PD BEW won't start after Diesel Purge

jmarvin

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
Hey guys, so I was in the middle of doing a fuel injector cleaning with Diesel Purge just like the tutorial in this thread here. Well, I stepped away for just a minute and when I came back one of the hoses fell out of the bottle and then shortly after that the car died. I tried priming the system by turning the key to the ON position multiple times but the car still will not start. The car is a 2004 Jetta PD BEW. Can somebody help me? Thanks.
 

Metal Man

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Sunbury,PA 17801
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1998 NB TDI, 2006 Jetta TDI, 2014 Tiguan gas, , 2019 E Golf X2
Is the pump in the tank running? It should run for a bit every time you turn the key on.
 

Carlos_TJ

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Aug 3, 2014
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Tijuana Mexico
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2009 Bora (BXE PD)
Most likely the fuel line has air inside.
As long as the car was in good running order (lift & tandem pump) it should eventually start.

You could unhook the tandem retun hose and use a plastic container. Crank the car until diesel comes out. Connect the hose again once the car starts.

Just take it easy on the starter. Dont crank for long times. Allow rest times for it to cool off. Having a battery charger will also help.
 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
Got it to finally start after I cranked it for a good 10-15 seconds. Thought all was well, so decided to attempt to do the diesel purge setup again. Started the car and had my dad holding the hoses inside the container making sure that they didn't fall out. After a minute or so of it idling I was about to start revving when it cut out again. Don't know why it would do that, but decided that was enough of trying to clean the injectors and just hooked my car back up to its normal self. Primed half a dozen times again and cranked to no avail. Repeated the process and about the fifth time of cranking I held it about another 10-15 seconds before it finally caught.

Needless to say, that will be the last time I attempt to clean my injectors by hooking up the DP contraption to my fuel filter. Anybody have any clues why the car would cut out a second time of trying to do the purge?
 

Mike_04GolfTDI

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Richmond, BC, Canada
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Mine: 2019 Golf R DSG, Wife's: 2015 Golf Comfortline TDI
Needless to say, that will be the last time I attempt to clean my injectors by hooking up the DP contraption to my fuel filter. Anybody have any clues why the car would cut out a second time of trying to do the purge?
Are you saying you connected it to the fuel filter that's built into the car, not a secondary inline filter that you would use just for doing the purge?

Most people bypass the filter on the car and use a small inline filter, otherwise you're diluting the diesel purge with a lot of fuel.

Here's my car: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zScRn8_eTc0

As for the starting problem, that really sounds like the electric pump in your fuel tank is not working.

When I change my fuel filter, I put it in empty, cycle the key about three times, and then it starts immediately. The one time it didn't was because my pump was dead. Obviously this puts a whole bunch of air through the system (whatever was in the fuel filter), and it seems to handle it just fine, as long as the pump is working.

When you were doing your purge, did you have to pull the fuse to disable the electric pump (#28), or do anything with the hoses to return the fuel flow back to the tank? If you were able to run the car with the fuel supply line disconnected, and nothing came out, then your pump is dead.

Anyway, at this point you just need to see if your pump is working. Disconnect the supply line that goes into your fuel filter, run it into a clean container, and have someone turn the key on. Fuel should come out for a few seconds. If not, that's the problem. You can dump the fuel back in your tank after you do this test.
 

jmarvin

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
Are you saying you connected it to the fuel filter that's built into the car, not a secondary inline filter that you would use just for doing the purge?

Most people bypass the filter on the car and use a small inline filter, otherwise you're diluting the diesel purge with a lot of fuel.

Here's my car: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zScRn8_eTc0

As for the starting problem, that really sounds like the electric pump in your fuel tank is not working.

When I change my fuel filter, I put it in empty, cycle the key about three times, and then it starts immediately. The one time it didn't was because my pump was dead. Obviously this puts a whole bunch of air through the system (whatever was in the fuel filter), and it seems to handle it just fine, as long as the pump is working.

When you were doing your purge, did you have to pull the fuse to disable the electric pump (#28), or do anything with the hoses to return the fuel flow back to the tank? If you were able to run the car with the fuel supply line disconnected, and nothing came out, then your pump is dead.

Anyway, at this point you just need to see if your pump is working. Disconnect the supply line that goes into your fuel filter, run it into a clean container, and have someone turn the key on. Fuel should come out for a few seconds. If not, that's the problem. You can dump the fuel back in your tank after you do this test.
I just finished running this test and the supply line was pushing fuel into the container, so I take it that my pump is working, yes?

I used a little Fram filter just like the setup here. Also, I did pull the #28 fuse before I attempted to the the Diesel Purge. I am sure that since the hose fell out of the container the first time I was doing the purge that this allowed air into the system and that is what made the car stall mid-purge. But, after I primed the system and got the car started, why would the car die again while attempting to purge it a second time?
 

BobnOH

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May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
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New Beetle 2003 manual
It either still had a little air in it or some more got in.
It can take driving the car a bit to completely purge the air from the fuel system.
 

mjydrafter

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Jul 12, 2015
Location
dsm, ia
TDI
2004 Jetta Wagon
When I did the DP treatment, I skipped the extra filter, and rather than pulling the fuse, loop a fuel line from the filter out back to the thermo-tee.

I also use a bottle with gravity feed rather than putting the hoses into the DP bottle.

I think the PDF was written by someone else, but the author mentions he got his write-up directions from Mike_04Golf TDI.:)

Thanks Mike!
 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
It either still had a little air in it or some more got in.
It can take driving the car a bit to completely purge the air from the fuel system.
Do you think I should attempt to do the purge again, if maybe that was the problem?

When I did the DP treatment, I skipped the extra filter, and rather than pulling the fuse, loop a fuel line from the filter out back to the thermo-tee.

I also use a bottle with gravity feed rather than putting the hoses into the DP bottle.

I think the PDF was written by someone else, but the author mentions he got his write-up directions from Mike_04Golf TDI.:)

Thanks Mike!
I cut about an 8-inch line that I just looped from the return to the supply on the filter itself, but I also pulled the fuse. I read somewhere that pulling the fuse while doing the purge would assure that the engine would not get flooded with fuel. If I loop lit like I did, does this mean that I do not have to pull the lift pump fuse?
 

mjydrafter

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dsm, ia
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2004 Jetta Wagon
That is my understanding. That way the lift pump keeps all of the lines full of fuel. With the loop the pump just pumps fuel through the lines & filter, while you run the engine on pure DP.

I'm wondering, if without the fuse, some of the fuel drained back into the tank.
 

BobnOH

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Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
Do you think I should attempt to do the purge again, if maybe that was the problem?


I cut about an 8-inch line that I just looped from the return to the supply on the filter itself, but I also pulled the fuse. I read somewhere that pulling the fuse while doing the purge would assure that the engine would not get flooded with fuel. If I loop lit like I did, does this mean that I do not have to pull the lift pump fuse?
When you purge a PD the in-take pump will continue to pump. If you route it back to the return line you don't need to disable it.
The idea of the purge is to run the product straight thru the injectors, it's your call if you think you've run enough of it thru there.
 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
Well, now I am convinced that my car is allergic to Diesel Purge. :D I gave it one last attempt, this time leaving the #28 lift pump fuse in. I hooked the entire contraption up again, and within a minute it stalled. After I unhooked everything and put it back to normal, I primed the system half a dozen times using VCDS. Tried cranking it and it still did not want to start. Waited about ten minutes, cranked again, nothing. Waited about half-an-hour, cranked again for about 20 seconds and it finally started. I'm at a loss guys to what may have gone wrong as to why it did not accept the purge. Here are a couple pics I took of the setup. Thanks for all the help.


 

mjydrafter

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Location
dsm, ia
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2004 Jetta Wagon
You might try putting the jar of DP up higher.

If it was me (this is what I did), find a bottle that you can put your DP in and hang it up. That way you have gravity helping rather than making the tandem pump siphon the DP out of your bottle.

If you want to come over sometime and try my setup shoot me a PM and we can make it happen. I have done it twice and both times it worked just like it was supposed too.:)
 

gatz

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Oct 29, 2005
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Windsor, CT
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2005 Mk4 Golf TDI PD, 2006 MkV Golf GTI
I don't think height matters. I put my DP container down in a crevice so the tandem pump was actually pulling it up. No issues. I would check for cracked hoses & air intrusion.

Verify your tee is working properly too. I had one completely fail closed and it would basically block fuel. The confusing thing was it happened at the same time I changed the filter, so maybe the stress of removing it damaged it.
 

Mike_04GolfTDI

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I can't see very well in the picture, but are the tubes very well sealed in the container? You need to let air into the container or a vacuum will be created as the diesel purge fluid is consumed.
 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
I can't see very well in the picture, but are the tubes very well sealed in the container? You need to let air into the container or a vacuum will be created as the diesel purge fluid is consumed.
I did put a little breather hole in the top, which was made with a 1/8" drill bit. Do you suppose it is not letting enough air through? The first time I did not have this green lid on it. That's how the hose fell out.
 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
You might try putting the jar of DP up higher.

If it was me (this is what I did), find a bottle that you can put your DP in and hang it up. That way you have gravity helping rather than making the tandem pump siphon the DP out of your bottle.

If you want to come over sometime and try my setup shoot me a PM and we can make it happen. I have done it twice and both times it worked just like it was supposed too.:)
Would like to get together, undoubtedly two minds are greater than one, but I am a bit leery of attempting this again. The car wasn't running badly before. It recently surpassed 100,000 miles and figured that it could benefit from this treatment. I just don't want to stress my car anymore than it already has been by trying it again, it not working and then for whatever reason not starting. :(
 

mjydrafter

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dsm, ia
TDI
2004 Jetta Wagon
No problem, just wanted to throw it out there. I have a pretty simple set up, but it seems to work. We can even prime the lift pump, when we are ready to start it, so it starts up right away without excessive cranking. If you're so inclined. I do it that way, so I'm not stressing the ignition cylinder/lock.
 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
Wait, I think I may have figured out what happened. If you look at the below pic, notice that there is no Diesel Purge in the lines, instead it is just filled with air. So, once I started the car up all of that air was sucked into the fuel lines, consequently causing the car to die mid-purge. If I siphon the Diesel Purge through the clear tubing before I connect to the fuel lines this should resolve the issue, right? Also, does anybody suppose I did any major damage to my car by allowing that much air into the fuel system?

 

jmarvin

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Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Location
Des Moines, IA
TDI
2004 JettaTDI
Well, I successfully started and finished the purge without any issues. Turns out all the air in the lines was the problem. This time I eliminated my whole setup from the pic above, aside from maintaining the loop from the feed to the return on the filter. I used just my existing fuel lines and stuck them inside my glass container, primed the system with two turns of the key to the ON position, and then started it up. Revved at varying RPM's for the duration of the purge which took about 15 minutes. The liquid did not change color at all the whole time throughout the process, so I take it my injectors were fairly clean. Happy that I figured it out and was able to get it taken care of. Thanks guys for all your help!
 
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