Prices for new 2005 TDis?

[digbyn]

Hi All,

OK, here is the story.
We live in San Francisco, CA and as many of you know we cannot buy a TDi new, they must have 7,500 miles on them and then be imported into the state. This creates a premium price. My problem is I do not know what the original price for these cars was as VW.com does not sell the Passat Sedan TDi anymore? Furthermore, what do you guys think of these prices?

2004 Used Volkswagen Passat GLS TDI 25,000 $25,495 cloth
2004 Used Volkswagen Passat GLS TDI 24,000 $25,995 leatherette
2004 Used Volkswagen Passat GLS TDI 16,800 $27,900 leatherette
2005 Used Volkswagen Passat GLS TDI 16,000 $28,495 leatherette
2004 Used Volkswagen Passat GLS TDI 7,525 $27,900 leatherette
2005 Used Volkswagen Passat GLS TDI 8,119 $28,900 leather

Thanks for your help, Digs

 

[dieseldorf]

Digs, welcome aboard. You should be able to grab original MSRPs at Edmund's, etc., FWIW. Keep in mind, you really don't want to try to buy one of these red-hot machines during a severe fuel crunch. you will not be able to correlate your pricing to anything meaningful.

Also, have you had a chance to introduce yourself to Harvieux (to your south in Orange Cty) or Steve Ahl (to your north)? if not, you haven't explored all your local TDi options. Those two good folks make the CA market when it comes to diesel autos! Introduce yourself!

take care.

 

[jdelscott]

I just pulled my sticker out: $26,734. I paid $26,200 in March in Maryland. Thats for a 2005 GLS, leatherette w/ seat heaters.
I also recommend waiting unil after fuel prices become more reasonable. Its a great car worth waiting for. I still get excited when I'm driving it.

 

[anointedhelp]

Just 3 weeks ago, I paid $27,200 (not including tax & tag) for a 2005 Passat GLS (Leather interior) in Atlanta, GA. So, the price you have for the 2005 Passat seems reasonable.

 

[ADW_squared]

I paid $26,300 for my 2005 GLS S/W (leatherette, cold weather, and esp). Use edmunds to find out what your 2004's should cost (you can't eval a used 2005), and that should show you the "CARB" factor premium...

ADW^2

 

[keypecker]

sorry in advance......

I found a used 2005 Passat GLS w/482 miles when all was said & done $22,500 inc. TTT that was about 3 months ago. before the hurricanes.

 

[LightningTDI]

Sweet deal!

 

[sleze]

Would you explain why you can't buy new TDIs in CA?

 

[tomo366]

it is not just California, there are 5 Carb states

 

[festivus]

It has everything to do with emissions. I was lucky enough to own a rental home in Las Vegas last August when I bought my 2004 Passat GL TDI. I registered and insured it in Las Vegas, drove it home, and after 7500 miles, took it to AAA Auto Club and re-registered and re-insured it in California. It wasn't much of a hassle, and so long as I provided something to the Las Vegas dealership so that they could cover themselves, they couldn't care less.

 

[sleze]

So they blanket ban a car from the state? Can't you just get it inspected with B100 in the tank and lower the emissions?

 

[VeeDubs]

Bought my 2005 new GLS TDI sedan in Salt Lake Sep 1st (a few days after Hurricane #1).

Sticker $26,235, paid $25,400.

One of last two in state.

Glen

 

[bigEZ]

So they blanket ban a car from the state? Can't you just get it inspected with B100 in the tank and lower the emissions?

it's their rules; they can do what they want. carb regulations are in a big part due to severe smog issues in big cities (think la); diesels are worse on the smog-forming pollutants end, and that's what is being targeted. la is never overcast; just some days, the smog is thicker than others. i think it's more of the fact that there are too many effing people, not too many effing diesels!

 

[SootFoot]

And due to the sloooooooow moving traffic, and a bazillion cars and trucks spending more time idling stopped in heavy traffic than moving. Idling is the worst for emissions.

 

[sleze]

God bless Pennsylvania

 

[JungleDeath]

$23,500. 05' GL Sedan. Reno.

 

[ufoguy]

a couple of weeks ago my dealer in little rock, arkansas had one 05 passat TDI left and is trying to get $2,000 over MSRP for it. i have heard that other dealers are wanting full MSRP or MSRP plus a premium. has anyone else seen dealers gouging on new TDIs?

you did well on your purchase. i bought mine in february for about $2,000 off MSRP.

the resale value of our TDIs has increased for sure recently. but i can't think of any other car i would want in the near future so i guess i won't ever see any benefit to the increase in resale value. unless an 06 or 07 passat TDI becomes available.

 

[tdireader]

I was looking for a second TDI passat fully loaded in August. I gave up and ordered an A5 once katrina left. I only found one vehicle w/ in 1500 miles and it was sold out from under me.

Once katrina hit, the A5's cleared out pretty quick and what was left of the passats started disapearing quickly.

Even passats tdi are fetching a premium these days. Given the EPA mileage rating, I think $2000-$3000 is asking a bit too much for a panic buying cycle. An A5 is a different story (10+ extra mpg).

 

[brawnwgn]

This in the Seattle Times classifieds:
"2005 Passat Wagon GLS Tdi- 5k 40+mpg $31,999 206.719.1503"

Looks like they're testing the waters.

 

[ufoguy]

if they can get that i will sell mine as well and get into a 2006 gas passat.

fat chance.

a person would be foolish to pay a multi thousand premium for a TDI. the TDI costs about $1,200 extra to start and a couple of grand extra would make the difference in fuel economy between a gas a diesel model unjustifiable. a person would have to drive half a million miles to recoup the premium. i've never paid near MSRP let alone a premium for an auto in my life....never will.

 

[bigEZ]

a person would be foolish to pay a multi thousand premium for a TDI.

now, substitute "hybrid" for "tdi," and let's analyze that one...

 

[ufoguy]

a person would be foolish to pay a multi thousand premium for a TDI.

now, substitute "hybrid" for "tdi," and let's analyze that one...

yes, an excellent point. an even worse scenario. no way to justify the difference in cost. i remember this crap from the 1979-1980 era. a diesel rabbit was $1,000 more than a gas model and no discount by dealers. i had just graduated from college and could somewhat use a calculator, no way to justify it then either as i considered a rabbit diesel.

btw - i will NEVER forgive the car dealers for the gouging they did on economy cars during previous fuel shortages back in the dark ages. i hope they suck wind as their inventories of unsold SUVs begin to bloat.

a lot of folks are going to get sucked into the hybrid push. unproven technology - what does a set of new batteries cost for a prius? a whole lot more than a timing belt for sure.

i feel much better now. thank ya....thank ya very much.

 

[ufoguy]

$23,500. 05' GL Sedan. Reno.

for a TDI? new? no gouging there.

 

[turbokrash]

*fat chance. a person would be foolish to pay a multi thousand premium for a TDI. the TDI costs about $1,200 extra to start and a couple of grand extra would make the difference in fuel economy between a gas a diesel model unjustifiable. a person would have to drive half a million miles to recoup the premium. i've never paid near MSRP let alone a premium for an auto in my life....never will*


....ummm, NO...I have people calling me that are spending several HUNDREDS of dollars a month on fuel...the profit on a new 2006 Jetta TDI with package 1 is $1158(from invoice to sticker)not a lot of profit for such an in demand, unique vehicle.

so, even if they paid over sticker wouldn't take long to recoup any premimum paid

 

[JungleDeath]

$23,500. 05' GL Sedan. Reno.

for a TDI? new? no gouging there.

We were there for a Jetta Wagon. We just assumed the Passat was out of the budget. The J wagon we test drove was 24 & change

 

[deming]

Basic law of supply and demand.
When the quantity supplied is low and the demand is high, the qantitity demanded goes up and the prices go up.

I wish we had purchased a third TDI Passat this past spring!

 

[king908]

Wow, I got really lucky. I bought mine in January just before gas took a hike. I bought a '05 Passat GLS TDI with Leatherette. I had my credit union search around for me in the State of NJ. I paid 23,200 for the car. Amazing the prices now

 

[ufoguy]

*fat chance. a person would be foolish to pay a multi thousand premium for a TDI. the TDI costs about $1,200 extra to start and a couple of grand extra would make the difference in fuel economy between a gas a diesel model unjustifiable. a person would have to drive half a million miles to recoup the premium. i've never paid near MSRP let alone a premium for an auto in my life....never will*


....ummm, NO...I have people calling me that are spending several HUNDREDS of dollars a month on fuel...the profit on a new 2006 Jetta TDI with package 1 is $1158(from invoice to sticker)not a lot of profit for such an in demand, unique vehicle.

so, even if they paid over sticker wouldn't take long to recoup any premimum paid

oh, i see. then the new buyer will not have to buy fuel for the TDI?

my calculations show that there is about a ten mpg difference on average between the gas and diesel. at 2.95 for gasoline and 3.20 for diesel, that makes a difference of about 3.41 cents per mile. at that rate it will take 35,000 miles to recoup the $1,200 TDI premium, 93,800 miles to recoup TDI premium plus no MSRP discount ($3,200 total), and 152,500 miles to recoup TDI premium, MSRP, plus a $2,000 additional markup ($5,200 total).

simply put, paying thousands more for a TDI is not justified unless the buyer plans to keep the car for a couple of hundred thousand miles. it appears that most buyers of diesels do keep their cars for a longer period of time than gassers.

later.

 

[ibyte]

ufoguy - think your math is missing the maintenance cost and the eventual difference of price when selling the vehicle. there should be alittle difference in used car prices of gas and diesel engine vehicles.

 

[deming]

My .02 on this subject.

We bought the Diesel VW's because my family is engaged in farming here in the U.S. and the TDI motor is a great motor. My family farm grows Soybeans here in the Midwest and they are used to make high grade B-100 in one of several new refineries that have come online in the last 12-16 months. In Illinois and Minnesota B-11 out of the pump is around $2.85. I just purhcased 1000 gallons of "on road" with BP Premier with 20% of B-100 for a total blend of B-20 (treated with Power Service) and the price was $2.855. We use this in the semis and three TDI's year round with no problems. We also use "off Road" B20% in our John Deere equipment, which includes two 9650 STS comnbines on a year round basis. We have yet to have any fuel related problems or concerns. It also gets pretty cold here in the winter.

The State of Illinois provides a tax credit to those who use B11 or higher in their vehicles and machinery. Minnesota is also doing something very similiar and the state of Minnesota just started mandating Bio Blends in all retail pumps year round. Very progressive!
You see it is a good idea to burn a renewable energy source in your Diesel car and support American Farmers and american grown products. It is also cheaper to use Bio blends and get twice and sometines 3 tines the fuel economy when compared to the Gaz Guzzlers. Needles to say, the Sequoia does not get driven too much anymore unless I am pulling a boat or we have 3 feet of snow.

Buy what makes (sense and cents) to you. The TDI has a far better resale value when compared to a gasser. Therefore you get it back on the trade / resale of the car.
How much more money is a TDI Passat worth right now as compared to a 1.8T gasser or VR6? Which is going to be easier to sell right now?

Last but not least, would have wanted to be stuck fleeing Houston in a gasser Passat or the TDI? Duh!
Diesel was plentiful and the unleaded gas was all gone when everyone was hurrying to get out of town before the Hurricane smashed ashore.

Lets take a closer look at this scenario,---
my gasser 1.8 T has a range of 400 miles and the Diesel has a range of 600 (Vented). I am easily getting 12-15 miles to the gallon better economy and I do not get shafted having to buy premium unleaded for a Turbo gas engine. I live in a state that provides tax relief for those who burn natural renewable fuels and I pay almost the same for my high quality diesel as I do unleaded. Double the range and double the mileage for only $1200. The fuel economy increase with my TDI actually saves me more than $100.00 per month in fuel costs. The $1200 is negligible when you are buying a new car. If you can depreciate the cost of the car over 3-5 years (MACRS), then who really cares.

I know the big corporate fleets like Dupont have been scrambling to get every new TDI they can lay their hands on and that is at MSRP price. I guarantee you will make your $1200 back and then some if you were to list your TDI right now for sale. They are in super high demand and I do not see this Diesel trend fading away anytime soon.

Thanks
Deming