Pics of coolant migration preventative measure.

Birdman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 7, 1999
Location
Near Hagerstown MD.
TDI
Jetta 2001 Died by Truck one snowy day. Jetta 2003
Well TOMOS is a 2002 I have a 01 with no problems yet. His is less than a year old with low miles. Looks like some bottles are good and some bad. Looks like another class action suit like the window regs. Only this is really a safty issue and should be registered with the NTSB.
 

tomo366

TDI Lifer, Member #68
Joined
Jun 30, 1997
Location
Kensington, Maryland USA
TDI
2015 Jetta SEL TDI
I dried the connector out on Sunday today after the 500 mile trip back it was full again.
Waiting to hear when I can take the Car in for repairs. /images/graemlins/frown.gif
 

tomo366

TDI Lifer, Member #68
Joined
Jun 30, 1997
Location
Kensington, Maryland USA
TDI
2015 Jetta SEL TDI
Frank,
I don't know what to think at this point........
I know that I have a 2002 Jetta that has a Coolant infiltrated wiring harness. I bought the car in November of last and have had problems from the beginning The A/C has failed 3 times Related to the coolant infiltration? I don't know, probably why didn't the dealership tell me something?
I am not going to take this car back to them.
I am looking for a friendly knowledgable LOL! to fix the car now.
We will see...............
 

POWERSTROKE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 17, 2000
Location
Staten Island (The Dump)
TDI
2002 Golf
Hmmm...this is very unfortunate Tom...I really feel for you. I do not know what to make of this. I would have to say it is a defective bottle. What is your mileage Tom?
 

Sun Baked GL

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2000
Location
Furnace Valley, AZ
Re: Pics of coolant migration preventative measure

Rattle blugg's cage, he went through this on his car.

And listed the parts the Beaudry replaced.

a quick search on beaudry AND coolant should bring up his comments on the experience.
 

MaxThrust

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2003
Location
Twosun, AZ
TDI
99.5 Jetta
I read these posts and got all paranoid. I ran out and checked my 99.5 Jettta and the bottle doesn't look like the pictures above. My bottle is considerably larger with the plug almost to the very top of the bottle. I did unplug the connector and it's bone dry. I also took the opportunity to put a small weep hold as far into the connector as I could get without touching anything but the plastice shroud around the plug itself. I used a small metal probe and heated it with a lighter and carefully poked it through from the outside. It was quick, easy, and should offer a bit of piece-of-mind. I think this will be something I check from time to time during maintenance.
Mike
 

MaxThrust

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2003
Location
Twosun, AZ
TDI
99.5 Jetta
I will post a picture when I get home from work. Today is the wife's day to drive the Jetta....I have to drive the Navigator...and yes, I would much rather drive the Jetta. We take turns driving the Jetta, it keeps the peace.
Mike
 

mrGutWrench

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 29, 2002
Location
Carrboro, NC
TDI
'03 Jetta Wagon, 5-speed, 563K Miles (July '23)
__. A thought at a bit of an angle. It looks hard to get a drill bit (or small hot wire) under the expansion tank to drill (or melt) upwards. My thought was to drill down (or melt down) from the top. When I get my drain hole opened up, I'll then seal up the top hole, replace the connector, and drive away happy.
 

McBrew

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Location
Annapolis, MD
TDI
2003 Golf GLS TDI, 5 speed, Silver/Grey
Frank, here's what my bottle looks like in my 2003 Golf. It's hard to tell because the angle of my picture is different than Jackmc's pic, but it looks pretty close to me... other than my bottle being nice and white, while the older one is yellow /images/graemlins/smirk.gif.

 

MaxThrust

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2003
Location
Twosun, AZ
TDI
99.5 Jetta
Here are the pics I promised to post. It has been very hectic around here lately, not to mention, all my girls, inlcuding my wife are sick. Gah!
Looking at them, my bottle isn't much different. I did use a 90* probe heated up to poke a hole at the bottom of the plug shroud as extra insurance. Notice the White-Out™ like substance on the side of the plug. I wonder if this was done during a check-up of some sort? I would also ask that no one comments on my dirty car. Did I mention how hectic it's been the past couple of weeks?



And a second view, they are a bit blurred, but I took them freehand, at night so I couldn't focus the camera very well.



I had originally planned to post them because I felt that my plug angle and placement was higher than I was seeing from others. I think it may have just been the angle of the picture itself. I think I will just check the plug at each oil change. I don't know if it will really be that much of a worry out here in Tucson, AZ...it's fairly warm, and usually dry. Wet items tend to dry very quickly, some things, too quickly.

Mike /images/graemlins/cool.gif
 

dieselt

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2004
Location
maine
TDI
jetta, 2000, green
Many of us have driven and operated vehicles with out coolant level sensing. Why are we operating a vehicle with a sensor connected that has the potential to destroy major parts of the electrical system? I'm new with this forum, but it would make sense to eliminate the problem by excluding the "hermetically" sealed harness and connection until a redesign is made (by one of us) of the wiring and migration problem. It's just a level sensor...the temp gage is still my primary for monitoring cooling system function. /images/graemlins/confused.gif

ps: great post and pics /images/graemlins/smile.gif
 

jackbombay

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Location
Diesel knows best
TDI
A4 Jetta
Mine is dry at 40,000.

However I was thainking about cutting both wires to the sensor and putting male and female spade connectors on them respectivley and then coolant obviously could not travell past the connectors.

Thoughts?

-Jack
 

mgwerks

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2003
Location
Texas Hill Country
TDI
black 1999 New Beetle
I do not have this issue on my 99 NB. Yet. Maybe I am just dense, but I can't picture the mechanism by where this happens. I am assuming it is capillary action in the harness. Is the coolant migrating between the wires themselves and their respective insulation coatings, or between the insulated wires and the harness? Anyone know? Tom?

I am thinking that the hole-driling mod might not prevent the travel of fluid, depending on the point of uptake into the harness. Other simple fixes might, however.
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
I am assuming it is capillary action in the harness.
Mark, that terminology (capillary action) is fine. This is something everyone should check periodically. A forum brother came to my house about 3 weeks ago to have his car scanned. He was getting an intermittant CEL. It was due to the coolant temp sensor reporting out of range. Just for laughs I pulled his coolant resevoir connector and guess what! Yeah, it was all wet with pink coolant though the coolant level on the bottle appeared normal.

I armed the owner with the TSB covering coolant migration and he went to the dealership with it. His ('02, auto Jetta) is still under extended warranty and the dealer pleaded insanity and wouldn't help him...
..even after seeing the TSB. The dealer has since corrected the problem.


<font color="red"> The only thing worse than EGR+CCV is coolant migration ! BEWARE </font>
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
<font color="blue">So people can understand the magnitude of this issue, the TSB covering the repair is seventeen (17) pages in length. </font>
 

dlai

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 6, 2002
Location
The Insane Asylum Known As CA
TDI
2005 Passat, Stonehenge Gray, 2002 Black Golf 5M
The only thing worse than EGR+CCV is coolant migration !
Having just had this whole thing happen to my car, DD is absolute correct. In my mind, this is the very worst thing that can happen to our TDIs. My coolant migration took out my dash cluster, my a/c controls, and coolant even made it's way into the fuel tank via the fuel sender! No extended warranty on my car, so I'm busy doing battle with the dealer at the moment to get them to pay for all or some of this extremely expensive repair. Lito posted a different fix that involves taking out the orange gasket in the coolant harness. As he stated, it allows the coolant tank to be pressurized but prevents the harness to be pressurized. The dealer had to rip tons of stuff out of my car to get to all the harnesses, so the labor cost alone will break one's bank account.

The coolant level in my bottle was normal, and I checked for this problem every 10k miles, but even checking at that interval was not enough. One needs to make checking for the coolant migration issue a part of their regular service routine. Don't suffer what I went through, it's an expensive and painful ordeal!
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
Dan, sorry to hear that. It's a severe condition and VWoA should not be permitted to weasel out of their liability on this one. It's shameful. Sheesh, I trade breaking window regulator coverage for this one any day.


If people are worried about this, I guess there are four things that could be done as a pre-emptive strike, those being:

  1. Remove the orange gasket from the connector
  2. Drill the tiny relief hole in the connector bulkhead
  3. Get the updated coolant bottle*
  4. replace existing connector with spade style connetors


*the TSB doesn't list the revised coolant bottle P/N...maybe someone has it ?
 

mgwerks

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2003
Location
Texas Hill Country
TDI
black 1999 New Beetle
I am assuming it is capillary action in the harness.
Mark, that terminology (capillary action) is fine. This is something everyone should check periodically. A forum brother came to my house about 3 weeks ago to have his car scanned. He was getting an intermittant CEL. It was due to the coolant temp sensor reporting out of range. Just for laughs I pulled his coolant resevoir connector and guess what! Yeah, it was all wet with pink coolant though the coolant level on the bottle appeared normal.
Through what space is the coolant travelling? If I were to take a harness that has already suffered from this, and cut through it, would I find coolant between the harness and the insulation of the wires, or between the insulation and the wires themselves? Two different actions, two different possibilities.


<font color="blue">So people can understand the magnitude of this issue, the TSB covering the repair is seventeen (17) pages in length. </font>
Figures.
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
I believe it's wicking down the copper strands of wire. It can travel remarkable distances and do huge damage...it's a silent killer
 

dlai

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 6, 2002
Location
The Insane Asylum Known As CA
TDI
2005 Passat, Stonehenge Gray, 2002 Black Golf 5M
Mine was through the insulation and wire itself. The dash cluster harness was also wet and parts of the cluster electrics were wet as well. Those shorted out. Coolant also made it's way in to, yes in to, my "gas" tank...


VW is backing away from my car since it has every mod known to mankind. Ok, every mod known to us here at TDIclub. They freaked out at the Up Stage 3 kit, the Pierburg MAF, the Old Navy CCV filter, the CAT filter, yada, yada...but all of those have nothing to do with the coolant migration issue, so I'm standing my ground with them. It's a very ugly battle right now, and so far they have refused to pay me anything. The battle continues however, so the case is not shut. Funny thing is that they offered to pay me back for the Pierburg MAF when they saw it. Go figure...
 

jackbombay

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Location
Diesel knows best
TDI
A4 Jetta
4. replace existing connector with spade style connetors
I was thinking about using the existing connector and cutting the wires and reconnecting them with spade connectors so it would look a little more professional. Butt splice connectors would also break the path for fluid to travell along and might fit back inside the wire housing if the were offset.

-Jack
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
Jack, now that you mention it, someone else did describe that method. It sounds reasonable.

I'd like to find the cost of the updated recovery bottle and just fix it the proper way.
 
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