programmed for mpg only it would help mpg.
 
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