Post Your Dynos Here Ii

jsrmonster

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Ed's TDI said:
Okay so I understand that a 17% correction factor doesn't necessarily equate to a 17% increase/decrease in horsepower made but I'm curious why the dyno guys at Kinetic would choose 17% as their correction factor if your claim is that it should only be 1-2%. Their explaination, according to the techs from Dyno-Dynamics that setup their dyno and schooled them on how to use it, is that this was the correction factor to use for this machine in their location based on all the information they normally use to fine-tune all of these particular dyno units.

When your dyno was set up in your shop, you had a rep from that company help you guys out with instruction on how to use it, etc, etc, right? So why do you not use any correction factors, even though you already agreed that correction factors are used to ensure that you would get consistent results?
Ed's TDI - spins again!

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?&id=2204285&postid=46390061#46390061

What's new in your ride besides the tune? Hopefully we can hook up when I visit BC.

Jeff
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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It's all about fuel (kind of)

I dyno'd IBW again today after upgrading from PP520s to PP502s. No other changes to the car. So you don't have to flip back and forth, here's the dyno from February 23:

The one that ends at lower revs is from the NE dyno day last fall.
And here's today's:

I failed to remind the operator to ignore the redline and keep going to fuel cutout, but I'm confident the curve would resemble the red line, which is the one from Feb. 23.
And here is boost and fuel/air tables.

The red line is from two weeks ago, the blue from today. The car did smoke more, no doubt, but it wasn't a blackout. And as you can see, boost is rock solid. My boostvalve is screwed all the way in--basically shut off. No spikes.

So to me it reads like a gain of about 12 ft/lbs. of torque and 19+ HP. I think I'm finally getting to the point where all the air handling mods are really paying off. The car did experience some significant heat soak on multiple runs: It may be time for larger intercooler piping.

Oh, and the odometer rolled over 180K last night. Head's never been off. Try that in a Subaru. :p
 
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delvi__acevedo

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Milford, PA ,USA
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Getta GLS,2001,silver
IndigoBlueWagon said:
I dyno'd IBW again today after upgrading from PP520s to PP502s. No other changes to the car. So you don't have to flip back and forth, here's the dyno from February 22:

The one that ends at lower revs is from the NE dyno day last fall.
And here's today's:

I failed to remind the operator to ignore the redline and keep going to fuel cutout, but I'm confident the curve would resemble the earlier one, which is the one from Feb. 22.
And here is boost and fuel/air tables.

The red line is from two weeks ago, the blue from today. The car did smoke more, no doubt, but it wasn't a blackout. And as you can see, boost is rock solid. My boostvalve is screwed all the way in--basically shut off. No spikes.

So to me it reads like a gain of about 12 ft/lbs. of torque and 19+ HP. I think I'm finally getting to the point where all the air handling mods are really paying off. The car did experience some significant heat soak on multiple runs: Bill (at DSG) suggested that it may be time for larger intercooler piping.

Oh, and the odometer rolled over 180K last night. Head's never been off. Try that in a Subaru. :p

Very nice Peter!! I hope I can dyno soon too, I'm working on the intercooler now.
 

Ed's TDI

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'01 Bora and '97 A4 1.8T Quattro (future TDI conversion maybe?)
Very nice power gain. You gained 20 hp just from going up in nozzle size from the .205's to .232's. Obviously there was room for more fuel ... which leaves me with some questions:

What kind of boost levels are you running with your setup? And what made you decide to go with the 502's over the R520's or the 7-hole R520's? Couldn't you run larger nozzles with the hybrid turbo and still produce enough boost to keep smoke levels down and produce enough power?
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Good questions. The third graph shows boost, pretty steady at 25 PSI from about 2K on. The second set of lines shows Air/Fuel ratio: The 502s brought it down from 16 to 15. I honestly don't know if further lowering this number would help or not. I suspect it might, and HP may continue to build as revs rise if the engine had more fuel.

I picked the 502s on Jeff's recommendation: He said he built the tune for those nozzles and an 11mm pump. So I went with it. I don't want smoke at low RPMs, and larger nozzles may cause that. And Kerma's 7-holes aren't available to me. ;)

What I understand is that the ECU's fueling limit is 51mg/stroke. The way to get fuel beyond that is to put in bigger nozzles. But it's a compromise, because the car may over-fuel under light load, or smoke on tip-in when boost is building, in order to get the right amount of fuel at high load/revs. You can tune some of that out, but it's still a compromise. I want it all: good power, low smoke, good economy. This setup may deliver all three: I don't see any smoke in daily driving and I'm still getting low to mid-40s in mixed driving.

I've got a similar tune in my Golf, but set up for a 10mm pump and VNT-15 (class rules). I'm going to upgrade the PP357s in it to PP520s, and see if Jeff can tune out some of the fuel at low revs to reduce the spiking (the 15 does tend to spike with an agressive tune) and smoke so I don't attract attention on the track. I also need to keep EGTs down: some of the straights I run are well over 1/2 mile. It's all a balancing act.

EDIT: Remember, this car also has 180K on it. I want to go to 250K before pulling the head and doing some rebuilding/upgrades. So durability is important, too.
 
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Varkias

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Turners Falls, MA
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'02 Golf TDI
Just for some comparison to IBW's car, here is mine from the same dyno, same day last fall. I'm running PP520's with RC 3 ASV and BLUBYU's OMI. Stock IC, IP, Airbox, intake and piping.

 

Sootman

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Maine Coast
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2011 Golf TDI
Those are great curves, actually both you and Peter's car shows what good tuning can accomplish.
 

Varkias

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'02 Golf TDI
Thanks. It's an amazing improvement over what I had the first time I was on a dyno. I'm really very happy with where the car is right now. While I would love to be able to put the time in money that you, Peter and others have into my car, there just really isn't a need. It's faster then I need it to be already.
 

Sootman

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Ed's right! This is disease with no know cure, however gobs of cash and a credit card will provide temporary relief:D
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Varkias said:
Thanks. It's an amazing improvement over what I had the first time I was on a dyno. I'm really very happy with where the car is right now. While I would love to be able to put the time in money that you, Peter and others have into my car, there just really isn't a need. It's faster then I need it to be already.
Get a downpipe (where, I wonder?) and exhaust and the 6000 RPM tune for your turbo. The exhaust will improve your fuel economy. Yeah, that's it.:D
 

Varkias

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IndigoBlueWagon said:
Get a downpipe (where, I wonder?) and exhaust and the 6000 RPM tune for your turbo. The exhaust will improve your fuel economy. Yeah, that's it.:D
Sounds like a plan! As soon as Sootman's credit card arrives in the mail, I'll give you a call. :cool: (that was an offer, right steve?)
 

KROUT

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JAX FL
IndigoBlueWagon said:
Get a downpipe (where, I wonder?) and exhaust and the 6000 RPM tune for your turbo. The exhaust will improve your fuel economy. Yeah, that's it.:D
I thought jeff said you needed pump mods to have a 6000rpm tune. Wont that ruin a stock pump. He said you needed better springs inside the pump. Are you running the 6000 rpm tune with a stock pump?
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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You bet. On two cars. So far, so good. Jeff has a minor mod that will keep the case pressure relief valve from popping, but I haven't needed it yet.

I figure I'll learn this summer what will break on the Golf when I run it on the track, but I don't plan to frequently go much over 5000 RPM. It's just great to get real power all the way up there instead of the thing just dying out.
 

KROUT

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IndigoBlueWagon said:
You bet. On two cars. So far, so good. Jeff has a minor mod that will keep the case pressure relief valve from popping, but I haven't needed it yet.

I figure I'll learn this summer what will break on the Golf when I run it on the track, but I don't plan to frequently go much over 5000 RPM. It's just great to get real power all the way up there instead of the thing just dying out.
How does it compair to rc5. Or is it basically rc5 with higher rev limiter?

I want to try it or at least ride in a car that has it.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Midrange is the same. The air tables are now all correct for the larger MAF housing, so low speed response is better. Jeff built mine with a 25 PSI max, although he says the turbo can go to 28 PSI in the midrange.

The big difference is as you pass 4000 RPM it just keeps pulling--hard. Past 5000, more of the same. Peg the tach, keeps pulling. Too bad we cut the dyno run short, but I bet my car is still making over 150 HP at 5800. Cutout is at 6000 RPM or so. So imagine pulling hard to 90 in 3rd, over 120 in 4th. You get the idea. And no smoke.
 

johnnloki

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bowmanville ON
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IndigoBlueWagon said:
Midrange is the same. The air tables are now all correct for the larger MAF housing, so low speed response is better. Jeff built mine with a 25 PSI max, although he says the turbo can go to 28 PSI in the midrange.

The big difference is as you pass 4000 RPM it just keeps pulling--hard. Past 5000, more of the same. Peg the tach, keeps pulling. Too bad we cut the dyno run short, but I bet my car is still making over 150 HP at 5800. Cutout is at 6000 RPM or so. So imagine pulling hard to 90 in 3rd, over 120 in 4th. You get the idea. And no smoke.
It'll be interesting to see you race test that tune this year. That's the true test of the stock pump vs reman pump question. Good on you for testing and demonstrating it, Peter. No better way to find the limits of hardware than someone putting their money where their mouth is.

On your average car, though- you know, a 'daily' tuned car- the cars that most all of us on this board drive, 98% of the time someone with that tune isn't going to be revving the hell out of it just for ishts and iggles, so an aggressive fuel cut RPM limit being there won't be an issue (although it's always there if you want it).

If most of us are honest, we'll admit that it's a special occaision that we rev beyond 4000, so the 'harm' that can come to a pump just because it's now got the option to rev 2000RPMs higher is pretty well a moot point. Extra power (and power band) available doesn't mean extra power that you have to use... nor even extra power at the high end at the expense of the low end. If you're other hardware is qualified for RC6, I can think of no good reason not to.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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You're right, and remember where all that torque is. 2000 to 4000 RPM is still the fun zone.
 

hatemi

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Finland
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Audi A6 4F 3.0TDI
All of you wi th RC6 should realy consider upgrading the cam. My last version that was a regrind made all the difference past 4k. The car seemed just so much hapier in that zone. When I put the stock cam back the power and pretty much the spirit of the engine went away.

www.dbilas.com sells 3 different cams for TDI and one for PD. The 260 version should be pretty damn good. Too bad it has too little lift for me ;) I'm going to have a cam made with 11mm of lift and around 260degrees. Too bad there arent any good profiles available for that.
 
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